CSV try III Ian is NLF larry is Allies csv_lgf_v1.0.sce

[larryfulkerson]

Here's what it looks like in T73 which is December of 1970, during which I loaded a lot of bombs on planes at

Bien Hoa six days a week, 12 hours a day. I was on the day shift which handled a lot of MK82's and napalm and WP

rockets and of course bullets for the machine gun in the nose of the A-37. I went to an AOL near

Saigon and worked the night shift there for about a month loading WP rockets and flares for an FAC group

working in the HoBo Woods area. They didn't have low-light equipment yet to see at night so they dropped flares

instead and then when they sighted a lucrative target they would mark it with a WP rocket and the CS crew flying F-100's

would drop their MK82's on the WP mark. Or the FAC would give them an offset in a certain direction for a certain

distance. And I have no idea how they did that at night. Much practice I suppose.

[devoncop]

Turn 74

January 1971.......EVV remains at 80 and VP's at +21 but the newstring indicates ARVN deswertions are increasing as the ARVN troops get dispiritied...all good [:)]

This turn Larry launched more attacks on the NVA lines with a great deal of success but again they mostly held in Quang Tri and the north western portion of Thua Thien.

I am left hoping Larry kept his head down at Bien Hoa as this turn coincidentally the VC rocketeers make a welcome return to the fray within range of the airbase and wipe out all planes stationed there.....about 15 Supersabres and 30 F5's.

In the north the NVA artillery gets busy again and eliminates the 2nd bttn's opf both the 14th and 18th Infantry Regiments attached to the US 25th Division as well as the 1st Brigade HQ.

In a classic case of some folks never learning I try a land attck in central South Vietnam with a full strength NVA regiment against a Regional Militia battalion and lose 14% of my strength without scratching the ARVN thanks to US air cover.....memo to self.......the definition of stupidity is repeating the same actions in the same circumstances and expecting a different result[:-]

The VC presence is being rapidly whittled away in the south by multiple ARVN units so if a few more could desert that would be helpful.......

[devoncop]

Turn 75.March 1971

As the EVV reaches 83 and VP's tick up to +24 a newstring announces that due to instability in the South Vietnamese Govt the draft is proving problematic.......now that's what I like to hear !

There have been some heavy hits on remaining VC in South Vietnam last turn so again the NVA have to do the heavy lifting. Artillery takes out two more battalions of the US 25th Inf Divn and some ARVN militia holding Quang Tri city allowing the NVA to reoccupy it for about the 5th time in the game ......It only grants 1 VP but with the VC being hurt in the south every VP helps.

The MiGs fail to fly this turn so US interdiction hits the NVA and VC badly.

[larryfulkerson]

There's a new theater option this turn. Well, actually it COULD have been there in some previous turn but I look at the

TO's so seldom that I wouldn't have known it until just now. At any rate, there's a new TO in that I can now offer

the NVA a cease fire. I have no idea if Ian would go for it or not. I'm not sure it's in my best interest to do that but

I thought it kinky to ask.

[devoncop]

Turn 76...February 1971

So there appears to be huge upheaval in the South Vietnamese government....

I get a notice that there has been a military coup (caused by the high EVV) and the notes show a combat shock penalty for ARVN units which is cool. The new puppet government then sends me a ceasefire proposal....hmmm.

Looking at the design notes there are both problems and benefits in this for me. Obviously apart from air interdiction it allows me to spawn VC without them being attacked ( any break of the ceasefire costs 20VP's) until manpower is exhausted ....they can continue pacification during that time....on the downside it causes an immediate reduction in EVV if I accept and I see tipping the EVV up over 95 as my best chance for a win as the Americans clear off !

The EVV was 80 this turn and VP's increased to +25 as VC activity stepped up. This is nicely timed as the monsoon also resumes.

Because of the effects of the coup on the ARVN I decide to risk some assaults on them with both NVA and VC in the South and apart from a couple of failures there are a number of Border Bttns eliminated as well as a Special Forces Battalion near the Cambodian border.

In Quang Tri the ARVN have pulled back again South apart from the US 7th Armoured Bttn of 25th Division so this is surrounded and repeatedly shelled to good effect.

A decision is made in Hanoi to reject the ceasefire for now,........

[devoncop]

Turn 77......April 1971

EVV ticks back up to 81 and VP's move up to +27 with VC activity in 5 provinces.

Things definitely looking up for the NLF at present as Larry reports that following the coup in Saigon most of his airforce and ARVN were in reorganisation last turn which gave the VC a free hand. This is borne out as attacks by weak VC battalions succeed in wiping out several more demoralised ARVN Border units and artillery in Quang Tri and Thua Thien in the North destroys an entire ARVN Regiment (the 42nd) and inflicts heavy damage on another before a proficiency test fail brings things to a premature halt.

The VC now have a considerable presence in the central provinces of South Vietnam though presence in the Delta is minimal.
The monsoon continuies........

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: devoncop
The new puppet government...sends me a ceasefire proposal....

...I see tipping the EVV up over 95 as my best chance for a win as the Americans clear off !

And of course Ian sees through my subterfuge and makes the correct choise. It's just a matter of time now. And the thought occurs to me that the Allied side isn't supposed to "win". I've never played a CSV game in which they did. I'd like to see such a game. I'm still not sure where I went wrong in this game. Or if I didn't do anything "wrong" per se but things are supposed to turn out this way more or less. I'd like to hear a discussion about this you guys.

[devoncop]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

ORIGINAL: devoncop
The new puppet government...sends me a ceasefire proposal....

...I see tipping the EVV up over 95 as my best chance for a win as the Americans clear off !

And of course Ian sees through my subterfuge and makes the correct choise. It's just a matter of time now. And the thought occurs to me that the Allied side isn't supposed to "win". I've never played a CSV game in which they did. I'd like to see such a game. I'm still not sure where I went wrong in this game. Or if I didn't do anything "wrong" per se but things are supposed to turn out this way more or less. I'd like to hear a discussion about this you guys.

Cunning Larry.....very cunning. You have no idea how close I came to accepting the ceasefire[:)]

I have a few ideas about possible strategies to beat the VC but I am sure they would all crash and burn badly ! I

Maybe we need to play a reverse fixture when this one finishes....and this one isn't over yet by the way !

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: devoncop
Cunning Larry.....very cunning. You have no idea how close I came to accepting the ceasefire[:)]

I have a few ideas about possible strategies to beat the VC but I am sure they would all crash and burn badly !

Maybe we need to play a reverse fixture when this one finishes....and this one isn't over yet by the way !

I'd like to see your ideas implemented for sure.....Yeah, I'd LIKE to be the NLF forces and see if I can't give you a good game. Meanwhile, we can continue this one if you'd like.

[devoncop]

Hi Larry

That sounds great....let's play our current game til it's conclusion so I have a target !

All the best

Ian

[larryfulkerson]

I went to look at my theater options and I find a duplicate entry and I'm wondering what happens if I chose both of them this turn? We might need to find out to see if it's a bug or a feature.

[devoncop]

Turn 78

EVV=81........VP's remain steady at +27

The NVA offensive continues in the north and two more battalions of the unfortunate 25th US Division evaporate as well as the artillery component along with some ARVN Border troops.

Despite US interdiction restarting some small NVA battalions helping the VC in the south manage to overrun another 4 Border units helping to give more space for the VC to operate.

Once again their is little VC capability in the Delta but what there is blows a few bridges.

The US presence seems much reduced in the central provinces and I am hoping this continues with VC territory expanding.

[devoncop]

Turn 79

EVV=83.............VP's jump to +30

The jump in VP's reflects no less than 10 provinces now recording new VC gains which is the best so far as the ARVN is apparently only slowly recovering from the coup disruption which is hampering its activity.

Most of the action aside from continuing infiltration takes place in the north as a planned push towards Hue takes place and considerable counter battery fire occurs to cover the advance. A large number of SP Guns and heavy howitzers are knocked out just outside of Hue from the 9th Artillery and also the 25th infantry Division. NVA troops are now within 15 Km of the city.

Manpower for the VC has become more of a problem lately with less reinforcements arriving reflecting both the wartime losses and the number of active units actually present in South Vietnam so I have taken a Theatre Option diverting manpower from the NVA to the VC.

[Hyding]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

ORIGINAL: devoncop
The new puppet government...sends me a ceasefire proposal....

...I see tipping the EVV up over 95 as my best chance for a win as the Americans clear off !

And of course Ian sees through my subterfuge and makes the correct choise. It's just a matter of time now. And the thought occurs to me that the Allied side isn't supposed to "win". I've never played a CSV game in which they did. I'd like to see such a game. I'm still not sure where I went wrong in this game. Or if I didn't do anything "wrong" per se but things are supposed to turn out this way more or less. I'd like to hear a discussion about this you guys.

Well one problem you have is you are being hit by ARVN morale, coup and desertion problems that are not supposed to be occurring until after US withdrawal (EEV 100).

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: Hyding
Well one problem you have is you are being hit by ARVN morale, coup and desertion problems that are not supposed to be occurring until after US withdrawal (EEV 100).

I know, and it's a Yuge problem too. I can't get any units to do anything useful.

[devoncop]

Turn 80

EVV jumps to 86 and VP's jump to +41 as the tide appears to be turning towards the NLF.......

The coup does indeed seem to have crippled the ARVN whose loyalty to the new government seems tenuous. VC activity is spiking all over the country and the ARVN appear paralysed. This turn new activity is recorded in 12 new provinces in the south and both Pleiku in Pontum Province ...which is largely now VC controlled.....and Sa Dec in the Delta are overrun by VC units. The VP total has now tipped into a marginal victory for me and Hue is also under a lot of pressure in Thua Thien in the north. The Artillery concentrated in Hue by the US gets decimated this turn before a proficiency check failure.

I have sent a diplo message to larry to see if he wants to call it a day and we can get cracking on a reverse fixture so he can have some fun with the Commies ! It may be he sees the situation is recoverable.....we shall see.

As the NVA/VC I have found the scenario to be very enjoyable as in many ways although manpower is often weak and you feel short handed you have total initiative as to where and when to strike......I think maybe the US/ARVN side is a lot more frustrating [:)]

[larryfulkerson]

Hey Ian:
I saw your note above about maybe quitting this game right now.
Let me say this about that: If we quit now you won't have the
joy of overrunning Saigon itself. That's an automatic victory
to own that hex remember. Go for it, I say.

[devoncop]

Hi Larry

We fight on ! [:)]

[devoncop]

Turn 81...July 1971

This may be game over as EVV reaches 88 and VP's increase again.

Larry has sent me a diplo message suggesting we end this game now as the situation now seems very difficult for the US/ARVN and as I play through this turn the NVA storm into Hue and decimate the garrison which would add a further net +12 to the VP total.

It has been a great game and I am now going to try my luck as the US......If I can last as long as turn 81 I will be happy !

[Raindem]

Great game guys. Well played on both sides. It's a bit more difficult to win from the Allied side, but I've seen it done several times.

As for the double option in the Theater Option list, that is indeed a bug. There should only be one there for economic aid. I'll look into it.

Curt