Interesting Article

[JagdFlanker]

Russian Specialist Lays Bare Stalin's Plan to Conquer Europe

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v16/v16n6p22_Bishop.html

[K62_]

Yeah, I read that book. He's written 2 more since. He's quite controversial but obviously knows a lot about the Red Army in WW2.

[K62_]

Hmmm, 125 tanks a week from a single factory... you never get that in WiR.

[Agent Smith]

Rezun's books are wildly discussed in Russia from the early 90's. There is a lot of crirics of his works.
The Kharkov Tank Factory was unable to produce 125 tanks a week in 40 or 41. The real number is about 125 tank per mounth.

[JagdFlanker]

here are some insane colour pics - very surreal! it's all in russian, so click on the only link (1-85) to get to the pic list

http://militera.lib.ru/h/onslaught/index.html

this whole website is unreal - if you go to home ( http://militera.lib.ru ) and type in an english word (like, say, 'german') it will give you hits on english docs it has. for example:

http://militera.lib.ru/h/fugate/

http://militera.lib.ru/h/stolfi/

THE FULL BOOKS!!

[Agent Smith]

Yes. It is very good educational site on military history.

[huhrlass]

Perhaps Stalin would have attacked first and you get many different opinions and I believe in themost recent thought that it most likely wasn't planned, however, if it was, The USSR officer corps would not have been able to lead a lightning war against the germans and I have no clue about how things would have turned out. Nevertheless, it does provide us with some thought and you can read many opposing views from the historians, good job

[m39 white death]

In speculating about a Soviet preemptive or planned strike against Germany in '39 or '40, you have to look at the Soviet Armies' experience against Finland. The Finns, badly outnumbered in every category, with no tanks or planes to speak of, held off a massive Russian offensive for a long time, inflicting horrific casualties against the Russians in the process. This enabled them to get favorable terms at the bargaining table. Most of all, the Finns retained their country without Soviet influence in the running of their goverment, unlike every other country that the Soviets conquered or influenced. Even after WWII, the Finns, despite being an axis power, retained their sovreignty.

In light of this, any attack against the Germans during the '39 to '40 period would have resulted in catstrophic failure and would have galvanized popular support for a war against the Soviet Union. While I think the writer's premise that Stalin wanted to attack the West is correct and substantiated by Soviet aggression in the 30's and early 40's (Finland, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, and Poland) I think that Stalin correctly recognized the very poor condition of the Red army and airforce at this stage and sat on the sidelines. However, I disagree with the writer in his opinion that the Red air force could have destroyed the Luftwaffe on the ground in a suprise attack. The Germans were already at a state of war and Hitler was no fool; he never liked, or trusted, Stalin. The Luftwaffe would have remained on a state of full alert during this period. They were far from drinking buddies.

[Endsieg]

M39,
why should one think Stalin was a rational actor with any sort of plan whatsoever?....a middle-aged thug just like Hitler, he was just interested in being "a poor player who struts and frets his hour upon the stage"...wasnt he?
additionally:...a steady and massive build-up of German forces along the German-Soviet demarcation line began sometime after the defeat of France in June '40 (delayed by spring '41 diversion in the Balkan/Aegeans, to be sure)...i cant believe Sov reconaissance /aufklaerung didnt notice this slow build-up, despite german skill as Caesar noted: "germani in silva se obdiderunt"...
Why didnt the Sovs attack in Jan-April '41? that is the question,,,Germans were vulnerable to all those Sov tanks in that period, werent they?

[huhrlass]

Stalin knew the effects of his purge on the officer corp and the Country still was not prepared for a war due to production quotas and the turmoil with the provinces. If the German Gov't (Hitler and his henchmen) treated the people with respect and as liberators instead of conquerors I believe they would have overthrown Stalin and then "The house of cards would have tumbled". Just think of a Russian Army, Ukranian Army against the Communist regime? The people of the USSR despised Stalin as we all know and even look at all the ex soldiers who would have fought with the German Army and did even knowing the ultimate fate that awaited them should Germany lose. The Luftwaffe most likely would have prevailed due to its organization structure ( not withstanding Goering) and its battle tested pilot and crews. Udet was lazy and incompetent but the Luftwaffe became a force once Milch was placed in charge of the organization along with assistance from Speer.

[m39 white death]

One of the mistakes that the politically correct historians make is that history's tyrants were all crazy. Really, Stalin and Hitler were far from crazy; they were brillaint and ruthless, the embodiment of evil. Fools? No. They understood what they were doing from the beginning of their quest for power and stopped short of nothing to achieve and maintain it.

So, when analyzing the period from the late 30's to 1940, you have to assume that both men were thinking rationally, as at this point they were both at the top of their game. The decision to attack the Soviet Union in 1941 may have been a preemptive strike, but Hitler sets forth his desire for living space to the east in Mein Kampf, written several years before the war. Sooo...I think that Hitler attacked for to gain living space and resources, not as a preemptive measure. And I believe that yes, Stalin did want to attack the west once Germany got stuck in a stalemate, but held back because of the sorry state of his army and the quick German success. The rest is history.