The Next War 1979 Expanded ( Beta 1.0 ) Damon v. larry

[larryfulkerson]

I was expecting supply problems in Italy but I've checked out the supply bubble numbers and they look just fine for further operations. So I'm driving the boys west as fast as they can go considering the resistance so far. I'm wondering if the troops on the far lower left are in reorg or something....they haven't moved lately and I'm wondering why. They could be building an MLR or something.

[mussey]

Those Mad Hungarians are in the forefront. Drive on!

[larryfulkerson]

New moves from Damon and you can see how he has made several inroads, penetrations of my front lines and has landed several units in my backfield again. I'm going to have to really think about this situation to see if I can salvage anything. This is a pretty good game.

[Hellen_slith]

Yes, interesting indeed! Next War is a dynamic scenario in that it can go so many different ways, with all the different events that are built in.

Couple thoughts as we are nearing the finish line:

I read today on some old TOAW blog that "Victory Points don't matter until the end." For me as NATO in this game, I tried valiantly to get enough VP to get beyond a draw, but NATO has just too much of a hard time of it, even w/ the Pact surrenders that happened. What I really need now is to get into Praha to get the Magyars to surrender, but that is beyond the realm of possibility at this point.

Down south, I forgot to dig in or do anything at all w/ the Italians on my turn 13 ... my mistake. Easy to forget those guys b/c of the focus on WG map. I'm not sure what the conditions are for an Italian surrender (occupation of Turin, maybe, for a dice roll?) but, in the spirit of beta testing, I would like to see the effects of an Italian surrender (e.g., just to make sure the Italians are withdrawn, and not the French LoL!!) if you get into Turin or whichever hex it is that triggers that event.

Another observation: seems like, b/c I managed to keep Pact to the East far enough and long enough, some events that should have triggered more NATO reinforcements seemed not to happen for me. That is, seems like if NATO keeps Pact at bay and far enough to the east, then NATO does not get some reinforcements. Some formations I sorely missed that I saw come into play in the Hot Seat Austrian play I did prior to this go:

more US Marines (beyond that 2d Marine that I do have), and

the US 101 Air Assault did not deploy ... I *really* could have used those guys in this play, and was counting on them from about turn 8, but ... they still have not shown up.

Seems like a double-edged sword in this one if NATO does even marginally well, then NATO reinforcements get ham strung. Which is OK, but only if it does not overbalance too much toward Pact.

Geting back to that adage about "VP do not count until the end of the game ... " I can foresee perhaps a way to "game" the NATO reinforcement schedule by keeping Pact back while it builds up steam with its (already) massive SSR districts, then going for a final blitz push in the last few turns with all its got.

That's a fair strategy, but (IMHO) might put NATO at too much of a disadvantage. Perhaps a timer also might alleviate that a bit, e.g., even if Event X does not trigger 101st Airborne, then timer triggers their deployment by turn 12 or 13? Just brainstorming, but I thought it might be worth considering.

Anyway, Comrade Larry: I am hard pressed to bring any more troops to Munich or Italy. I am beginning to think those areas are going to turn the tide in your favor. You are much closer to victory than I am at this point.

With only a few turns left, and being now in such dire straits, I may have to consider Operation Unthinkable (j/k that would cost me 100VP and those, I cannot spare. I thought that around turn 8 or so, I would have an easy victory, but you have shown that NATO has a much harder row to hoe than I thought.

Well played!!!

[mussey]

Italian surrender (occupation of Turin, maybe, for a dice roll?) but, in the spirit of beta testing, I would like to see the effects of an Italian surrender (e.g., just to make sure the Italians are withdrawn,

The key to a possible Italian surrender is Milan, 50% chance.

The only Events that affect NATO reinforcements are the Battle of the Atlantic. On the first turn of war there are odds of 1) no NATO reinforcements (by sea transport), 2) 2-week delay, 3) 1-week delay, 4) no delay. This should be in your News Summary. US land units arriving by sea deploy much later and are affected by this. Check your OOB and see when they arrive, let me know if this is broken. [The next Beta will add several Natl Gd units, and the 12th USAF of 485 aircraft. Also several UK home defense bdes].

The Soviet Military Districts of Kiev and Odessa, most probably would have deployed against Greece and Turkey via Bulgaria, which is not included in this scenario. In a two-player game I think these should be negotiated as to whether they should be allowed to be used. [In a future Beta, I may tie them to VP's].

[Also in the next Beta, increased Objective Values and VP's for Norway, reflecting the importance their ports/bases would have been to their Northern Fleet, ie Narvik. In the south, the possibility that Yugoslavia will join the Warsaw Pact.]

[Hellen_slith]

ORIGINAL: mussey

Italian surrender (occupation of Turin, maybe, for a dice roll?) but, in the spirit of beta testing, I would like to see the effects of an Italian surrender (e.g., just to make sure the Italians are withdrawn,

The key to a possible Italian surrender is Milan, 50% chance.

The only Events that affect NATO reinforcements are the Battle of the Atlantic....

There are also other events that can affect NATO reinforcements ... off the top of my head, I know that Pact occupation of certain REFORGER hexes will delay or prevent NATO US reinforcements. Can't remember which hexes they are, I would have to check.

Also, in the NATO orbat, there are units whose appearance seem to be determined by "event?" (at least that's what I'm seeing for some formations). I'm not at my TOAW computer, can't check at the moment, but that's why I was wondering if Pact has to move farther west to trigger some of those. Not sure. I'm probably wrong about that, I haven't dug deep enough into it, but it does say in some formations that "event?" is waiting to happen for them to show up.

Will post a screen shot of what I'm seeing in that regard.

Anyway, glad to see Yugoslavia will be a part of it. Will the map be expanded more? This is really a fun scene! Ok, well, back to the board!

[Hellen_slith]

Thoughts from the finish line (under tornado warning here ATM, so briefly:)

Perhaps I should surrender Munich, and use these last few moves to rail the Italians back to Italy?

What a game. Comrade Larry has firmly seized the initiative now, and NATO has shot its bolt.

Looking forward to the finish! Hopefully, I can still hold the draw (although I would like to see a victory screen, and not a draw screen, whether for Pact or NATO.)

Another reason to push the game beyond 17 combat turns? Ok, well, we shall see!!
H

[larryfulkerson]

New moves from Damon and I've cleared out most of the backfield troubles and the press is on again to the west. There are spots that I feel are weaker than other spots and I just need to find them and press hard at that spot. I'm thinking of massing the arty to one spot and really just bombard my way forward. I'm looking at the front lines and I think maybe the best thing would be to press near the middle to see if I can't break a hole there and roll up the NATO lines north and south. It's worth a try. I've had a look at the reports for this turn and I think it's 20 turns remaining. I could be wrong.

[larryfulkerson]

Here's a closeup of the area SW of Berlin. I'm seeing all these stacks of NATO units when most of the units holding my side of the front lines are single-unit stacks, mostly armour or motorized. The supply level is outstanding despite all the broken bridges. Damon has a lot of arty backing up his troops and I see more than one HQ unit right up at the front. I'll attack those hexes first, to see if I can't drive that entire formation into reorg. I've been doing three-dot attacks to get enough juice to move the NATO unit(a) out of the hex. I think I can afford the losses.

I've moved about 20% of the units so far. I'm not getting very many RBC's. I don't think I have enough units to surround a very large group of NATO units, but I would like to get a probe started somewhere. I need to find his weak spot(s). I've got some units trapped behind Damon's lines and they are running really low on supply and their proficiency is dropping.

[larryfulkerson]

This is a spot in the Wurzburg area and I've just noticed by accident that my polish paratroopers can be replaced in the front lines, can move to the airfield occupied by the HQ of the paratroopers, and be ready to drop in an LZ somewhere in Damon's backfield. Maybe drop some bridges and convert the rail to friendly just so he has to repair it to use it again. All the Polish paratroopers are expendable and they know it. I'm wondering if I can't just set up a strong point somewhere in Damon's backfield that would be difficult to dislodge. Italy Is in the final stages of falling....I could drop the Polish paratroopers in Italy to accellerate the takedown. And then head toward France.

[larryfulkerson]

This is a spot in the Wurzburg area and I've just noticed by accident that my polish paratroopers can be replaced in the front lines, can move to the airfield occupied by the HQ of the paratroopers, and be ready to drop in an LZ somewhere in Damon's backfield next turn. Maybe drop some bridges and convert the rail to friendly just so he has to repair it to use it again. All the Polish paratroopers are expendable and they know it. I'm wondering if I can't just set up a strong point somewhere in Damon's backfield that would be difficult to dislodge. Italy is in the final stages of falling....I could drop the Polish paratroopers in Italy to accellerate the takedown. And then head toward France.

[mussey]

to drop in an LZ somewhere in Damon's backfield next turn.

Not sure what Denmark looks like, but there are some VP's to be gained if it surrenders...

[StuccoFresco]

Pic of the Italian front?

[larryfulkerson]

A pic of the Italian front coming right up.

[StuccoFresco]

Thanks. This... is a disaster, I missed the part where the Italian front was shattered that way, I was under the impression that the situation was rather static.

Where did you break through? By sheer force through the mountain passes?

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: StuccoFresco

Thanks. This... is a disaster, I missed the part where the Italian front was shattered that way, I was under the impression that the situation was rather static.

Where did you break through? By sheer force through the mountain passes?

I have the impression that the Italian defenders are in reorg or garrison mode or no MP's or something because they don't seem to move from turn to turn. Which makes my takedown a LOT easier. I started my drive from the right side avenues and have been driving to the west for about 15 turns now. I'm trying to keep the railroad behind me repaired to allow for supply flow and I'm about 1/2 way through my invasion of Italy. I'm hoping to capture Turin and cause the Italian surrender. And I'm planning on trying to invade France after that. On the other hand it would disrupt NATO a lot if I just drove north from the western coast of Italy. I'll check out the terrain and see what's possible.

[larryfulkerson]

New moves from Damon and you can see how I've cleaned out my backfield and now the advance can continue to the west. I'm going to try to clean out Italy and keep moving to France.

[Hellen_slith]

You might have better luck putting those paratroops on helos ... at least, I always do. If you want France, you better hurry. I think there is only one or two turns left, if the engine works like it did in the Austrian hot seat game. Well played, Larry!

[Hellen_slith]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

ORIGINAL: StuccoFresco

Thanks. This... is a disaster, I missed the part where the Italian front was shattered that way, I was under the impression that the situation was rather static.

Where did you break through? By sheer force through the mountain passes?

it would disrupt NATO a lot if I just drove north from the western coast of Italy. I'll check out the terrain and see what's possible.

Using the bypass hexes will cause the game to end, or at least it used to. I think it is called the Geneva bypass (that little strip there around the other exclusion zone.)

At any rate, the game should end in the next turn or two....assuming the event engine is working.

[Hellen_slith]

ORIGINAL: StuccoFresco

This... is a disaster

Indeed. The Poles should have been withdrawn, but the engine did not see it that way.

Now I know how the Junkers felt when von Papen and Streicher and Hindenburg conspired ....

Politics, man, Politics. But that's what makes this scene so much fun!!

By my calculation, the game should end at the end of NATO 18 ... w/ a Pact MV. I am eager to see the splash screen.

Well, we shall see!! Good game, Larry!!