Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A)

[pauk]

hmph, not to trying to be devil advocats here. And, im not the one who sent warning PM to rader. Ofc, i sent rader PM advices and hints (what he could do and when) because i didnt feel its safe to do that publicitly [:'(].

Rader, do not allow that such interferences kill your's pleasure in the game (cause ive experienced that - and moderator locks my AAR because someone trolling me?! kudos to joewilkerson!!!!) .

While i'm enjoying Nemo's 121 posts,i feel its somewhat inappropriate to advise both sides knnowing each other's situation. But then again, its only me.

As far as I know, GJ and you are honourable players and both of you providing a great game. I encourage you to keep playing the game and update AAR (with delay, just in a case!)

[rader]

I'll be out of the loop for the next couple weeks (although I might ge the occasional turn in, I doubt I can post). My GF is coming up to visit for xmas and I've got lots of family stuff...

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: rader

My GF is coming up to visit for xmas and I've got lots of family stuff...

Congrats on that and MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!!

[Schlemiel]

I'm curious about the cost to naval pilots of this operation. It was certainly an excellent operational success, but will it hurt Rader's ability to project against a hypothetical invasion using the kb (with the pilot bug and Rader's inability to replace navy pilots properly)? I wouldn't necessarily divulge the information to this thread now, but long term I'd like to find that information out when it is no longer relevant.

[crsutton]

Very nice attack. Both you and GJ have aggressive original styles and it is making for one of the best AARs ever. You move was very bold and well executed. I have a million questions but they will have to wait until the game is wrapped up.

Merry Christmas.

[jeffk3510]

I, too have a zillion guestions. Excellent AARs... love following the game, as mentioned earlier.

[Cap Mandrake]

This is like Gojira v. Rodan. Perhaps dozens of ships and thousands of planes destroyed in one turn. I'd like to know who is going to pay for all this.

[krupp_88mm]

Rader on that we differ. I believe ANYONE going behind the scenes to say another forum member can't be trusted with a given answer is maligning them and doing so in the shadows ( which is even worse ). If I thought that someone couldn't be trusted with info I'd say so publicly since I think people have a right to know if they stand accused of something. Maybe they would disagree with me but at least I'd have done them the courtesy of letting them know their accuser and the accusation made.

You may view it differently, that's your right. Now to make it clear this is a load of utter bulls**t I'm going to withdraw from your and GJ's AARs so this "anonymous doer of goods through insinuating untrustworthiness in others" has no further ammunition for his PM asides. I'd thank you not to respond since I would prefer to not be drawn into further responses in this or GJ's AAR.

It might seem excessive to you but I take my integrity very seriously. YOu might think I'm an argumentative so and so or opinionated or contrary or whatever --- and if you do I don't really mind. I may or may not be any or all of those things, everyone's entitled to an opinion. But the one thing I won't stand for is having my integrity and honesty impugned. Anyways, feel free to PM me if you wish but ideally I'd prefer not to be made post here again in reply to a reply of yours. I trust my reason for seeking to show the baselesness through disengagement is clear.

nemo it wasnt me this time, but, ive only ever warned someone about one person doing this type of thing, and its always been you, ive had to warn others about you in previous games, you have a bad habit of giving information and advice to both sides, even if not direct leaks of information, you've given advice based on information you have privileged too, its very obvious form readign past aars, i try not to ever comment strategically unless i read only one side of an aar i think that should be standard until the games over, theres the cohones you wanted

I hope your not upset i just want to see a fair game, im not trying to hurt anyone, i just feel bad for someone who will put so much effort into providing me with entertainment only to have it shoot themselves in the foot

[desicat]

ORIGINAL: pauk


While i'm enjoying Nemo's 121 posts,i feel its somewhat inappropriate to advise both sides knnowing each other's situation. But then again, its only me.

As far as I know, GJ and you are honourable players and both of you providing a great game. I encourage you to keep playing the game and update AAR (with delay, just in a case!)

I didn't see anything in Nemo's questions for Rader that looked like advice. It looked to me like Nemo was looking for verification of the veracity of the strategy he offered GJ. I can understand Nemo's desire to get answers while the information is fresh in Rader's mind and "visible on the board". Given Nemo's history here it would be beyond ridiculous to think that he would take anything that Rader said and pass it on consciously to GJ.

Rader's reply was fair and safe, just not what Nemo was looking for IMHO.

Rader your counter was brilliant and makes the point that the Japanese don't just have to "Close their eyes and think of God and Country" when the Allied players gain the upper hand materially.

[desicat]

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

This is like Gojira v. Rodan. Perhaps dozens of ships and thousands of planes destroyed in one turn. I'd like to know who is going to pay for all this.

Who pays? Its in the script as well as the contracts - if you read them!

[rader]

Waiting for the GF to show up...

Guys, can't we all just get along? [:)] Nemo was being perfectly reasonable in asking, I am just a bit squemish about going into detail on that particular subject.

Anyways, feel free to ask questions and I'll probably answer them. I just don't want to give detailed information on the current status of Japanese industry just when Greyjoy is trying to rip it appart. If there wasn't a strat bombing campaign on, I'd feel more comfortable about divulging the details. And let me be clear: I certainly don't think anyone is going to go and report what I say to Greyjoy. I just don't want the fact that detailed information about the current status of my industry is floating out there in the public domain to impact advice Greyjoy recieves (from anyone, not just the person asking).

[JohnDillworth]

I don't know Nemo but I have been following GJ AAR from the beginning. Nemo will freely admit he offered much advise to GJ but his behavior has been exemplary throughout the AAR.His tone may not be to everyone's liking, but he would never leak information.
my 2 cents

[JeffroK]

ORIGINAL: rader

I'll be out of the loop for the next couple weeks (although I might ge the occasional turn in, I doubt I can post). My GF is coming up to visit for xmas and I've got lots of family stuff...

Bllody Hell, GJ has a lot to learn from you about Girlfriends!!

[jeffk3510]

Agreed JD

[JeffroK]

I think an answer is to what depth do you give help/comment.
 
Hopefully I have avoided specifics (unless Cable Beach is invaded next week) and hopefully jogged memory into following the right processes so that the right strategy can be followed. Its not hard to get out of good practises as was shown by GJ not CAPing his ports.
 
But if too much detailed information is given, or detailed advice/plans helped with, I would suggest making a wide gap before even viewing the other AAR.
 
I think owners of AAR should drop a line or a hint if they feel things are getting carried away, or their opinions not wanted[:D]
 
Problem is the AARs have become entertainment and everyone wants to have their say, and everyone is their own expert.
 
Merry Christmas too all, I'll probably be putting up with a hot meal in 30C+ temps, I would like to try a white christmas at least once[8D]

[bigred]

I'll probably be putting up with a hot meal in 30C+ temps, I would like to try a white christmas at least once.

Jeff, merry Christmas to you and all your men..

[Crackaces]

ORIGINAL: JeffK

I think an answer is to what depth do you give help/comment.

Hopefully I have avoided specifics (unless Cable Beach is invaded next week) and hopefully jogged memory into following the right processes so that the right strategy can be followed. Its not hard to get out of good practises as was shown by GJ not CAPing his ports.

But if too much detailed information is given, or detailed advice/plans helped with, I would suggest making a wide gap before even viewing the other AAR.

I think owners of AAR should drop a line or a hint if they feel things are getting carried away, or their opinions not wanted[:D]

Problem is the AARs have become entertainment and everyone wants to have their say, and everyone is their own expert.

.......[8D]

I think there is one other factor going on .. this particular campaign game has taken an interest like no other. So the human reaction is to want to be a part of the action. At spectator sports we dress up in our favorite teams colors and cheer . in games we kibitz .. the AAR gives an inviting forum for kibitzing ..in particular GreyJoy is quite a cordial in keeping that kibitzing going .. but he has danced to his own tune since day one and I bet if he solicited advice to invade Hokkaido .. most if not all would have been against it .. One really funny thing. Most of the advice is from that person's perspective not seeing the whole big picture of the game. For example, because it is a two turn game certain software behaviors become very apparent that unless you master the two turn game .. it is very bad advice ..

Most of the advice like crusutton and ny59giants as well as Alfred early was about little nuances in the game. Things that trip one up that are not in the manual. Then there is Canoerebel who simply reminds GreyJoy the power of the Allies after Rader gets a great turn.

Now I take Nemo as a wargaming scientist with a tremendous amount of curosity ... the situation at Hokkaido presents a very unique set of challanges and opportunites that has multiple solutions. More so, we might not ever come this way again. Nemo is just extermely curious if in WitP AE the Allied player gets 4E & 2E bombers within range whether a focused effort on currently producing aricraft industry is not more the solution than the attack of future stuff. Thus he felt comfortable to open a conversation about it ... not everybody is in the same boat .. it makes us unique as humans ... chess has the same environment.... those that collobroate to understand the perfect moves given a situation and those that are all about grand master points ...

I am in the same boat in my game .. it is not about winning per se but understanding the dynamics of a situation within the game. For example, I frequently exchange information with my "adversary" about results and software behaviors otherwise how would one know how the game really works? [;)] Because unlike chess ....Opsec is such a part of the game I also keep some secrecy to make it interesting .. to each there own .

I think Rader is on the same quest but I sense it is "what is the IJ strategy to win this damn game? Does it exist? Is it more forces? Is the rules just borked and the Allies too strong?" within the constraints of a fair contest. [Rader is not thinking Ironman scenrario against to 5 year old [:D]]

I just thought I would follow up on this post to bring out this perspective ... N=1 ...

Back to the war Rader ...

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: rader

Waiting for the GF to show up...

Guys, can't we all just get along? [:)] Nemo was being perfectly reasonable in asking, I am just a bit squemish about going into detail on that particular subject.

Anyways, feel free to ask questions and I'll probably answer them. I just don't want to give detailed information on the current status of Japanese industry just when Greyjoy is trying to rip it appart. If there wasn't a strat bombing campaign on, I'd feel more comfortable about divulging the details. And let me be clear: I certainly don't think anyone is going to go and report what I say to Greyjoy. I just don't want the fact that detailed information about the current status of my industry is floating out there in the public domain to impact advice Greyjoy recieves (from anyone, not just the person asking).

Seems perfectly wise to me, rader. Very reasonable precaution.

Nice job on the CVE blast-a-thon. Can't wait to see the sequel (with Kamis this time!) [&o]

How have your VPs changed in the last few days?

[cwDeici]

Wasn't the issue about unconciously impacted advice rather than conscious impact? I've been giving my opinions on Greyjoy's thread, even after I started reading here (but seperating the stuff in my mind oc), but I'll stop doing that even though it's been general and noobish questions and suggestions. Anyway I'll miss reading Nemo's detailed and perceptive posts and I trust his intent (in this game the few posts of his in Greyjoy's thread seem entirely uninformed), though I'm not sure about any unconcious slip-ups he might have made in previous games... after all, referring to Greyjoy being easily distracted as above is already a bit of information on how cohesive a player is (though I guess that must be acceptable around here since noone else brought it up).
It seems whatever happened might have been a misunderstanding, which would be more of a tragedy in my mind than genuine conflict. It'd be good if both parties spoke with each other on the topic.

Anyway I'm sure Rader and Greyjoy will go on to have more exciting battles and give us all a splendid time, they hardly seem the types to be bothered much by emotions running high, fortunately.

[rader]

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

I think Rader is on the same quest but I sense it is "what is the IJ strategy to win this damn game? Does it exist? Is it more forces? Is the rules just borked and the Allies too strong?" within the constraints of a fair contest. [Rader is not thinking Ironman scenrario against to 5 year old [:D]]

I just thought I would follow up on this post to bring out this perspective ... N=1 ...

This is exactly it ~ 100%. Now GF is calling...