Sept39

[rmelvin]

https://www.dropbox.com/t/xY9diyEG8DKTIkco
This is a division level games across an extra-large map of Europe.
The game is based on Matrix War in Europe only this game is division level.
Copy out of the Transfer folder Sept39 folder and Sept39 application to your game folder.
Those who played my versus of Kaiser vs Europa this is even more engaging and more realistic toward history.
One drawback for have an extremely large map is load time 16ram is around 7 minutes.
The run time sometime can take up to 20 minutes. For experience players a minor price to play.

[OldCrowBalthazor]

Why don't you acknowledge that in fact your 'very large map' is from Elessar's 20k Map Mod which is still under development and testing?
He asked you not to do this repeatedly and here you are.
Also, anyone else downloading this and using it is kind of complicit in a type of theft in my opinion.

[Elessar2]

No, this was most definitely NOT sanctioned by me in any way, shape, or form.

[rmelvin]

I did acknowledge him he is in the credits. My games do not interfere with the development of his game. I only used the map. This game is not trying to copy his games. Also, I try to communicate not was stop. How would you know anything if you did not download the game.

[OldCrowBalthazor]

I did acknowledge him he is in the credits. My games do not interfere with the development of his game. I only used the map. This game is not trying to copy his games. Also, I try to communicate not was stop. How would you know anything if you did not download the game.

I in fact down loaded this last night at 11pm Pacfic via the drop box link. It was the 3rd download at the time.
Drop box was fast. Loading the game took about 5 minutes with the 16 Ram machine I use for tests..and is normal for a mod as big as this for SC.
I saw the credit there, but not in the forum thread.

Thing is Elessar asked you not to use his map in a public separate mod release. Use for a private game mod seems legit in my opinion.
I am privy to some of his comms exchanges with you and from reading them, he was quite clear. He wished to reserve the use of his map for his mod...which is still under development.

Now I understand that this is a public forum, and what's freely posted is available to anyone else. But what good manners and mod creation culture have dictated for years, is for a mod creator not to wholesale rip large chunks of another's work and run with it, especially if the original mod creator is still active and working on the original mod.
If the original mod creator and his mod was in an unfinished state, and nothing was seen for a lengthy period of time, plus there was no way to contact him, then maybe it would be ok to revitalize the original mothballed mod.

Doesn't seem like the case here.

[rmelvin]

I do not see how this interferes with his development. I use the map only.
Now does this tale away one future download. I see this could help get even more downloads.
Where my games have no human decision interaction and restricted human script activities. Where Elessar2 would be from my understanding have realistic historical inner reaction. The only two things in common is the map and I even changed the map.
Elessar2 stated he pick up a mothball project and even laid it down at one time.
From the viewpoint of a 75-year-old man with mensa level autism, with no social skills or guile.
I see this as helping by introducing the map, permit people game time. Let's Elessar2 and his team time to really put a super quality product out. So do not have upgrades after upgrades. In about two month I going to have to upgrade after finishing this game. It takes about two months of around four to six hours per day to play this game on 16ram.
What is stopping people from cropping this map and say create a Mediterranean campaign or Balkan war's campaigns or the Muslim conquest of southern Europe and northern Africa?
Also, so private is not private, got it.

[Elessar2]

This is VERY simple: I did NOT give you permission to make this public. You can try to rationalize it to yourself all you want (none of which hold any water), but you have taken the decisions out of my hands and decided on your own to make them for me, which I absolutely cannot abide and which is just appallingly presumptuous and incredibly rude on your part.

People may get the mistaken impression that I authorized or approved this release, which cannot be further from the truth. I have the final say as to whether someone has permission to mod my work, not you, or anyone else. This is just common courtesy among modders in pretty much any genre and title. Any personal mental issues you might have are completely beside the point.

You will thus delete your original post in this thread, including the link, post-haste. I will brook no more rationalizations, excuses, or delays.

[rmelvin]

Please abide and honor the rules put forth for public form.
I violated no public form rules set by Matrix Games.
That what private form was set up to use for your request.
Under the rules set forth it is you who need to close and remove your public posting or remove the link.
Also, I try to contact you, and you have already block me, I have the screen with the red "X" on your private form.
With no public update and no contact, I thought the project died. This thread is filled with died project.
Did you contact me to use my scripts. I am old programmer going back to HP code writing EMI/EMS system in the 70's.
So, all my code has a tick or ticks (inside scripts).

[Unfortunate Son]

Please abide and honor the rules put forth for public form.
I violated no public form rules set by Matrix Games.
That what private form was set up to use for your request.
Under the rules set forth it is you who need to close and remove your public posting or remove the link.
Also, I try to contact you, and you have already block me, I have the screen with the red "X" on your private form.
With no public update and no contact, I thought the project died. This thread is filled with died project.
Did you contact me to use my scripts. I am old programmer going back to HP code writing EMI/EMS system in the 70's.
So, all my code has a tick or ticks (inside scripts).

I feel the need to speak up here as a modder and whom had someone ask to finish my work when I was at a point where I had personnel issues I need to deal with. I am back working on my mod and the person whom asked about my mod did not do anything with it. They respectfully are allowing me to continue to finish my mod without distraction. In all of the mod forums I have read people ask respectfully if they can use someone's else's mod. When they say no wait until they are finished, then one should respectfully respect their wishes. I feel it is an unwritten rule regardless if it is public or not. To not use someone else's work unless they are given permission to do so.

My 2 cents.

[pz501]

I'm a long-time lurker who very rarely posts these days on any forum or sub-forum, but this really caught my eye.

I think Elessar2 has every right to be upset. However, I'd advise everyone to try and tone it down a little. I see no need for statements like "You will thus delete your original post in this thread, including the link, post-haste. I will brook no more rationalizations, excuses, or delays." to be made. This is tantamount to issuing orders to someone, that last time I checked nobody here except the moderators or forum owners have the authority to do.

Making demands like that can only prolong this argument to no one's satisfaction. People will tend to dig in their heels when someone addresses them this way. I understand the issue concerning intellectual property, having designed a very large Gettysburg scenario for the Wargame Design Studios "Campaign Gettysburg" title, and I can also appreciate the hours of research, testing, and revising involved. My attitude has always been that while I may have designed something it was not for any profit of any type, but for people's enjoyment and use to play or modify as they see fit. Elessar2 says his is still under construction. Fair enough, and people should indeed hold off independently tinkering or using the map for their own designs until his design is finalized.

I also think the posting advertising the offending scenario should be removed. However no one but the moderator can really do anything about that.

I'm looking forward to seeing the real scenario that Elessar is working on. I hope it's a huge success. After all this time and effort, he deserves that much to say the least.