Tyronec vs BrianG. 12.03

[Sammy5IsAlive]

Good to see you back posting HLYA [:)] - you've been missed! Are you back playing also or just observing?

I think given the big changes in the current patch Brian is probably sensible in playing a more conservative 'force preservation' game and waiting to see if opportunities arise from things like the performance of the Axis supply network in mud/blizzard; enhanced defence of the big urban centres at the typical 'end point' of the 41 offensive; and the possibility that a higher experience Soviet army could cause bigger problems in the winter blizzard - all of which are unknowns at the moment I think.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive

Good to see you back posting HLYA [:)] - you've been missed! Are you back playing also or just observing?

I think given the big changes in the current patch Brian is probably sensible in playing a more conservative 'force preservation' game and waiting to see if opportunities arise from things like the performance of the Axis supply network in mud/blizzard; enhanced defence of the big urban centres at the typical 'end point' of the 41 offensive; and the possibility that a higher experience Soviet army could cause bigger problems in the winter blizzard - all of which are unknowns at the moment I think.

Thank you. I am back. Much needed break.


Yes, I agree with the force preservation. Brian will have masses of men coming in and will be able to move every single one of them by train every turn to get them where he needs to have them. Unlike the old days where they would have to walk to the front over multiple weeks they will be at the front same turn or the 2nd week easily since there is rail for units and rail for industry in abundance. I have played two games as the Soviets in 12.3 and it is a very fast buildup for the Soviets. Tyronec will have a mass influx of units, not to mention the units have better exp and morale gain than in 11.3. Also of note that when Soviet Armor division transform into brigades they "don't" loose exp and morale. This is huge and makes the brigades really nasty during the blizzard. Tyronec is doing very well and hope to see him capture both big cities.

[Sammy5IsAlive]

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive

Good to see you back posting HLYA [:)] - you've been missed! Are you back playing also or just observing?

I think given the big changes in the current patch Brian is probably sensible in playing a more conservative 'force preservation' game and waiting to see if opportunities arise from things like the performance of the Axis supply network in mud/blizzard; enhanced defence of the big urban centres at the typical 'end point' of the 41 offensive; and the possibility that a higher experience Soviet army could cause bigger problems in the winter blizzard - all of which are unknowns at the moment I think.

Thank you. I am back. Much needed break.


Yes, I agree with the force preservation. Brian will have masses of men coming in and will be able to move every single one of them by train every turn to get them where he needs to have them. Unlike the old days where they would have to walk to the front over multiple weeks they will be at the front same turn or the 2nd week easily since there is rail for units and rail for industry in abundance. I have played two games as the Soviets in 12.3 and it is a very fast buildup for the Soviets. Tyronec will have a mass influx of units, not to mention the units have better exp and morale gain than in 11.3. Also of note that when Soviet Armor division transform into brigades they "don't" loose exp and morale. This is huge and makes the brigades really nasty during the blizzard. Tyronec is doing very well and hope to see him capture both big cities.

Good to hear. Hope the break has treated you well.

One brief question (I don't want to sidetrack the thread too much). I'd like to play vs another human in the future (probably when WITE2 comes out). But at the moment the barrier is that I am a chronically slow player. Do you have any tips on how you get through games so quick? Is it a self-fulfilling thing i.e. if you force yourself to play quickly you have more opportunity to make mistakes and learn from them and work out what areas need a bit more care? Or shortcuts in terms of managing the UI? Or am I just born dopey and doomed to take 20x as long to do the exact same things as other players do [:(] ?!

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: Sammy5IsAlive
One brief question (I don't want to sidetrack the thread too much). I'd like to play vs another human in the future (probably when WITE2 comes out). But at the moment the barrier is that I am a chronically slow player. Do you have any tips on how you get through games so quick? Is it a self-fulfilling thing i.e. if you force yourself to play quickly you have more opportunity to make mistakes and learn from them and work out what areas need a bit more care? Or shortcuts in terms of managing the UI? Or am I just born dopey and doomed to take 20x as long to do the exact same things as other players do [:(] ?!

Being a slow player is quite common and not something to be ashamed of. Yes it is frustrating for a faster player. But then the obvious thing is to be upfront about it and match up with someone of the same speed of which there are many. I know many players who may not be slow per se, but with work, kids and family it is a hobby they can only do occasionally every other weekend or so. Others do just like to ponder their next moves and for them that is part of the fun. And to some extent being fast usually means you do have to ignore some of the micromanagement the game allows you to do - so that is a choice to forego it too.

So definitely not dopey - just you have to match yourself with others like you. Or if you do want to go faster decide which elements of gameplay you will forego.

[tyronec]

Are you willing to post the OOB and loss screen?

Will do when I get the next move back.
Am playing this game very much in the dark as to where the play balance is and what recent patches have done to both sides, just pushing forwards as fast as I can and will see what happens.

As to playing fast, I have always been a fast player right back from playing Chess at school. If someone wants to play at one turn a week/fortnight or whatever it is easy enough, just post for an opponent with your criteria.

[MagicMissile]

ORIGINAL: tyronec

As to playing fast, I have always been a fast player right back from playing Chess at school.

That is funny I was exactly the same when I played chess when I was young. Had no patience [:)]. But time matters as in chess if you spend twice the amount to think you will probably have an advantage so yes I guess it is good to find a player with the same playing style.

Sorry for off topic.

/MM

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: tyronec

Are you willing to post the OOB and loss screen?

Will do when I get the next move back.
Am playing this game very much in the dark as to where the play balance is and what recent patches have done to both sides, just pushing forwards as fast as I can and will see what happens.

As to playing fast, I have always been a fast player right back from playing Chess at school. If someone wants to play at one turn a week/fortnight or whatever it is easy enough, just post for an opponent with your criteria.

Thank you Tyronec. After playing the Soviets in 12.3 twice the growth rate seems much faster than normal.

[tyronec]

Losses up to end T9

[tyronec]

Leningrad. Attacks went OK and can hopefully clear the swamp next turn and then assault across the river T11. I tried assaulting the fort with regiments, 3 attacks did nothing at all, will give up and wait for it to be isolated and surrender that way.

Below Lake Ilmen had several failed attacks and didn't get my hoped for pocket; should have done better here. At least they are pulling back from the river so minimal hold up of the FBD.

Moscow. One line of Level 3 forts but looks like the Soviets haven't got their defences fully up yet, so ready to begin to assault. Have done an HQB in the hope that can get a couple of hexes forwards next turn.

AGS. Have got too many Panzers here, should maybe have sent another Corps further north. Anyway as they are here will see if I can have a go at taking Stalino early and degrade some Soviet industry.

Crimea. Some defence of Sevastapol but doesn't look like their best units. Two corps lining up for the assault, will see if I can get it cleared before winter; new rules permitting !

Soviets did too well with bombing last turn against me rather spread out forces so am concentrating the Luftwaffe at just the three spearheads.

[tyronec]

We have upgraded to 12.04.
Position at the start of the turn.

Leningrad, not sure whether to attack into Leningrad or push North and cut off all the ports. Too long since I have played this game and finding it difficult to evaluate the chances of each.

Moscow. A few options but am going to have to go through those 3-level forts somehow.

[tyronec]

Final position.

Leningrad. Had a look at going North but the Soviet defences looked too strong. Instead manage a ZOC pocket with the guys coming up from the South, nearly got it closed off. There have to be some prospects here next turn, can work up the East bank of the river or cut deeper in and link up with the Finns further East.

Moscow. No problems breaking through the fort line and do the small pocket as intended. Am happy to go forwards just a hex or two a turn while the FBD catches up.

Stalino. Soviets had a lot of good units and didn't get too far, I moved the lead SS mot back a hex cause he would have got beaten up there. That is all my fuel used up so will have to wait for the infantry.

Sevastapol. Thanks to the patch the first fort falls, even had a long shot at Sevastapol. Now on the slow attacks to take the port.

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: tyronec
Leningrad, not sure whether to attack into Leningrad or push North and cut off all the ports. Too long since I have played this game and finding it difficult to evaluate the chances of each.

In v1.11.03 I would have said crossing the Neva was a better chance there than getting to Sviritisa. And anything the supply changes in v1.12 should have made that even more so?

[tyronec]

Have committed myself to going for the Finnish border, may be a mistake !

AGN. Had several failed attacks and fail to seal the pocket from last turn, heavy going through the swamps and had one critical attack that dropped off.

AGC. Clear the pocket from last turn and make another small one. Happy enough to go slowly to allow the FBD to catch up and get some MPs with the Panzers.

AGS. Just move up to Stalino, no attacks and Panzers resting. Clear the other hex outside Sevastapol

[HardLuckYetAgain]

Your pocket looks like another two turns to clear? I wish you the best but I think this is going to be close in the North. Gotta love the cliff hangers.

[tyronec]

Start of the turn.

Two Panzer units hold off attacks to protect the pockets.
Soviets have pulled back from Stalino.

[tyronec]

End of turn.

AGN. Good move for me. Get the pocket properly sealed off and 4 divisions pushed back into it, just one routed away. 4 hexes advance towards the Finnish line, just 4 to go. And if the Soviets attempt a strong defence they risk being pocketed.
Seal off another stack, it probably won't hold but may be able to pocket more next turn.
Supply is OK as it id coming from the rail line past L. Ilmen, most of my HQs are around 10 hexes away.
Am confident I can Isolate Leningrad before mud, and then mop them up during the snow turns if need be.
Never had AGN go this way before, interesting...

AGC. Am a bit low on units here with so many troops up North, however get 3 hexes forwards and nearly make another pocket. My left hook around Moscow is distinctly weak. Am concerned that I may not have enough strength to take Moscow in time, need to get the Panzers from Leningrad down sooner rather than later.

AGS. Pocket the two units left behind in Stalino. Think I am doing the right thing in pocketing everything available even if it slows the advance down. Panzers will have a lot of MPs next turn so will see if there is anything on offer. Brian has been good at knowing where the Panzers are most of the time and keeping clear.

AGA. Two attacks on Sevastapol, maybe two turns to go... Am not sure if I should try some hasty attacks next turn with the garrison getting weaker, might get more fort reductions that way.

[redrum68]

AGN is looking much better now with that fairly good sized pocket sealed off east of Novgorod and the threat to pocket the Soviet units along the Volkhov River as your drive to capture Sviritsa. Unless he brings significant reinforcements to that area, you can probably capture it in 2-3 turns. I would probably send all the panzers out of AGN starting next turn or the following turn as they aren't really useful or needed as the remaining terrain towards Sviritsa is almost all swamps and heavy woods.

How many engineers and artillery SUs are you using on Sevastopol?

[Telemecus]

I am not sure to be honest - those last hexes to Sviritsa can be hell to take if a good Soviet player wants to hold them. And that is a good Soviet player. I would still say easier to cross the Neva and capture Osinovets. But either way the panzers would still be better used elsewhere now.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

I am not sure to be honest - those last hexes to Sviritsa can be hell to take if a good Soviet player wants to hold them. And that is a good Soviet player. I would still say it easier to cross the Neva and capture Osinovets. But either way the panzers would still be better used elsewhere now.

I tend to agree with you Telemecus on that. From the looks of the map with the current recon, I would argue that BrianG pressed the end turn button too early leaving key hexes underdefended and other hexes over defended. But that is just me and maybe BrianG has something better planned or just putting up a delaying action.

[tyronec]

AGN. Two hexes forwards, two more to go. Am hoping I can do it in two turns. Made a mis move this go, should have had an Mot in the empty swamp hex but moved the wrong one first.
Three Panzer Corps shifting South, am keeping one here.
Seal the small pocket of 2 units.
Have failed to clear the good rail line going South to Moscow which is a shame.

AGC. Have given up trying to make a pocket South of the city and instead just bludgeon forwards. Do a small pocket to the North, Soviets have some chance of breaking it.
I seem to lose a lot of the battles where an exposed unit is sealing the pocket, am guessing their actual CV is less than the display value due to lack of supplies or whatever. Does that make sense ?

AGS. Had 3 Panzer Corps with stacks of fuel so make use of them and charge forwards. Have really got my play balance wrong, too many good Panzer divisions down here with only fuel to do anything one turn in three.

Sevastapol. Make 2 deliberate and two hasty attacks, one of which fails. The hasties are not worth is as only minimal fort reduction. With some luck should get it next turn.