Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee, Docup(A)-Koniu(J)

[koniu]

ORIGINAL: obvert
Your HI is great. If anything save up supply.

Supply are my concern also.
Empire currently have 3,1M supply. When Empire will calapse i am almost sure it will be caused by supply. Lucky i am still able so build my reserve, ~4000 is saved every day. If i manage to keep that for few more months i should somehow survive.

I am not plan to expending more factories. Only some NF still repairing and Ha-43 engines need to be build but i will spreed that during next months.

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: koniu

ORIGINAL: obvert
Your HI is great. If anything save up supply.

Supply are my concern also.
Empire currently have 3,1M supply. When Empire will calapse i am almost sure it will be caused by supply. Lucky i am still able so build my reserve, ~4000 is saved every day. If i manage to keep that for few more months i should somehow survive.

I am not plan to expending more factories. Only some NF still repairing and Ha-43 engines need to be build but i will spreed that during next months.

One thing to think about is voluntarily constricting your empire as time goes on. I wish I'd done this earlier. Not to say you don't fight battles forward, but maybe you don't feed forward bases that are simply holding spots, not fortresses. Keep a garrison so he has to invade, but know the garrison is not meant to survive, just stall.

It's a very thin line that I managed to leap to the wrong side of with one catastrophic choice in Burma (simply walking down the wrong road in retreat), sinking my entire army into a quagmire of defeat. But, and this is a new revelation, I might not have been able to feed that distant army had it survived now after the HI bombings, plus all of the other troops I've voluntarily pulled back as a result. So it's loss is not necessarily all bad, as the constriction that made necessary has helped the inner defenses become more stable. At least that's what I'm telling myself these days! [;)]

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: koniu
Empire currently have 3,1M supply.

So, you are little behind my schedule. My typical game plan would have me at about 4M Q4Y43. My typical target is for about 6M 6/44.

This can vary quite abit based upon my strategy in the game. If I go for Calcutta, that can frequently net me 1M supply which is why I go there. [;)] Once I netted 500K supply from Ceylon (and almost 250K fuel). That was a nice surprise.

Anyway, you're not that far off. You're prolly saving ~10K supply/day now. So end of year should put you close to 4M supply.

[koniu]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

ORIGINAL: koniu
Empire currently have 3,1M supply.

So, you are little behind my schedule. My typical game plan would have me at about 4M Q4Y43. My typical target is for about 6M 6/44.

This can vary quite abit based upon my strategy in the game. If I go for Calcutta, that can frequently net me 1M supply which is why I go there. [;)] Once I netted 500K supply from Ceylon (and almost 250K fuel). That was a nice surprise.

Anyway, you're not that far off. You're prolly saving ~10K supply/day now. So end of year should put you close to 4M supply.

I start supply saving program.
I stop building most of AFs and forts. I left building only those in critical places like Marianas etc. I still have ~600.000 supply to spend (R&D and expand of Ha-43)
It should allow me to save 8-10k supply daily at lest i hope that

I also stop feeding, like Obvert was suggesting, all those units that are not planed to give resistance to enemy. I only give them enough to keep them alive before enemy show up.
Time to start saving and not only pretending that i am saving

[PaxMondo]

AF/Fort building doesn't consume all that much. Be sure to build where you need to.

If you have units that are not part of the planned resistance, move them to where they are part of the plan.

Just my thoughts ...

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

AF/Fort building doesn't consume all that much. Be sure to build where you need to.

If you have units that are not part of the planned resistance, move them to where they are part of the plan.

Just my thoughts ...

I've been looking for the document that lists forts and cost per level. Isn't it about 20k to build from level 5 to 6 forts, and even higher above that? Just going from memory, so I might be wrong.

Also, how much does it cost in supply to fly per day? Is it 1 point per engine? More if using drop tanks? All of these things are fuzzy in my head but might be useful to know these days.

EDIT: Found some numbers from Alfred's 101.

(D.2) Cost of air missions

Each sortie flown consumes supply. Lack the requisite supply, the air mission is not flown. The actual supply cost depends on the type of mission flown and the type of plane as follows:

• Offensive Mission flown by a Level Bomber, the cost is (Maximum Load/1000) per plane
• Offensive Mission flown by a Dive Bomb or Torpedo, the cost is 1 supply point per plane
• Other missions such as Search and CAP expend only 1/3 of a supply point per plane So CAP is only about 7 points a day for the big 49 plane units at 40% CAP. Another thing though that might be sapping supply is all of the training planes. As 10 plane training groups arrive I'l begin phasing out other training groups, especially float planes.


What's killing me lately is the stuff below! [Replacement cost]

I had no idea it cost more to get a recon/NF plane than something else, even if that is a single engine plane. Wonder why? [&:]

• 12 supply points for fighter, fighter bomber
• 15 supply points for dive bomber, torpedo bomber, float plane, float fighter
• 18 supply points for night fighter, recon
• 30 supply points for heavy bomber, medium bomber, light bomber, attack bomber, transport, patrol

[JocMeister]

No wonder my 4Es drink supply like there is no tomorrow! [X(] Kind of explains why I have to keep some bases at 500k supply to get the 4Es to fly. Havn´t payed too much attention to supply and what's using it. Good info here!

Erik, you last paragraph, is that a fixed cost for each plane type to perform any kind of mission?

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

No wonder my 4Es drink supply like there is no tomorrow! [X(] Kind of explains why I have to keep some bases at 500k supply to get the 4Es to fly. Havn´t payed too much attention to supply and what's using it. Good info here!

Erik, you last paragraph, is that a fixed cost for each plane type to perform any kind of mission?

All from Alfred's Logistics guide. Amazing how we can play through years of game and not really know these basics! [:)] Unless we have to, like I do now.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2878790&mpage=1&key=logistics%2C101%26%2365533%3B

The last lines are replacements costs. To fill out groups after losses or upgrades.

Your 4E costs would be above.

Max load (ie 8000) / 1000 per plane. So for say, hmmm, well maybe, 400 4E? Yeah, that's a lot of supply. [:)]

So 8000/1000 = 8 x 400 = 3200. Per day.

[JocMeister]

ORIGINAL: obvert

The last lines are replacements costs. To fill out groups after losses or upgrades.

Your 4E costs would be above.

Max load (ie 8000) / 1000 per plane. So for say, hmmm, well maybe, 400 4E? Yeah, that's a lot of supply. [:)]

So 8000/1000 = 8 x 400 = 3200. Per day.

No wonder I burn a couple of hundred thousand per month! [X(] Good thing there is plenty around! [:D]

[koniu]

25-26 Oct 43


Supplies
Supply save program is giving first resouilts. In last two days empire manage to save 17.000 supplies

Burma
On 25 we have air battle over Lashio. Allies lost 19 P-47, 12 P-38, 6 F4U and 30 2E bombers. I return i lost 75 fighters(51 a2a) and 20 pilots.

Morning Air attack on 143rd Infantry Regiment, at 62,46 (Lashio)

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 41 NM, estimated altitude 4,000 feet. Oops wrong altitude[:D]
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 40
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 29
Ki-84a Frank x 77

Allied aircraft
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 25

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K2-J George: 2 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-47D2 Thunderbolt: 5 destroyed

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on 143rd Infantry Regiment, at 62,46 (Lashio)

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 29 NM, estimated altitude 5,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 30
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 25
Ki-84a Frank x 67

Allied aircraft
B-25C Mitchell x 16
B-25D1 Mitchell x 16

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 3 destroyed, 8 damaged
B-25D1 Mitchell: 9 destroyed, 2 damaged
B-25D1 Mitchell: 1 destroyed by flak

Japanese ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on 23rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment, at 62,46 (Lashio)

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 33 NM, estimated altitude 8,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 27
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 8
Ki-84a Frank x 65

Allied aircraft
B-25G Mitchell x 16

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
B-25G Mitchell: 3 destroyed, 6 damaged

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on 23rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment, at 62,46 (Lashio)

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 23 NM, estimated altitude 6,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 22
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 3
Ki-84a Frank x 41

Allied aircraft
B-25D1 Mitchell x 13

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K2-J George: 1 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
B-25D1 Mitchell: 7 destroyed, 2 damaged


---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lashio , at 62,46

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 46 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 10
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 1
Ki-84a Frank x 31

Allied aircraft
P-38G Lightning x 25

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K2-J George: 3 destroyed
Ki-44-IIc Tojo: 1 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-38G Lightning: 5 destroyed

---------------------------------------------

Afternoon Air attack on Lashio , at 62,46

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid detected at 27 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 29
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 23
Ki-84a Frank x 62

Allied aircraft
F4U-1 Corsair x 17

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K2-J George: 3 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 6 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F4U-1 Corsair: 3 destroyed

---------------------------------------------

Afternoon Air attack on Lashio , at 62,46

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 31 NM, estimated altitude 39,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K2-J George x 11
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 16
Ki-84a Frank x 45

Allied aircraft
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 25

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K2-J George: 2 destroyed
Ki-44-IIc Tojo: 3 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 4 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-47D2 Thunderbolt: 1 destroyed


There where two ground attacks in Lashio. First almost end with capturing Lashio but on 26 Japan gain small victory. Lashio have now 150AV behind fort 4. I will move small tank unit to give some firepower. I hope to hold Lashio for few more days. Right now Docup dont have enough power to do that. Bad news is that road connection between Burma and China is now open for allies.

Ground combat at Lashio (62,46)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 10619 troops, 66 guns, 376 vehicles, Assault Value = 427

Defending force 3666 troops, 67 guns, 29 vehicles, Assault Value = 61

Allied engineers reduce fortifications to 4

Allied adjusted assault: 159

Japanese adjusted defense: 133

Allied assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 4)

Allied Assault reduces fortifications to 4

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), preparation(-), experience(-)
supply(-)
Attacker: shock(+), disruption(-)

Japanese ground losses:
347 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 24 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 10 (5 destroyed, 5 disabled)
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
344 casualties reported
Squads: 8 destroyed, 25 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled

And second attack

Ground combat at Lashio (62,46)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 10403 troops, 66 guns, 376 vehicles, Assault Value = 400

Defending force 7071 troops, 88 guns, 28 vehicles, Assault Value = 163

Allied adjusted assault: 98

Japanese adjusted defense: 1498

Allied assault odds: 1 to 15 (fort level 4)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), disruption(-), preparation(-)
experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+), disruption(-)

Japanese ground losses:
359 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 22 disabled
Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Vehicles lost 6 (5 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Units destroyed 1

Allied ground losses:
1222 casualties reported
Squads: 95 destroyed, 45 disabled [:D]
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 20 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 5 disabled
Guns lost 10 (1 destroyed, 9 disabled)
Vehicles lost 10 (1 destroyed, 9 disabled)

R&D
Ki-84r Frank advance to 10/44
D4Y4 Judy advance to 7/44
P1Y2 advance to 11/43

Air combat reports
Or i am blind or game stop showing on what altitude enemy planes are sweeping
During last battles only altitude information in combat report was estimated altitude detected by radar.
I telling here about info like that:

Aircraft Attacking:
18 x F4U-1 Corsair sweeping at 31000 feet

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: obvert

[I had no idea it cost more to get a recon/NF plane than something else, even if that is a single engine plane. Wonder why? [&:]

• 12 supply points for fighter, fighter bomber
• 15 supply points for dive bomber, torpedo bomber, float plane, float fighter
• 18 supply points for night fighter, recon
• 30 supply points for heavy bomber, medium bomber, light bomber, attack bomber, transport, patrol

NF/recon have the larger crews and more complicated radio/radar/guns and most are 2E (but not all) as compared to TB or DB. It about maintenance of finicky equipment.

remember these are just average groupings ...

[obvert]

Air combat reports
Or i am blind or game stop showing on what altitude enemy planes are sweeping
During last battles only altitude information in combat report was estimated altitude detected by radar.
I telling here about info like that:

Aircraft Attacking:
18 x F4U-1 Corsair sweeping at 31000 feet

I've noticed the game usually does this, but not always when the sweeps are highly contested and not many planes make it 'through.' Whatever that is, it seems to register when some are left from the main conflict.

Amazing the P-47s still downed some of your planes even coming in at <4k in the first sweep.

[koniu]

ORIGINAL: obvert

Amazing the P-47s still downed some of your planes even coming in at <4k in the first sweep.

P-47 is excellent plane. Even at 4000ft he is 37mph faster from Frank and i am sure Docup is using 80XP pilots when i am using 70-60XP mix.

When i watch replay again i count 15 P-47 downed for five Japanese planes so 3:1.
All Japanese planes where lost when P-47 manage to avoid dive and counterattacked.
Also i checked pilots and those who die or get wounded during day have XP 60 or lower.

If we look at what happen in that single battle i am watching at Symon database modification with high expectations. Making dive less important and balancing that with plane stats and pilot quality will make a2a duels more realistic and balanced

[witpqs]

Making dive less important and balancing that with plane stats and pilot quality will make a2a duels more realistic and balanced

Symon/JWE's improvements do not make 'the dive' less important.

BTW, why would doing that make A2A more realistic?

[koniu]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Making dive less important and balancing that with plane stats and pilot quality will make a2a duels more realistic and balanced

Symon/JWE's improvements do not make 'the dive' less important.

BTW, why would doing that make A2A more realistic?

I have something else in mind.
Dive bonus is and should be important , but right now when You have dive with plane like P-47 Japanese player is screwed from moment combat start to moment it end even if using best planes with 80XP pilots.

If i understand good, Symon is trying to make a2a engagement little less dive dependent but still keep it very important, and move some focus on second part of combat when most of dives end and big dogfight starts. In my understanding he want things like speed, maneuverability, climb and pilots skill having bigger impact on results.

What i see when i look at changers he make is that allied planes are overall better from Japanese as they should be. Specially with speed and operational altitudes but when fight is going lower and lower Japanese planes gain some advantage in maneuverability and they can have decent fight with allied planes especially when have good pilots.

So in summary when battle is fight high allied planes have huge advantage as they should but lower Japanese planes reduce that advantage and they can figt with some good chances of success.

[koniu]

27-28 Oct 43

Quiet days. Docup moving reinforcement to Lashing. So am I. In other areas quiet.

R&D
I just find that Ki-67Ia(T) upgrades to Ki-67Ib. Good i found that now. It would be bad surprise if i allow upgrade factories to standard: level bomber.
Ki-67Ta(T) will be available in march `44

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: koniu

27-28 Oct 43

Quiet days. Docup moving reinforcement to Lashing. So am I. In other areas quiet.

R&D
I just find that Ki-67Ia(T) upgrades to Ki-67Ib. Good i found that now. It would be bad surprise if i allow upgrade factories to standard: level bomber.
Ki-67Ta(T) will be available in march `44

Yes, this happened to me!! I luckily had two set to not upgrade, so I can still make plenty of the (T) version, and the other is for dedicated kami groups and is just fine for that.

[koniu]

1 Nov 43

Game just enter November. Not much to report.
Small air battle over Aitape. I lost in air 30 Georges for 8 P-38, 1 P-47 and 10 Liberators. 40 more Georges lost on ground. Costly trip.

P1Y2 ener production replacing SR4 P1Y1.

[koniu]

Pilot pools

According to editor in `43 average XP of pilots after 12 month offmap training should be 35xp.
For almost last 12 months i have alweys 350 elite navy pilots in TRACOM.

You need to look at that. Two days ago i get massage:
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 102 pilots from month-cycle 3
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 396 pilots from month-cycle 2
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 416 pilots from month-cycle 1
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 562 pilots from month-cycle 0

Look at picture what pilots i am able to drain from pool

This is good and bad, not sure. Question is how good those pilots will train skill when they reach magical 50XP, and that will be fast

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: koniu

Pilot pools

According to editor in `43 average XP of pilots after 12 month offmap training should be 35xp.
For almost last 12 months i have alweys 350 elite navy pilots in TRACOM.

You need to look at that. Two days ago i get massage:
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 102 pilots from month-cycle 3
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 396 pilots from month-cycle 2
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 416 pilots from month-cycle 1
IJ Navy instructors accelerate training of 562 pilots from month-cycle 0

Look at picture what pilots i am able to drain from pool

This is good and bad, not sure. Question is how good those pilots will train skill when they reach magical 50XP, and that will be fast

That is incredible!!! I did have about 100 in TRACOM and it did get the IJAAF up to around 34-35, but for the IJN I've had extremely low pilot skill for a while.

Interesting that yours are getting so accelerated that they aren't even in the 7-9 month bracket at all, and only a few are in the 4-6 month area. It should reduce your HI cost a lot in 44 as well.

I think they will take about 15-20 days to get up to 55/60, and after that you'll basically want to train defensive skill and let em fly.