Bob Flemin' Fall Gelb AARse.....

[warspite1]

Scenario A
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

Finally its to Holland we look. The two infantry corps of the northern pincer - 43rd and 45th - move into position northeast of Amsterdam together with the 1st Engineer Division. The southern prong is made up of the DAK and 47th Panzer Corps (plus supporting artillery) - although the former will be used for the attack on Rotterdam. The final element is the 14th (SS) Infantry Division whose men are unloaded from the light cruiser Nurnberg and ferried as quickly as possible into the Dutch harbour.

[warspite1]

Scenario A
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

There are three attacks this impulse:

- Southern Poland
- Amsterdam
- Rotterdam

At Rotterdam, where the invading infantry are being assisted by the tanks of the DAK Panzer Corps, the notional has to be included to stop the attack being automatic. The Germans pile in air support from the vaunted Stukas to try and ensure this attack is automatic - but they can only double the ground attack and the battle will be a 7:1 +1.

At Amsterdam, there is no chance of an automatic but the Germans can make almost certain (subject only to fractional odds) - at a cost of two bombers. NOTE: I stupidly fail to change the Me-110 to bomber [8|] so this attack will be 7:1.

In Southern Poland the Poles do not fly to save the trapped Karpaty Army - but instead keep their powder dry for the big battles to come.

[warspite1]

Scenario A
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

Firstly the Polish attack. This is automatic and Army Group von Leeb have now cleared Southern Poland and they have claimed both Polish resources.

[warspite1]

Scenario A
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

And so to Holland. The first attack is a 7:1 no modifiers on the Assault table. The throw is a 2! The Germans suffer no losses but all units are disorganised. Amsterdam falls.

[warspite1]

Scenario A
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

Finally to Rotterdam and I am not sure what happened. But suddenly the screen changed from 7:1 to automatic?? EDIT: Ah I see why - it is because of the loss of Amsterdam and the +1 that the ZOC of the 1st Infantry Corps provided until it was destroyed. Wow - so much to learn....

The 14th (SS) Infantry fan out across the harbour to try and stop as many ships leaving the harbour as possible - or destroy them if not. In this, it has to be said, they proved wholly unequal to the task. Every ship in the harbour managed to sail for the UK.

The Luftwaffe re-base a fighter and bomber back to the south where they can threaten both Warsaw and Lodz.

In readiness for the attack on Belgium von Bock reorganises three Corps.

The impulse ends and the Germans are on course to be through the Low Countries by the end of the turn. The only fly in the ointment is the US Entry - and this could have been worse as I think I overcompensated by one chit for the initial bug. Still, a quick collapse of France and it may be worth it.

[warspite1]

Scenario B
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

So the plan has gone a little awry and now becomes quite a hostage to the dice god. Denmark will now have to wait. Holland is the key here and I have not helped the situation by putting a slow infantry corps in the north [:@]

But there is little point in trying this scenario if I am not brave enough to see it through.

Adolf orders the invasion of Holland to proceed.

[warspite1]

Scenario B
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

The Dutch align with the CW. The Germans have to choose a Combined to keep their hopes of taking Rotterdam alive.

The Dutch place their 1st Infantry Corps in the capital, while the ships of the fleet are at anchor in Rotterdam. As many ships and convoys as possible are placed in Surinam and the NEI but this still leaves the following in Rotterdam:

CL: De Ruyter (Flagship of Admiral Doorman), Java, Sumatra, Tromp
Other: 1 x Convoy

[warspite1]

Scenario B
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

With some trepidation, the light cruiser Koln slips out of port choc full of infantry.

The Germans get lucky - the search roll fails because I did not put a unit in the 4-box...

The Germans refuse the offer of initiating combat and try and stick as close to the coast is is practicable. The Royal Navy fail to find any trace of Kriegsmarine vessels in the North Sea.

The limit of six moves (and the Rain) makes life difficult. In Poland the 49th Mountain Corps take Krakow and the resource hex to the north, but that is the limit of German plans in Poland this impulse.

The big concern is Holland. The two attacks the Germans are allowed will be here - against Rotterdam and Amsterdam. The good news is that now I know about the notional and the ZOC it is vital I push everything into the attack on Amsterdam. The downside is that I will have to use von Rundstedt.

Rotterdam. To stop the attack being automatic the Dutch have to use the notional and the +1 that brings. This is going to be close....

9 ground support was added by using all available bombers.

HQ Support of 8 fails.

And so this is it. 5:1 no modifiers on the Assault table for Amsterdam. The good news is that the Germans cannot fail to take the city - which should mean Rotterdam is automatic. The only doubt is what they will throw.....

....5. All attackers are disorganised but there are no losses. Amsterdam falls.

[warspite1]

Scenario B
Sep/Oct 1939
Impulse: 3

The attack on Rotterdam wasn't quite automatic but it does not matter, the throw was an 8(9) and so the city is taken with no disorganisation.

Incredibly, the 3rd Infantry proved almost as bad at stopping the Dutch fleet get away as did their SS counterparts. Only Tromp was destroyed, the rest made it back to the UK.

The Luftwaffe re-base their fighter and bomber units to southern Poland.

The impulse ends. The Germans have Rotterdam - and losses have been negligible - the problem they have now is disorganisation...

[Barbuesque]

It's funny that the most important units for Germany are the 1 strength divisions.

Couple of points:
-Maybe CW should ground strike the 2nd infantry division should the first interception succeed
-France might want to ground strike Rundsted on the surprise impulse

[etsadler]

ORIGINAL: Orm

I just checked how to break down during set up and then I get online and see the question. [:D]

After placing a unit on the map you can right click on a unit (that has the corresponding divisions available in the force pool) in order to break it down. During set up this can not be a infantry corps since Germany has no infantry divisions available.

Unless you are playing with Unlimited Breakdown. As Germany that is one I am always looking to have. It really favors the attacker to have those divisions available.

[etsadler]

ORIGINAL: Jagdtiger14

Interesting about DOW on Hungary and Bulgaria. Funny thing is that the USSR Bulgarian gambit (which I like to do a lot) puts a stop to this...and also puts pressure on the Germans to DOW Yugo before they want to deal with Yugo...or USSR could take Yugo as well.

Jagd,

How do your Russians stop this? There is no Allied DOW Phase in Impulse #2 (at least in MWiF) so Russia cannot declare war on Bulgaria before Germany does. If I use this tactic (which I think is very gamey, but people differ on that) I declare war on Hungary and Bulgaria in Impulse #3, before Russia has an opportunity to do anything.

[Jagdtiger14]

Rick,

1. How does Germany DOW Bulgaria? Are they not required to be able to get a unit into the country? Where does the attack come from?
2. Is USSR required to demand Bessarabia to begin the sequence that leads to Germany DOW on Bulgaria?
3. Of course there is an Allied DOW phase in impulse #2...does not France and CW DOW Germany? Is USSR restricted from any DOW's on the Allied DOW phase in impulse #2?

[Jagdtiger14]

Barbuesque: Divisions are very valuable and interesting! I'm really looking forward to the new divisional WiF game (Master Edition).

[warspite1]

Gents could I ask you to take this discussion perhaps to the War Room and start a new thread please? This is an interesting subject and so could explode, which kind of gets in the way of what I am doing on Fall Gelb.

It's another interesting area and I would like to explore this too. I am happy to do some scenarios (as I am here) for the various USSR/German Balkan options and gambits in future.

Many thanks.

[warspite1]

Summary after impulse 3

Scenario A

Positives

The Germans have achieved the conquest of Holland and Denmark, and despite disorganisation of certain units, of which the 47th Panzer Corps is the most serious, there should be sufficient units left to take Belgium (subject to the weather). Importantly, von Rundstedt is still fully operable.

Poland is being reduced systematically and the resources have been taken. The Germans probably have just enough units under Army Group von Leeb to surround Warsaw/Lodz and stop reinforcements coming in.

No losses whatsoever have been taken by the Germans to date.

Negatives

The convoys in the Baltic have still to get to sea and I am not sure if a combined will work for the next impulse as there is likely a need for three attacks in Belgium. If the weather stays fine there should be two more impulses however.

The big downer is the US Entry pool status. This may be of sufficient concern to keep Italy out, but if the CW did bring Wavell to France, the temptation may be too great.

Other

Had the CW realised about the supply situation, the Poles would not have tried to defend Gydnia. The knock on effect is that the RN would have found the German Invasion Flotilla as they would have had units in the 4-box. There would also be an extra Polish division to beef up the defence of Warsaw.

[warspite1]

Scenario B

Positives

In Poland the resources (and Krakow) have fallen to the Germans, although there is still the Karpaty Army to be disposed of.

Holland has fallen and Rotterdam occupied.

The only losses so far are a division and a light cruiser. If the Germans can achieve their goal, these are insignificant at this stage.

Negatives

The interception of the Rotterdam Invasion Flotilla (and the subsequent need to do a second combined) has, together with the weather, meant compromise of the plans – and that is without the luck really turning against Germany i.e. the weather was Rain rather than Storm/Snow and the back-up invasion flotilla was not intercepted.

Although Holland has fallen, von Rundstedt has been disorganised and there will be a likely shortage of troops to conquer Belgium.
Denmark remains neutral – although frankly I see this is not too much of an issue.

The US Entry pool is even worse in this scenario – although I still have to allow for the bug (no chit for declaration of war on the Danish).

Other

There was a mistake in the set-up by me – I should have had 2 x 4-speed infantry for the northern arm of the Amsterdam pincer – and this would have helped, but on the basis that players under pressure rarely get everything perfect, I let this stand (not to mention I could have made the weather worse).

[Jagdtiger14]

A combined is possible on the next impulse since really only two attacks need to be made. If the Belgians spread out and put a unit in all three cities, the Germans need only attack Antwerp and Liege. They can leave Brussels for the next impulse.

However, I still do not see the urgency to get cp's into the Baltic. Scenario A impulse for the Germans will be 5, if bad weather it will be a 7 for the Allies who could all pass to make it 10-30% to end the turn. Weigh the CHANCE of not getting 3 resources at 1939 PM's vs taking Brussels and being able to Have the opportunity to attack the Allied line on a following impulse. Scenario B is a bit different...did the turn go up by 2 for the bad weather last impulse?...so Germany could end the turn on a 1 (10%) with the Allies at 30-50% depending on what they choose to do. So depending on what the Wallies do, its better than a 50% chance the turn will end before the Germans can get their cp's out there, however the same calculation exists (3 resources at 1939 PM's vs taking Brussels). I prefer to take the risk, besides...I would rather do a naval and get the German fleet out there. Question: I'm assuming the French have something in the Baltic?...I missed that report.

[warspite1]

You did not miss the report - all key moves should be recorded - what I did not post was the one house rule.

Allied ships in the Baltic: Only the CW can send ships into the Baltic, not the French.

[Jagdtiger14]

Why would you house rule the French cant send anything to the Baltic? That is a standard WiF move...and a good one. I very much recommend NOT playing with CL's, and is this...because of CL's that you have that house rule?

So, in that case since there is no or little threat (maybe CW air?), then only a combined is needed for the cp's.

If I were playing Germany, I would do a land impulse (weather permitting) under both scenarios and take the small risk. If the cp's don't get out there, its basically a cost of 2 BP's (1.5 rounded up...so it might only be 1 BP depending on other German resources)? I would spend 2(1?) BP(s) to have Brussels immediately and a ready line vs the Wallies.

I recommend putting the Belgian FTR in Belgian Congo so CW gets the pilot.

If the weather turns out to be storm, please do a calculation for the possible attacks vs Belgium to see if its still worth it.