ORIGINAL: Aurorus
As I say, amphibious TFs will unload troops at the amphibious rate. You do not get the amphibious bonus unloading at a friendly port, however.
Yes, you are right, I missed this one. One of the quirks of the game that's not particularly logical. Yet can be dealt with by assigning enough shipping into amphibious shuttling. Squads suffer negligible disablements when unloaded overboard into friendly ports, and it is squads (avsupport and engineers) that you usually care about first. Tanks/guns are different of course but you rarely need those unloading into friendly bases anyway except from starting TFs. The latter also need some specific care (with destination ports too) exactly because they are overloaded by design (Wake invasion planner, commit seppuku, will ya [:)]).
But after that initial phase TF composition becomes your own choice, and Japan has enough spare shipping to indefinitely scale unloading capacity if needed with no regard to destination port. ИBut only for amphibs. Maybe your previous problems with amphibs came from you trying to use ships efficiently and used minimum amount of those. Throw some more into amphibs even if space is not used fully and everything will unload quickly and in good order (as you've already mentioned for my example)
ORIGINAL: Aurorus
I stand by my statement that Long sieges are inefficient uses of supply. I do not intend to get bogged down in a long siege or try to have an extended artillery dual with large number of fixed gun emplacements.
Long sieges of Chinese is also by far the best experience gain in the game for Japanese infantry if you rotate LCUs and let disablements recover. Would be useful later
The Japanese submarine force continues to shine, finding and hitting two more tankers in the night: one Dutch and the other U.S.
Sub attack near Lihue at 178,105
Japanese Ships
SS I-16
Allied Ships
TK Gulfland, Torpedo hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
PC Reliance
SS I-16 launches 6 torpedoes at TK Gulfland
I-16 diving deep ....
PC Reliance fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Reliance fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Reliance fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Reliance fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Reliance fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
Submarine attack near Pamekasan at 58,106
Japanese Ships
SS I-122
Allied Ships
TK Anastasia, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
TK Anastasia is sighted by SS I-122
SS I-122 launches 2 torpedoes at TK Anastasia
The Gulfland was carrying fuel, no doubt bound for Pearl and taking a sneaky northern route. The Anastasia is carrying oil... my oil... no doubt to Australia.
I did the turn last night late and was tired. As a result, I did something stupid. I left the Betties and Nells at Singkawang on "Naval attack" with a secondary target of "ground attack... commander's discretion." Left to his own devices, the commander of the Betty squadron decided to fly over Singapore at 9k and the unit was hit by the full force of a pile of Bofor 40mm.
Afternoon Air attack on Singapore Fortress, at 50,84 (Singapore)
Weather in hex: Heavy cloud
Raid detected at 33 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes
Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 11
G4M1 Betty x 26
Japanese aircraft losses
G4M1 Betty: 15 damaged
G4M1 Betty: 2 destroyed by flak
Aircraft Attacking:
25 x G4M1 Betty bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb, 4 x 60 kg GP Bomb
5 planes did not make it home, and I believe 4 more naval aviation pilots were lost (1 is missing in action). Two lessons from this: 1) Do not be lazy when doing turns. 2) Always remember to check your bomber squadrons every turn. This is something that I have failed to do twice now in the this game. The first time did not cost me, because the bombers flew against a remote base in China... but they could have flown right into AVG.
More AMcs went into Bataan under a nearly full moon and sacrificed their lives for the glory of the empire. Bob must have added substantially to the number of mines in the field. By my count, that is over 400 cleared. I believe it start the game with 300. Whatever the case, I have not had this much trouble clearing the field in a scenario 1 game. Against Ironman, the minefield is enormous, and I don't even bother trying to clear it out when there is more than 25% moonlight.
We have a timetable, however, and it will not wait. One more group of AMcs should get it in there and that will have to suffice. The time to move on is... now.
TF 210 encounters mine field at Bataan (78,77) - Coastal Guns Fire Back!
5 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Japanese Ships
AMc Menado Maru, Shell hits 9, heavy fires, heavy damage
AMc Kyo Maru #3, Shell hits 6, on fire, heavy damage
AMc Hakata Maru #7, Shell hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AMc Choun Maru #8, Shell hits 4, heavy damage
AMc Menado Maru firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Menado Maru
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Kyo Maru #3
AMc Kyo Maru #3 firing at Manila Bay Defenses
AMc Hakata Maru #7 firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Hakata Maru #7
AMc Choun Maru #8 firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Choun Maru #8
90 mines cleared
The Japanese have reached Malacca and Kuala Lumpur, and the allies have retreated back to fortress Singapore. This theater has been quiet for a few days.
DEI
With Palembang and Tarakan now in Japanese hands, this theater was also quiet on the 3rd. Port operations have slowed me down for 2 days here. In this opening for Japan, what I did was basically use Mindanao as a supply depot. I dumped a pile of supply (along with a regiment and some SNLFs) into Mindanao early from the cargo ships of the opening TFs. I routed naval support to Butaan and Davao from day 1. The idea is to get the supply forward and get it off the garbage cargo ships and onto ships suitable for amphibious operations. Babeldaod is only a size 3 port and alone is insufficient for this task, which is why I wanted Davao and Butaan as quickly as possible. (Of course there were also 19 B-17s sitting at Cagayan, and I did not have to go far out of the way to cause trouble for them). So, that was the plan for the DEI.
SoPac
The Japanese took Kavieng, after the initial invasion ran afoul of the Adelaide. So Rabaul, Shortlands, Kavieng, and Madang are now in Japanese hands. Rabaul is a mess, because I had to bombard it with cruisers twice, owing to the spirited defense of the Lark Battalion. Those Australians are tough.
China
China has been mostly a game of manuever for the past few days. The Chinese hold Nanyang with 6 units, and the Japanese have formed a line that borders Nanyang and the Chengchow, Loyang region. North China is a cat and mouse game as 2 Chinese units keep trying to escape isolation.
With the other theaters quiet, the action has shifted to the Phillipines. I moved most of the Japanese forces into Clark from Lingayen and Iba yesterday, revealing the extent of my deployment there. As I say, it is 3600 AV, and I did not deploy 3600 AV to Luzon to stare the supply out of the allies. The idea is to steamroll Luzon and move on as quickly as possible. To the action then.
More than 400 mines have been removed from Bataan, and one more AMc group was inbound 1 hex away. They went to work.
TF 188 encounters mine field at Bataan (78,77) - Coastal Guns Fire Back!
13 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Japanese Ships
AMc Toshi Maru #7, Shell hits 5, heavy damage
AMc Shintohoku Maru, Shell hits 6, heavy fires, heavy damage
AMc Seki Maru, Shell hits 3, heavy damage
AMc Kyo Maru #5, Shell hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
AMc Toshi Maru #7 firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Toshi Maru #7
AMc Shintohoku Maru firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Shintohoku Maru
AMc Seki Maru firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Seki Maru
Manila Bay Defenses firing at AMc Kyo Maru #5
107 mines cleared
As they were clearing mines, 4 BBs steamed north from Batangas, along the coast, engaging the guns at Bataan briefly. With over 500 mines removed from Bataan, the path was still not entirely clear and Yamashiro hit a mine.
Naval Gun Fire at Bataan - Coastal Guns Fire Back!
72 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Japanese Ships
BB Hyuga, Shell hits 2
BB Ise
BB Yamashiro, Mine hits 1
BB Fuso, Shell hits 1
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Hyuga
BB Hyuga firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Ise
BB Ise firing at Manila Bay Defenses
BB Yamashiro firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Yamashiro
BB Fuso firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Fuso
Once clear of the coastal fortress at Bataan, the BBs bombarded Clark Field.
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Hyuga
BB Hyuga firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Ise
BB Ise firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Yamashiro
BB Yamashiro firing at Manila Bay Defenses
Manila Bay Defenses firing at BB Fuso
BB Fuso firing at Manila Bay Defenses
At first light, the Japanese came over the top across the entire front, with assaults on Manila and Clark. As evening fell over Luzon, Orphan Ann brought the bad news home to the dogfaces across the Pacific. Manila had fallen, and the outer trench works at Clark had been overrun.
Ground combat at Manila (79,77)
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 32547 troops, 279 guns, 441 vehicles, Assault Value = 1192
Defending force 15317 troops, 151 guns, 149 vehicles, Assault Value = 416
Japanese ground losses:
1674 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 123 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 13 disabled
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Allied ground losses:
8412 casualties reported
Squads: 332 destroyed, 89 disabled
Non Combat: 558 destroyed, 134 disabled
Engineers: 11 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 63 (44 destroyed, 19 disabled)
Vehicles lost 86 (68 destroyed, 18 disabled)
Units retreated 9
Units destroyed 1
Defeated Allied Units Retreating!
Assaulting units:
20th Infantry Regiment
9th Infantry Regiment
48th Recon Regiment
56th Recon Regiment
4th Division
16th Engineer Regiment
2nd Engineer Regiment
16th Recon Regiment
8th Tank Regiment
2nd Tank Regiment
4th Infantry Regiment
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
16th Army
17th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
Defending units:
1st PA Constabulary Regiment
1st PA Infantry Division
41st PA Infantry Division
71st PA Infantry Division
2nd PA Constabulary Regiment
Cavite USN Base Force
Manila USAAF Base Force
Asiatic Fleet
II Philippine Corps
PAF Aviation
Ground combat at Clark Field (79,76)
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 71039 troops, 688 guns, 457 vehicles, Assault Value = 2467
Defending force 23613 troops, 400 guns, 486 vehicles, Assault Value = 730
Assaulting units:
2nd Formosa Inf. Regiment
48th Engineer Regiment
65th Brigade
148th Infantry Regiment
3rd Ind. Engineer Regiment
38th Division
1st Formosa Inf. Regiment
47th Infantry Regiment
56th Engineer Regiment
33rd Division
21st Division
113th Infantry Regiment
4th Tank Regiment
21st Ind. Engineer Regiment
7th Tank Regiment
9th Field AF Construction Battalion
15th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
1st Medium Field Artillery Regiment
14th Army
48th Field Artillery Regiment
1st Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
9th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
2nd Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
8th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
56th Field Artillery Regiment
Defending units:
194th Tank Battalion
45th PS Infantry Regimental Combat Team
26th PS Cavalry Regiment
31st PA Infantry Division
4th Marine Regiment
192nd Tank Battalion
57th PS Infantry Regimental Combat Team
31st Infantry Regiment
91st PA Infantry Division
14th PS Engineer Regiment
Clark Field USAAF Base Force
1st USMC AA Battalion
88th PS Field Artillery Regiment
USAFFE
200th & 515th Coast AA Regiment
803rd Engineer Aviation Battalion
Subic Bay Defenses
301st PA Field Artillery Regiment
with over 100,00 troops in PI you came for a quick victory instead of a siege bypass operation. His defense was spread out between Clark and Manila and not concentrated on one or the other. Where did his Manila garrison retreat too? With that he won't be able to pull them into Bataan as they are now cutoff from Bataan. With 6 or 7 divisions worth of LCUs and support it may not take long as it appears half of his troops are engaged outside of Bataan.
with over 100,00 troops in PI you came for a quick victory instead of a siege bypass operation. His defense was spread out between Clark and Manila and not concentrated on one or the other. Where did his Manila garrison retreat too? With that he won't be able to pull them into Bataan as they are now cutoff from Bataan. With 6 or 7 divisions worth of LCUs and support it may not take long as it appears half of his troops are engaged outside of Bataan.
It does not make that much difference really. Both Manila and Clark are X3 defensive hexes. One of the reasons that I took Cabantuan right off was to be able to adjust my troops between Clark and Manila to have the right amount at each base, depending on his defensive deployment. If he built a big stack at Clark, I would have moved everything to Clark. The attack at Clark was nearly 3 to 1. If all the units from both sides had been at Clark, it probably would have been 3 to 1, and he would have retreated and lost the hex, instead of holding for another turn. He loses some units in Bataan, but forces me to attack a x3 defense hex a second time, instead of having more units at Bataan, which is only x2. He also gained some extra supply from holding Manila and was able to shuffle around his supply better. So there were advantages and disadvantages, and they pretty much even out in my opinion. If he would have abandoned Manila, I could have taken it on Dec. 18th.
He has had several units cut off, through no fault of his own. I landed at Iba, Lingayen, and Mauban, with a paradrop at Cabantuan. I moved quickly from Mauban to Batangas and interdicted the unit south of Batangas by air several times. As a result, he had 4 units cut off by Dec. 10th, and 2 units mauled at Lingayen and Iba. There was also the tank trap at Cabantuan, which you cannot fault him for. I think any allied player would have sent the tanks in after the paratroopers. Also, I doubt he realized just how much had been deployed to Luzon. Clark was inoperable for most of the time, so he had no recon. He probably did not realize that some of the units at Iba and Lingayen were whole divisions and that almost every other unit, except for 1 engineer unit, 3 aviation support, and 2 naval support, were regiments. I only had 1400 AV at Clark until the day before the attack. The rest was in Lingayen and Iba.
Going after Luzon first is interesting to me, in large part, because I think that the Japanese made a mistake in under-deploying there at the beginning of the war. I have other ways to start the game, but I like this opening move, in part, because I have thought it through from the allied side on Luzon every way that I can think of, and I cannot think of any way to hold Luzon for long against this open. It is just too much AV for the allied units that are not cut off on Dec. 7th, even with X3 terrain
I am not sure that I understand your meaning about DPs.
DP would refer to Dual Purpose guns, those that can do both anti-air and anti-ship/land artillery. I don't think the Dutch have any at game start so the anti-ship defence at Palembang was likely all coast defence artillery.
No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth
I really don't understand why the Manila garrison retreated to the worst possible hex.
They cannot retreat from one attack into another hex under attack. That is why I attacked both hexes at the same time.
Cabantuan
Cabantuan was already flipped and not under attack.
I moved recon units from Cabantuan into Manila, therefore I had control of the hexside between Cabantuan and Manila. The player who is the last to move units through a hexside in a contested hex controls that hexside. This cuts off retreat and supply path.
I moved 65th brigade out of Cabantuan, expecting the minefield at Bataan to be cleared with 2 days. It was not, but control of that hexside between Cabantuan and Manila, and the hexside between Cabantuan and Clark is the reason that I had to attack when I did and risk sending my BBs through mines (which I hate and which cost me a good bit of repair yard time on Yamashiro). You moved that PI division into Cabantuan a turn or two faster than I thought that you would, so I had to attack when I did. If I had not, you could have used that unit to move into Clark or Manila from Cabantuan, and then you would have control of the hexside. That unit would have also got back into supply. So once I moved into Clark from Cabantuan, I could not go back. I had to attack the next day.
I really hoped to read some reactions and insights to my queries about the higly effective bombing of the tank battalion in Luzon, a few posts above.
I reread your post about bombing tanks, and I see that I did not answer your question. I have discovered several things about bombing armor units.
1) Target selection is better at lower altitudes. Bombers are much more likely to target the better units at lower altitudes. I like to use 6K, especially in the early war. Below 6K and bombers use the LowG skill, which none of the aircrews are trained for. I train a lot of my bomber pilots in LowG, so later in the war, I may bomb from time to time below 6K.
2) Armor is very vulnerable by itself. There is no other target.
3) The penetration rating on the bomb must be equal to or greater than the armor rating of the tank to get any disabled or destroyed. If you send bombers over a hex that do not have bombs capable of penetrating the armor of the tanks, the bombers are very unlikely to attack the tanks if there are other targets in the hex. This, and altitude, may be one reason why Lowpe's armored cars seem to do well. The Grants do not have very good armor, so 250 Kg bombs were sufficient.
4) Bombers's first priority is "guns." The reason bombers often prefer infantry targets is because the infantry usually has "guns" mixed in. Any type of "gun" draws bombers attention before tanks, so they will bomb units with "guns" before tanks.
5) Bombers will focus on targets with less disruption. You will notice this when bombing coastal fortress (with guns), for example. The bombers will focus on the coastal guns until they are sufficiently disrupted. Only then will they bomb other targets. So, if you want to disrupt infantry, in Hong Kong, for example, you must send waves of bombers in to accomplish the mission. Likewise, if you want to hit tanks, mixed in with infantry units that contain guns, you will have to send enough bombers to disrupt the infantry sufficiently first.
I am not sure that I understand your meaning about DPs.
DP would refer to Dual Purpose guns, those that can do both anti-air and anti-ship/land artillery. I don't think the Dutch have any at game start so the anti-ship defence at Palembang was likely all coast defence artillery.
Ah, I understand now. The question was, "how did I know that Dual Purpose guns from Clark participated in the artillery exchange?" Because the allies were winning it with less conventional artillery and with less range than my heaviest guns. Their DP guns have better range, however, and they can cause great trouble in artillery exchanges. You will experience this at Bataan, as the Japanese, if you try to have an artillery dual there. The Coastal Gun rake your forces unless you have every heavy artillery unit in the Japanese army there and use only the heaviest artillery (28 and 30 cm guns) in order to match range with the coastal guns.
No turn today, so I thought I would say a word about the Japanese economy.
I tend to a go slow approach to developing the Japanese economy. I do not schedule much late-war plane research at the start. I do not see the point. Most of those factories do not repair much in early 42. I put 4 factories on Frank, since I will do that no matter what happens. Whether I add more to Frank research, look for something else, or not do much R&D beyond the basics are decisions that I will make as the 42 progresses. I want to get a feel for how the war is going, what my opponent likes to do, and so forth, before I devise a plan for the air-war in the later game. (Of course, I have never had a chance to play the late war in a PBEM). I like Tony, but in a PDU:off game, it is hard to justify much research into Tony because there are fewer squadrons of Tonies than Tojos or Franks. Since this is PDU:Off, obviously, I have already converted factories over to R&D into the A6M line and the Oscar line. What I do beyond that and Judies, I have not yet decided. If I decide to put a little R&D into Tony, I need to make that decision very soon, since those factories will begin repairing at a good rate in March.
I do a little adding to the light industry, like most Japanese players, since Japan has a few extra resources, and I convert about 300 merchant ship yards to naval shipyards in order to accelerate some ships. The CVEs use merchant ship capacity, so some remains for those and for the tankers and oilers. I turned off most of the cargo-ship production, but I still have enough merchant shipyard capacity to turn some back on later if need be. I micro-manage ship production (as much as it can be micro-managed), reviewing it once a month or so and making sure that my pools are used: accelerating (or turning production back on for) a few extra ships every time resources free up. I increased vehicle production, like most Japanese players, though not quite as much as most. I have vehicle production set at 180 at the moment. I will use the old model medium tanks for the moment and upgrade at some point in the future when I may have to fight allied armor. I upgraded most of my armored cars to light tanks, and tracker has been angry with me about my vehicle production.
I also go rather light on air production, at least to start. I can always add a little more later where I need to. So far, in this game, China has required no supply (the 50K at Hong Kong has kept the whole theater positive for the moment). So without a large number of aircraft production expansion, most of my starting supply went to shipyard conversions and light industry. I did not use all of the starting supply: only half in fact. Where is the rest going? Forward. Japan will produce more supply if I want to add to the economy in the future. Forward bases will not. Better to get as much supply forward now, with U.S. torpedos thudding off my ships rather than exploding than later.
Finally, a question for Lowpe and the others who have managed this trick. How do you get all the resources out of Korea and Manchuka through Fusan? I have never been able to achieve this feat and have always wondered how people do it. And How do you get all the excess resources from China to flow into Korea? I have also never been able to manage this feat?
and my post in the linked thread which specifically deals with how demand for fuel is determined.
Alfred
Thanks for the link Alfred. I never read that whole discussion before. Ironically, that is basically what I do, so I guess I discovered it independently. I never really thought of it as a "magic highway," however. The bulk of my resources go through Fusan, but I have always supplemented it by using another port. I think the reason that I always find that I have to use another port is because I never expanded Fusan beyond size 6 before. I will have to think on this. Any idea how much supply is used in expanding Fusan from size 6 to 8? Seems as though it might just be a trade of supply for fuel.
Of course, I will not disclose what other port I use. Bob will have to figure that out for himself if I continue to use another port. At the moment his subs are focused on the area west of Japan, where he has found some cargo ships. Why has he found cargo TFs west of Japan... well... let's just say that replacements arrive much quicker when a depleted unit is surrounded by 5 or 6 bases with 25K supply. Hence... the moving starting supplies "forward."
Bob continues to be very cagey with his PT boats. He likes the PT boat, coastal gun, heavy minefield combination and uses it to good effect at every opportunity. He even asked me about how to make more PT boats, and we learned that they do not become available until Jan. 42. So now that he has learned this, there will be more PT boats, I assume.
He had stationed a group of PT boats at Balikpapan. I sent in a group of TB to contend with them, and he coyly moved the PT boats out just before the TBs arrived, leaving the TBs wandering around in the minefield. 2 hit mines.
TF 57 encounters mine field at Balikpapan (64,97)
Japanese Ships
TB Kamo, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
TB Hato, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
A Dutch sub finished off one of the crippled TBs later that night.
Submarine attack near Balikpapan at 64,97
Japanese Ships
TB Kamo, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
Allied Ships
SS KX
TB Kamo is sighted by SS KX
SS KX launches 2 torpedoes
A Japanese sub spotted the allied PT boats leaving later in the night. So very well played.
ASW attack near Balikpapan at 63,100
Japanese Ships
SS I-159
Allied Ships
PT Q-113
PT Q-112
PT-33
MTB 9
SS I-159 is sighted by escort
Sub escapes detection
