So how are the Russians now?

Warplan is a World War 2 simulation engine. It is a balance of realism and playability incorporating the best from 50 years of World War 2 board wargaming.

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PanzerMike
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by PanzerMike »

gingerbread wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 12:54 pm You could spell the U.K. capital "Londres", to even things out. ;)
That will irk the English players for sure, hehehehe
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PanzerMike
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

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North Africa
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by ncc1701e »

gingerbread wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 12:54 pm You could spell the U.K. capital "Londres", to even things out. ;)
Indeed, Londres is perfect. In 1066, William the Conqueror invaded England, leading an army of Normans to victory over the Anglo-Saxon forces.

This will be Londres or nothing. :D
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by PanzerMike »

An impression of the units. Not much has changed. Just a ribbon for Mech and Armor.
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aaminoff
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by aaminoff »

This map mod looks very nifty but shouldnt all this interesting info be in a thread in the Mods folder?

Also, do you have any plans to modify the weather probabilities?
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stjeand
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by stjeand »

Be careful adding all the ports especially Bardia.

It will make it much easier for the Allies to take it as they will have strong supply all around the port.
That change only benefits the Allies attacking...
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by CHINCHIN »

It's clear that the Russians are stronger, but the axis is still winning. Two mirror games with Svent, I think we have a very similar level, and four victories for the axis.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by AlvaroSousa »

When are the Allies acting? 1943 Italy, 1944 France?
Uboat war? how many boats by 41 and 43?
Strategic bombing PP or OP?
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stjeand
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by stjeand »

I am only on my third game after a long hiatus and a LOT of forgetting.

Russians seem pretty good at the moment but I have not played into 42 yet...both initial games were won by my side.
In a new one but it is an anomaly since I lost Egypt and the middle east...Working on addressing that now.

It could matter what you build as the Russians. Maybe players are not building correctly? Hard to say since I have not tested all the possibilities. But with all the conversions to armies they get a lot of them really fast.

I tried something different only building 1939 assault so that they would have NO issues merging. Had problems in my last game with having 1939, 1940 and 1941 half armies and not wanting to lose their upgrade to merge. Was a pain.

Did the Axis clearly win early, 1941 push just to deep?
If that was going well did the Allies strike early? I normally do IF the Axis are "winning" in Russia...to pull back some of their armor...especially Aug / Sept so that rain helps.

For me the weather is still an issue.
Russia normally gets 2 more turns to attack, the month of May...and another turn in the winter of 41 with a cold.
Another issue I have is supply is just to easy for the Germans. I think no one should be able to repair rail in a blizzard or heavy rains...But that is just a thought.
Lastly I kind of feel that the "small fleets" gives the Axis a major advantage. You limited the size of fleets but left air to be full strength...so when they are attack a fleet of 3 vs a fleet of 9 there is little if any AA...
Also Subs are now more powerful than the fleets they attack, which was a rarity but they can do pretty good when only attacking a CV, BB and DD...instead of a CV, 2 BB, 2 CA/CL and 3 DD....very little sub defense.
To add the Italian sub fleet is way to large. In reading about their fleet is was pretty bad overall and they could only keep 30 subs at sea at any time due to so many issues. Giving them 4 that are fine is a bit much and overpowering when again the UK can only put 3 ships in a group.


I suggest trying the Winter variant to see if that makes a change. I thought it made a huge change because the Russians can do some pretty good damage when units are stuck in a blizzard for 8 turns. Early 42 is rough too because the units that were in the blizzard are heavily worn...and need 2 turns to get back on track and even with their Russian counter parts.






The one odd thing I noticed was Uboats seem to sink less and take more damage. Not sure if it is a "luck" thing but in my mirror game both side's Axis Uboats were barely useful. They were taking 1 damage for every 3 merchants they sunk, then again maybe that is expected.

I think I hit 6 MM once...normally it was 2 or 3 and 1 hit to the Uboats. Could swear I remember sinking more.
Could have been luck, but in my current game the Uboats also took a beating and did little. Then again my opponent did not focus on that, as they took Egypt and the Middle East and Sealion...

So that is 3 games that something seems off with the Uboats.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by sveint »

I am currently on a quest to figure out how to play the Allies better at higher skill levels. Or if it is a lost cause and the Axis wins.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by ncc1701e »

Why are you losing as Russians?

1. Catastrophic breakthrough/encirclement?
2. Battle of attrition?

In both cases, approximately in what month/year?
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by sveint »

ncc1701e wrote: Mon Oct 21, 2024 4:30 pm Why are you losing as Russians?

1. Catastrophic breakthrough/encirclement?
2. Battle of attrition?

In both cases, approximately in what month/year?
My experience is that 1941 goes fairly historically (except lower German casualities) given equal skill levels, but during the winter 41/42 Germany builds up to become extremely powerful and it's all over in 1942.

1. No, I know how to avoid those.
2. Yes, mostly, Soviets get low on manpower/units. Despite min/max of lend lease.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by sveint »

Typical German construction queue in late 1941 (in fact, in this game I didn't play that well as Germany, only had 4 Panzers for the attack on France).
A new infantry corps will be built every turn until spring, sometimes even two. Manpower is not an issue.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by ncc1701e »

Interesting. Let's try to analyse this sentence:
2. Yes, mostly, Soviets get low on manpower/units. Despite min/max of lend lease.
a. Are you disbanding any Russian unit during 1939/1940/1941?
b. Are you building anything else than infantry armies during 1941/1942?
c. At which rate are you producing infantry armies (every turn/every two turns) during 1941/1942?
d. Are you repairing infantry rifle corps each turn during 1941/1942 so that they survive and gain experience?

Thanks
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by sveint »

ncc1701e wrote: Mon Oct 21, 2024 6:29 pm Interesting. Let's try to analyse this sentence:
2. Yes, mostly, Soviets get low on manpower/units. Despite min/max of lend lease.
a. Are you disbanding any Russian unit during 1939/1940/1941?
b. Are you building anything else than infantry armies during 1941/1942?
c. At which rate are you producing infantry armies (every turn/every two turns) during 1941/1942?
d. Are you repairing infantry rifle corps each turn during 1941/1942 so that they survive and gain experience?

Thanks
a) I used to, but it's a bad idea. Previously I'd get rid of the cavalry and a few other units. My current take is keep everything (but certainly don't reinforce everything); that 5 strength cavalry unit is perfect for the Leningrad port, for example. However, the 20% mech units are utterly useless except as emergency units and should be disbanded once the manpower isn't wasted, that is, after war has broken out.

b) I used to build only infantry corps, current thinking is 3 armor units, 5 or 6 coastal defense (Sevastopol is incredibly important to hold in 1941), then only infantry corps.

c) You must build a corps every turn once the units in b) are done. Otherwise you will have manpower problems later on. And too few units.

d) The 20% corps never get reinforcements or upgrades, and are disbanded once they are under 11 strength. Other infantry corps: I used to upgrade, but I'm with stjeand on this one, keep them as 39 tech until merged (generally). You may want to upgrade a few in key locations.

I'll add, and this is very important, no air units get any upgrades before the war. Only in 1942 can you maybe afford to reinforce/upgrade air. Again, there can be single exceptions for various reasons, but the point holds in general.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by sveint »

A further point about lend-lease, because when I say I minmax, I mean it.

Once the US is in the war, I send max lendlease to the UK for one turn. This allows the UK to send even more lend lease. Next turn, the US sends all its production to the Soviets. You cannot then cancel the UKs lendlease, or they will be able to send less in subsequent turns.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by ncc1701e »

sveint wrote: Mon Oct 21, 2024 8:25 pm
d) The 20% corps never get reinforcements or upgrades, and are disbanded once they are under 11 strength. Other infantry corps: I used to upgrade, but I'm with stjeand on this one, keep them as 39 tech until merged (generally). You may want to upgrade a few in key locations.
This is where you are losing manpower. As you said, prewar infantry rifle corps is a reserve of manpower. Building an infantry rifle corps each turn is the way to go.

But, then, you don't have enough PP to build infantry armies each turn. So, you are losing manpower each turn. My question at c) is about infantry armies not corps. My experience is that you can buy infantry armies only every two turn.

As such, I am repairing all my infantry rifle corps. Why? Because I have enough PP for this to fill these corps with manpower each turn. Again, this is a reserve of manpower for later.

When war is starting, what I do is the following:
1. I don't buy any new unit.
2. I put everything in repair/upgrade.
3. I am repairing all my infantry corps / infantry small armies (upgraded from corps).
4. I am upgrading a selected list of infantry corps / infantry small armies (upgraded from corps).
5. I am doing this until winter 1941.
6. Once everything is frozen, I stop repair/upgrade. I am then buying more infantry rifle armies, at least seven.
7. In April 1942, I restart repair/upgrade and I start to merge small armies into full size ones.
8. Then, once the Germans attack, I put again everything in repair/upgrade not buying anything new until winter 1942.

It did work for me.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by sveint »

ncc1701e wrote: Mon Oct 21, 2024 10:24 pm
sveint wrote: Mon Oct 21, 2024 8:25 pm
d) The 20% corps never get reinforcements or upgrades, and are disbanded once they are under 11 strength. Other infantry corps: I used to upgrade, but I'm with stjeand on this one, keep them as 39 tech until merged (generally). You may want to upgrade a few in key locations.
This is where you are losing manpower. As you said, prewar infantry rifle corps is a reserve of manpower. Building an infantry rifle corps each turn is the way to go.
This doesn't lose or waste any manpower. You are confused about something.

What you are describing post-war breakout about infantry armies (which I haven't even discussed yet), is stock-standard strategy. Play stjeand (or me now, for that matter), and it won't work.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by stjeand »

If I set all my units to "repair" I will use more manpower then building an army and not repairing...that is for sure.

I always have 60+ replacements required...and since you can't "limit" them easily it would suck up all my manpower every turn.


Now a new thought...

Jan 41 ish...

Stop building small corps...they are a money sink anyways. They cost 30% more than an army.
On the first turn of war you disband all the 3-5 mechs...and you build 10 armies or more...that will be a NICE June/July.
I even disband the 2-5s...for points and manpower since they are weaker then a small corps.

BUT I have to test this.

My current game has been a complete oddity / disaster...I have been away FAR to long and forgotten the basics.


I still have YET to be able to actually fully test the Russians.

AGAIN I will tell you...USE the Winter variant...I think it is a requirement.
Since the Russians win or lose in 41/42 the weather will never work in their favor if there are clear turns in October or cold turns in November / December...

Also I am starting to dislike small fleets as it basically overpowers the Axis fleets.
But not much of a choice in that matter.
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Re: So how are the Russians now?

Post by CHINCHIN »

AlvaroSousa wrote: Sat Oct 19, 2024 1:02 pm When are the Allies acting? 1943 Italy, 1944 France?
Uboat war? how many boats by 41 and 43?
Strategic bombing PP or OP?
Both with allies we stagnate in Africa, progress is very slow, or not at all if Germany sends sufficient reinforcements. With a small fleet it is much more difficult to advance in Africa, and much worse in general for the allies. I suggest that in a small fleet the stacking be of 4 naval combat units, and the rest, up to the 10 allowed, can be of embarked units.

With 15 German submarines, the resources that the allies have to spend are brutal, MM, escorts, shipyards... To try not to run out of MM, which you don't always manage. Therefore you don't send enough PP to the USSR, and the USSR resists but can't counterattack hard.

Another thing that is usually done is to attack Vichy and Vichy North Africa once France is conquered, this gives Germany +6 PP and a resource, which doesn't seem like much, but for many turns it is noticeable. And you make the allied advance in Africa difficult. I suggest that if this happens, the US enters the war 2 months earlier.

I did use a lot of strategic bombing, 4-5 heavy bombings and 3-4 medium ones, but it's not very noticeable. And I never had any problems with the USSR with MP, although it was impossible for me to break the axis lines, in 44 there was still fighting in the center of the USSR.

I also have to say that we both did not play well with allies, we made many mistakes. Playing with the axis is much easier than with the allies, with the allies you cannot allow yourself to make mistakes, and you have to be very careful in all your actions.
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