Ridiculous

[Onime No Kyo]

I think what this argument is boiling down to is that things like Midway just shouldnt happen. Funny thing is, history, military and otherwise, is built upon heaps of "divine interventions" like this. From one commander mistiming something by a few hours, to some confluence of events that leaves an enemy with an open flnk at just the right moment, things like these are all over the place. I think that most of us take completely for granted that Gettysburg, Watterloo and the like could have easily gone completely the other way if the same things that happened historically occured in a different order or a half hour earlier (for example).

On that note, I think few would argue that things such as these should be modelled in a game of this type, despite the fact that it could easliy be said that they are what military history is really made of. Even if it were possible to program such details in, I dont think that many of us would be thrilled if something like what happened to poor Rob occured with any sort of frequency although the "history books" can easily say that "the entire US strike force was led off course by a faulty compass in the lead plane" (or something completely silly of that sort).

On the other hand, WitP is still only a set of routines one or a few of which is obviously not doing what it was intended to do. I think that the goal here should be to find and fix the bugs if at all possible, not to make the damn thing do exactly what we expect it to do.

Just my 2 cents.

[hithere]

I think you made a good point.

If the game would be that predictable, why play. in reality, admirals and generals encountered and overcame things that did not go their way all the time. I think someone said (maybe in this very thread!! it is so long i am not going back to find it) that if the japanese were playing this game in 1942 and had a midway, they would have called it a bug, that they were destined to win the battle. there is just no way that they could have lost. but guess what, they did. and it was real.

no one goes into battle expecting to lose (well, there are cases, but you know what i mean). it kills me, and not to slam anyone, but it kills me that people do things different than what happened in history, but expect the same results. or that they change their battle plans completly, but expect their enemy to "stay the course" and to react historically. If i stepped on any toes i def do not intend too. I, like everyone, have gotten some crap airbattles, ship engagments, and such. but then i say, war sux, and drive on. everything that does not go my way is not a bug.


I don't think that any game, (or program period) is going to be able to sim the strange, unbelievable things that happen in real life. it is to random and unpredictable. but i think this game does a pretty good job.

well, if you have made it to here...you are a dedicated person. have a nice day [:)]

[Mike Scholl]

ORIGINAL: Mogami

Hi, Dispite all the advance warning and intell at Midway where the USN had 3 CV the strike that did in the Japanese was an unescorted (for all practical purpose in WITP terms) strike from just a fraction of the available CV aircraft.
I think WITP/UV sometimes makes it too hard to damage enemy CV since CAP is more effective in the game that it appears to have been in actual practice.
Midway was a series of disjointed US strikes that still got the job done. The IJN response was from 1 CV and it scored hits with 2 strikes. (These strikes slowed the Yorktown down enough for IJN sub to finish the job)
I shudder to think what might have happend if Nagumo had just kept the reserve aircraft armed for counter strike and had been able to launch. It would have been a 100+ plane strike. (And his CV would have been less vunerable when USN strike arrived. )
You really can't do a Midway battle in WITP without one of the players setting his groups to missions other then Naval Strike and then being caught by enemy CV.

Isn't that just what I said? The Japanese stepped on their own d--ks in just about every
concievable manner during the campaign, while the US got it right more often than not.
The Japanese PLAN said the US CV's COULD NOT be close to Midway, so Kido Butai
went in with Port and Airfield strikes planned. They were understrength, both from
Coral Sea damage and from splitting their carriers up all over the Pacific. Their air
search was a niggardly effort of odds and sods. The went "cruisin' for a bruisin'" and
got it. In game terms it's an unlikely outcome because players don't usually make
the same kind of mistakes..., but in real life the Japs messed up pretty thoroughly.