Industry

[Ambassador]

When all you have is a hammer, the hammer becomes a kitchen tool and a first aid implement…

If indeed brutal shock attacks on the first turn lead to more industry being disabled because engineers are not disabled, it could slow down the Japanese onslaught of the first three or four months and encourage players to be a bit more deliberate in their invasions. The number of AAR depicting an ahistorically fast expansion is tremendous.

[RangerJoe]

When all you have is a hammer, the hammer becomes a kitchen tool and a first aid implement…

If indeed brutal shock attacks on the first turn lead to more industry being disabled because engineers are not disabled, it could slow down the Japanese onslaught of the first three or four months and encourage players to be a bit more deliberate in their invasions. The number of AAR depicting an ahistorically fast expansion is tremendous.

Well then, a strategy might be for a fast expansion to smash the enemy industry by capturing bases with the Heavy Industry and any aircraft factories, keep the bases to get the supplies but also build your main defensive positions in the rear. The aircraft factories become vehicle factories if I remember correctly but do not help the Allies. So target regions with lots of industry to trash in the area. Be ready to retreat fast.

[Yaab]

Contrary to popular opinion, I believe the number of engineers present has a major effect on the likelihood of industry destruction. Notice in your combat report: " Engineers: 421 destroyed, 0 disabled." That is a big number, and in my experience, almost certain to produce some destruction of assets. Preventing the base forces from northern Malaysia from reaching Singapore is probably just as helpful, if not moreso, than preventing the Indian and Sihk units from reaching Singapore, or destroying these base forces peacemeal before they can reach Singapore. When I have been able to do this, I have prevented significant damage to Singapore's facitilites. When I have not, I have experienced losses to industry.

The real question is whether disabled engineers contribute to the die roll and whether disruption, supply levels, and fatigue have any effect on their ability to destroy economic assets.

Whatever the case, you can expect as Japan to spend 100K-150K supply rebuilding crucial infrastructure in almost every game (in addition to the 150 oil wells at Miri that begin disabled). Rebuilding the shipyard and heavy industry at Singapore will not break the bank, provided other important economic assets are taken with limited damage. As others have mentioned, Balikpapan and Palembang are really the most important, and complete destruction at Palembang is catastrophic to the Japanese war effort. You should be able to recover from anything else.

I had this thought yesterday.

I had reported several instances of BFs in Malaya with too many engineer vehicles here:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 9#p5115319

Now, I normally thought this would result in higher forts in Malaya bases, buy yesterday it dawned on me it would also mean more industry damage in Malaya battles. Johore Bahru, Singapore, Malacca, Kuala Lumpur - all have some res or indsutry. A total wipe-out of Singapore's industry is probably a given if Allied player puts all those bugged BFs in Singapore.

[dasboot1960]

A few of things occurred to me...

What difficulty level settings? Would that have an impact?

Is all of this data coming vs AI? I didn't see any statement of a PvP.

If indeed a driving factor is # of engineers remaining at surrender or loss, why not as defender set all ENG types to 'rest'? I am assuming that setting them to 'reserve' would allow them to get drawn into combat and thus be at risk.

On the dark personal side, I hope this occurs in PvP, and my current IJ opponent suffers such a fate. He is thrashing my eyeballs out...

[Heclapar]

Deliberate or shock attack has no (direct) effect on the result. The only thing that matters is how many engineers, or more precicely how much engineering power (since engineer vehicles count as 5) the defender has and the exp of the units that house these devices. From there there are three possibilities based on rolls: no destruction, normal destruction, normal destruction times 10.

[Yaab]

Yes, but there should be some sort of check of engineer numbers vs industry numbers.

A base with a total of 400 industry points (100 LI, 250 Res, 50 oil) shouldn't be wrecked by an equivalent of 40 engineer squads (10 eng, 10 combat eng, 4 eng vehicles).The code should check relative power of remaining engineers vs base's industry points total.

Singapore in stock GCs has a total of 198 industry points. Having an equivalent 421 engineer squads survive the battle should drastically damage the industry.

[Heclapar]

It does check the engineering value plus a base flat value versus the industry and facilities (port,airfield level) and then based on that a percentage of every industry gets disabled