WP2 Breakout Session - Production / Repair

[stjeand]

I am hoping go start one of these each week...time permitting...

SO to start lets discuss

PRODUCTION / REPAIR



PRODUCTION

I do not have a lot of issues with the way production works overall...but

Issues

Cut off locations. They should not be allowed to provide resources to the country since they are not connected to the capital.
Think of Paris being surrounded...then ONLY Paris's points should be in the build.
It would be nice to take the other points and be able to use them for repair of units outside the capital...though not sure how that would be to program.
Think of Stalingrad when it was undersiege and still building tanks though not sure if it was surrounded.

I would also love a breakdown of the points. Say the country has 200 points...but how did they get those?
A simple breakdown, something like.
In country resources x multiplier
Imported resources from Allies.
Captured resources.

I would also like the ability to disable Allies from sending points.
IF you want them take them...if not then don't.

I would like the ability to disable individual locations from sending points.
For Example...Germany captures London...that would mean 3 MM are travelling every turn to Germany...it would be nice to be able to disable that if desired.


Improvements

Shipyards
I dislike that they are "mobile". They should be in a single/split up amoung location(s) and able to be damaged by air bombing, similar to oil bombing.
This would slow repair as well as units currently in production.
This might be a bit of a challenge but would be a nice to have.

I would like to see armor and aircraft factories.
Country should be able to build them up, similar to shipyards...start with enough and perhaps some would be in the build queue to appear on specific dates.
They would be able to be bombed like oil to slow production.
What they create would be required to build units that use those resources.

Armor example (Based on divisions)
Breakthrough Mech 2 Armor
Heavy Mech 3 Armor
Breakthrough 4 Armor
Heavy Armor 6 Armor

Air Example (Not sure what to base this on yet)
Ground Attack 1 Air per Str point
Tactical Bomber 1.25 Air per Str point
Strategic Bomber 2 Air per Str point

Each turn the country gets X Armor / Air and they are not lost turn to turn, they build for furture production.


A possible option for building using the same concept for Infantry

You build X Infantry steps, Y Armor Steps, Z Air Steps.
The cost is for them is say 1939 base cost for a repair / reinforce step. So for a 1939 Infantry I believe it would be 4...if I remember correctly

They are then used to create units / repair
Add cost for tech level and unit organization creation (UNIT HQ, Supply, Logistics and so on) / reinforce units (added cost for tech level)
Infantry would require X Infantry to create and Y PP for tech level and command and control.
Armor/Mech would require X Infantry, Y Armor to create and Z PP and command and control.
Air would require X Infantry, Y Airframes to create and Z PP and command and control.

I am a fan of each version getting a little more complex around specific things.



REPAIR

Issues
It is always a battle to figure out how many points I need and how to upgrade specific units over other units, land, air and sea.
I don't really want to have a queue that you put units in, in order...but I guess that would be an option too.
Many times I want to repair an air unit and then a specific land unit but that is not possible.
IT would be great to have a manual repair option for those that wish to use it.
And still leave the automatic with a button click to complete.

You would just have to force the player to use up ALL the points they can that they put in the repair option.

SO if a player puts 100 points toward repair...
They must use as many points as they can until nothing is left that can be repaired.

NOW this would not be the case if using Infantry, Armor and Airframe steps. You could only repair so much per turn.
A country does not have infinite tanks and air to repair just those things.

Naval repairs...

This will be discussed later but reparing a CV from crippled to fully functional in a month is insane, when it can take 3 months to get an armored corps fully operational.
I think the naval units need to have strength like land units and this would solve that issue.

Example
CV = 30
BB = 25
CVL = 20
CA = 15
DD = 10
Sub = 5

Certain ships could even be stronger or weaker just due to their nature.
i.e.
Yamato might be 30 for a BB...Iowa might be 27/28...
As well as individual attack and defense stats...


Think of this...
IF a CV was crippled...say it took 25 points damage. It would actually require a year to repair, depending on turn length that is. Yes it could still fight but...at a reduced capacity.
Cost would also be low for countries that find it extremely difficult to repair ships.

[kklemmick]

Frankly one of the things I love about Warplan is that is just the right level of abstraction for me. I realize that other people might feel differently, but if I wanted more complexity I'd play a Gary Grigsby game (which I do periodically). So in general any suggestion that adds complexity to the game I would say no to unless it added some serious strategic value.

To that end I don't really see worrying about cut off locations as adding a lot of value. If a country is getting stuff cut off, it's likely to lose those locations in a few turns anyway, so it doesn't feel like that would add much strategic value. Similarly to the idea of type specific factories, although that would in fact add some realism as it generally took quite some time to retool factories to switch production. But once again, this is added complexity without much strategic value IMO.

+1 to the idea of being able to disable convoy lines though. Having a convoy of 1 PP that is being bombed each turn for 1 MM and almost never provides that resource is silly. Why bother to send it if it's just going to cause a MM loss?
+1 to a breakdown of where your PP is coming from as well. To this day I don't know if capturing a 5 PP city actually provides that 1 PP right away or, after several turns, or after the country surrendered. I've never looked closely enough to figure that out.

I think Alvaro already plans to put manual upgrade/reinforcement into WP2. I think this would be a great improvement, in addition to the per-turn allocation.

[AlvaroSousa]

There will be lots of good changes.

Or maybe go simpler. You roll dice for produciton.
Germany gets 6d6
USA 12d6
RUSSIA 5d6
etc etc. That's your PPs.

Just kidding.

[stjeand]

Well personally I like to add a little complexity with each iteration...though not so much that it makes the game so complex you take hours to do a turn.
A little more complexity to the production would not hurt.

I don't want to get down to training pilots and naval officers but having to plan to build armor or aircraft does not seem to crazy.

Though could be just me.

[kklemmick]

Or maybe go simpler. You roll dice for produciton.
Germany gets 6d6
USA 12d6
RUSSIA 5d6

Lol, lol, lol.. Yeah.. How about we simplify everything so that we roll one D6 at the game start and high roll wins?

[Nirosi]

Or maybe go simpler. You roll dice for produciton.
Germany gets 6d6
USA 12d6
RUSSIA 5d6

Lol, lol, lol.. Yeah.. How about we simplify everything so that we roll one D6 at the game start and high roll wins?

I would do so much better