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AlanChan
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by AlanChan »

In Beijing Air Expo, AVIC revealed spec fo FC-31 fighter:
2X turbofan with max thrust at 88.29kN
4X internal hardpoints and 6 external hardpoints
length 16.8m
width 11.5m
height 4.8m
max liftoff weight 25t
normal liftoff weight 17.5t
max speed M1.8
Flight ceiling 16km
internal fuel combat radius 1200km
take off distance 400m
landing distance 600m
max load 8t
service life 6000-8000hr/ 30year
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VFA41_Lion
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by VFA41_Lion »

Sounds like a stealth strike fighter to me.
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

ORIGINAL: VFA41_Lion

Sounds like a stealth strike fighter to me.
Without J (Joint, or 'Jian' for Chinese fighter's name, since it is for export), for sure.
Hongjian
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Hongjian »

Recent rumor says that the new generation PL-15 long range AAM has been successfully test-fired from an J-16 fighter jet.
Hope that we will get some official stats soon.
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

I realized I am a big fool that believe stainless-steel hull can resist corrosion from sea water. And kept that way until I read this news.

I knew new materials can improve the ship hull not just keep away from being rusty, but also can improve its cruising performance. Yet, the copper-bottom kind is totally unheard for me:

--------------------
http://www.scmp.com/tech/science-resear ... ips-may-be

Eighteenth century-style 'copper-bottomed' warships may be the future of China's navy

New bacteria-fighting solution could save navy billions of yuan and lead to stronger, faster ships

A ground-breaking new innovation in steel production by Chinese scientists may help the country's future warships and submarines move fast and last longer than their foreign counterparts.

The new technology could also save hundreds of billions of yuan in damage and corrosion that stainless steel typically underwent when exposed to seawater, according to researchers from the Chinese Academy of Sciences' Institute of Metal Research in Shenyang, Liaoning province.

Though still undergoing testing, the special material can be applied to critical components such as joints and shafts, where the traditional practice of coating with anti-corrosion materials is difficult or impossible, thus significantly increasing the performance and durability of a vessel, the scientists said.

At present, bacteria are far more dangerous to Chinese warships than enemy navies.

One strain, Pseudomonas aeruginosa, is found throughout the world's oceans and has a special predilection for steel. Even duplex stainless steel, one of the hardest and most corrosion resistant materials used in the industry, can lose up to 40 millimetres per year to the merciless chewing of the bacteria.

The weight and drag caused by bacteria living on the surface of ships can also affect speed and manoeuvrability, the researchers said. They estimated that more than a third of fuel consumed by Chinese ships was wasted compensating for extra drag caused by bio-corrosion.

While the People's Liberation Army Navy does not disclose data on how serious the problem is to its fleets, the US spends upwards of US$23 billion on the issue every year.

In 2011, the USS Independence aircraft carrier was returned to dry-dock after less than a year in service due to severe corrosion found on steel components around its engines.

For its new material, the Chinese team, led by professor Yang Ke, reached back into history.

The British royal navy once covered the bottoms of its wooden ships with copper to prevent hulls from rotting, a crucial technology that helped the UK achieve maritime dominance in the late 18th century.

But as ships began to be built from metal, copper was forsaken due to the weight it would add to already heavy iron or steel hulls, as well as concerns over cost and durability.

Yang's team sought to combine copper with the widely used duplex stainless steel. The effort took more than a decade, but they were eventually able to find the right formulation to maximise copper's anti-bacterial effects without sacrificing the steel's strength.

To test the new material, the scientists cultured P. aeruginosa on it. The copper-steel amalgam killed nearly 97 per cent of the bacteria in a week, preventing corrosion and "effectively eradicating the biofilm", according to the team's paper in the journal Biofouling.

The new material could be a breakthrough in helping China become a new sea power, said Huang Weiping, a marine engineering professor with the Ocean University of China who was not involved in the research.

"Most protective coatings need to be re-applied every few years. For underwater projects, repeated coatings cannot be applied because it is impossible to do the job in water," he said.

The new steel has to be cheap for it to be widely adopted. Similar germ killing products have been developed for medical use but would be far too expensive for use in ship making.

Even using the material on only a few sensitive components could increase a ship's performance and durability dramatically, however.

"The life span of a ship or building is not determined by the strongest parts, but the weakest," Huang said.

But "the material must be tested in a real environment. The result in practice may not turn out as good as in the lab.
thewood1
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by thewood1 »

Color me skeptical...but worked in the materials manufacturing world for 12 years and this is the key part...

"the material must be tested in a real environment. The result in practice may not turn out as good as in the lab."

Long-term exposure to sea water is the ultimate materials test. You can't simulate the variability in sea water over years in a lab. Hundreds of attempts have been made over the last 100 years. Not saying it can't happen, but in a closed country like China, if this was such a huge breakthrough, there wouldn't be a big press release about it.
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

So it's being late. But hey, they cannot ask for other alternative if military-grade ship hulls is nowhere as easily made as pot metals for silverwares.
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Primarchx
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Primarchx »

ORIGINAL: Dysta
...
In 2011, the USS Independence aircraft carrier was returned to dry-dock after less than a year in service due to severe corrosion found on steel components around its engines.
...

USS Independence aircraft carrier? I suppose technically LCS-2 does have a big flight deck.
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

SCMP is not famous of military news report, even they are increasingly reporting military news under Chinese military development in recent years.

In irony, it is the best English news agency in Hong Kong, and confirmed still under British influence to report controversial news regarding to China, but it's getting sub-standard that typo can happens as well.
Hongjian
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Hongjian »

Even if this is an important piece of news by itself for the USAF, I'm surprised by the US' first open acknowledgement of the PL-15 long range AAM. This could really confirm that the designation is legit.
And it looks like that they believe that the PL-15's range and capability warrants a weapon beyond the AIM-120D, and a system aimed at destroying aviation electronics... I wonder if the USAF will release their estimates about the PL-15, since the Chinese sources merely say that this missile had "more than 100km range" and is roughly comparable with the AIM-120D in capability (rumoured dual-pulse engine, AESA seeker etc.).

Guess that the recent rumored live-fire test of the PL-15 and PL-10 off a J-16 and J-10C (J-10B block II) is just the beginning in a string of new revelations to come in the next few weeks.


https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ir-416828/
USAF seeks ‘interim’ CHAMP, longer-range air-to-air missiles

16 SEPTEMBER, 2015 BY: JAMES DREW WASHINGTON DC

The US Air Force plans to introduce Boeing and Raytheon’s “CHAMP” high-power-microwave emitting cruise missile into the combat force on board the 1990s conventional air-launched cruise missile as an “interim capability” while the technology transitions to Lockheed Martin’s JASSM-ER.

Air Combat Command chief Gen Hawk Carlisle says the computer-killing capability, which knocks out electronic equipment with bursts of high-frequency electromagnetic energy, is a “great capability” that will be fielded in small numbers initially with US Global Strike Command – the air force’s nuclear combat force.

“We’ve talked about the transition of that capability for Global Strike Command, but that will probably be small numbers because what we really want to do is get CHAMP into next-generation missiles, so JASSM-ER,” Carlisle said at an Air Force Association event in Washington.

“[Global Strike commander Gen Robin Rand] and I are talking about how to transition some number, an interim capability that’s on the current [CALCM] system and then how do we move to even an improved capability into the next generation air-to-surface cruise missiles we’re producing today.”

Asset Image
Air Force Research Laboratory/Boeing
The weapon has been in development with the Air Force Research Laboratory since 2009 and was successfully demonstrated at a test range in Utah in 2012. The technology has been deemed ready for development and fielding, and is already being improved and adapted to new platforms such as the JASSM-ER and possibly even reusable unmanned aircraft.

AFRL has been pursuing the Counter-electronics High Power Microwave Advanced Missile Project (CHAMP) as a niche capability that is difficult and expensive to harden against.

In terms of air superiority weapons, Carlisle says the development of next-generation air-to-air missiles is also “an exceptionally high priority”.

Raytheon’s AMRAAM is the current go-to Western weapon for beyond-visual-range air combat, but new long-range missiles being fielded by Russia and China are a significant concern to the Pentagon.

Carlisle says outmatching the Chinese PL-15 air-to-air missile in particular is an “exceedingly high priority”.

“The PL-15 and the range of that missile, we’ve got to be able to out-stick that missile,” he says.


The air force is currently exploring a range of next-generation weapon concepts as it also pursues a sixth-generation fighter aircraft.

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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

This news doesn't give much of info for DB3000 implement yet. We got numerous rumors about the further upgrade of PL-12 (and derivatives for export), PL-21, PL-10 and now PL-15??

The best we can do is just copy & paste the familiar specification of AIM-120D to PL-15, but it's not making any sense since 100km (below 55nm) is still shorter range than AIM-120D. Presuming Carlisle's "we’ve got to be" means they already have superior AMRAAM in their arsenal, so mentioning PL-15 is more likely for phishing some Chinese readers' attention.
Hongjian
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Hongjian »

ORIGINAL: Dysta

This news doesn't give much of info for DB3000 implement yet. We got numerous rumors about the further upgrade of PL-12 (and derivatives for export), PL-21, PL-10 and now PL-15??

The best we can do is just copy & paste the familiar specification of AIM-120D to PL-15, but it's not making any sense since 100km (below 55nm) is still shorter range than AIM-120D. Presuming Carlisle's "we’ve got to be" means they already have superior AMRAAM in their arsenal, so mentioning PL-15 is more likely for phishing some Chinese readers' attention.


Of course, we still dont know enough about Chinese AAMs in general, and it isnt enough for a DB inclusion.
Just posting an interesting piece of information, which at least confirms (more or less) that the PL-15 designation is real (or at least the USAF believes so).

In general, there is quite a bit of confusion about Chinese AAM designation with the PL-12 series. According to the newest sources, PL-12B became the standard PL-12 in service now, and the PL-12C (with foldable tailfins etc.) is no more, but actually pushed to being the next generation AAM called PL-15, with more internal and external changes aside of the fins. The ramjet-powered PL-12D, with the belly intake, has been designated PL-13.

The silent change in designations make it even harder to follow the development of these AAMs.


EDIT: Digging around more for Gen. Carlisle and his comments on the PL-15, it seems that he has already mentioned that missile earlier:

http://insidedefense.com/inside-air-for ... -dominance
Reposted on:
http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=27173
Speaking at a Feb. 12 media roundtable during the conference, Gen. Herbert Carlisle said Air Dominance 2030 supplants talk of a single sixth-generation F-X or F/A-XX to instead focus on multi-domain capabilities. He pointed to air, space and cyber capabilities as well as new munition loadouts.
"With the F-22 and F-35, two fantastic airplanes, air dominance in that [2030] time frame may not solely be an aircraft; it's the family-of-systems discussion," Carlisle said. "Stealth is wonderful, but you need to have more than stealth. Speed and maneuverability, sensor fusion, staying inside the decision OODA loop -- there's a portion of stealth that is hugely important and is part of it, but it's certainly not the only thing."
The general said long-range standoff munitions and even new air-to-air missiles to replace the AIM-120D AMRAAM and AIM-9X Sidewinder would be included in the air superiority discussion.
He said the capabilities being developed by America's potential adversaries, such as the Chinese PL-15 air-to-air missile, are "incredible."
"I believe if we look at this as we have in the past, we can figure out how to change the game and be better at it," Carlisle said, adding that high-powered lasers and microwave weapons are technical areas showing great promise.

Interesting that he mentions that the PL-15 requires the USAF to "replace the AIM-120D and AIM-9X" alltogether. Hyperbole? Or is this really an indication that the PL-15 is better/different than previously expected. I wouldnt believe that a mere Sino-AIM-120D warrants such attention and drastic changes.

Maybe the PL-15 is the ramjet powered missile previously known as PL-12D/21 after all... This would at least make sense, if we believe the rumors that the PL-15 was first tested this september. The folding fin missile we assumed to be the PL-15 (aka PL-12C) was seen flying around on J-11Bs and the J-20 since at least 2011. Tad a bit late for the first life-fire test, I think.
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

Ramjet AAM? What it is gonna face with? SR-72? X-37B? HTV? Minuteman?

I might be not searching too hard in Chinese military forums and websites, and also consider the past of "massive rumors" about Chinese ASAT/ABM tests in few years ago to believe it would use Ramjet missile to hit them. But I must admit, both China and US are having lots of missile experiments that we hardly guess what they end up with. Replacing AIM-120 and AIM-9 is expectable, but as soon as think they are already obsolete even before the deployment??

If CMANO really give us PL-15, or whatever the name of AIM-54 in steroid for the US, it will be a severely interesting air combat.
Hongjian
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Hongjian »

ORIGINAL: Dysta

Ramjet AAM? What it is gonna face with? SR-72? X-37B? HTV? Minuteman?

I might be not searching too hard in Chinese military forums and websites, and also consider the past of "massive rumors" about Chinese ASAT/ABM tests in few years ago to believe it would use Ramjet missile to hit them. But I must admit, both China and US are having lots of missile experiments that we hardly guess what they end up with. Replacing AIM-120 and AIM-9 is expectable, but as soon as think they are already obsolete even before the deployment??

If CMANO really give us PL-15, or whatever the name of AIM-54 in steroid for the US, it will be a severely interesting air combat.


Still too soon for CMANO inclusion IMHO. Still need more data.

But as of now, the rumors correlate with the PL-21, a Sino-Meteor of some sort, which is also ramjet powered. In fact, a ground launched test (with booster stage) has been reported and accompanied with the alleged photo since 2010 IIRC.

Image

And the likely targets? Well, AWACS, Tankers, Bombers and Fighters. The whole range of targets usually engaged by AAMs. Just like the Meteor, at longer ranges than traditional BVRAAMs.

Anyway, this bit of news (from the USAF General's mouth) is certainly one of the clearest indications that this often reported/rumored missile programme is at least going somewhere.
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

Code '2016' of the J-20 prototype was flown 2 days ago.

Notice the different shape of DSI as well as the matching paint from radome; some suggested new sensors was installed behind those bulges:

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Hongjian
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Hongjian »

Additional RAM-coating on the inlet edge as well.
Anyway, looks like the DSI-bump is made of a dielectric material now. We have seen a similiar, bulge-shaped aperture on the Tu-204C Radar-testbed for the J-20 as well some month before, and speculated whether this might be a side-scanning radar or some larger/more powerful ECM system.

This is the 7th prototype of the J-20, btw.
Hongjian
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Hongjian »

Seriously; what I would give to know what Gen. Carlisle knows about that missile...[&o]
http://alert5.com/2015/09/20/carlisle-r ... 15-bvraam/

Speaking at the Center for Strategic and International Studies on Sept. 15, ACC cheif Gen. Herbert “Hawk” Carlisle reiterated the threat of the Chinese PL-15 beyond visual range air-to-air missile.

Fast forward the video to the 16:00 mark on his comments on the PL-15.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=955&v=bgooB13PJIg
Cheechako
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Cheechako »

http://www.defensenews.com/story/defens ... /72590888/

Norway and Australia plan to add a RF seeker on the JSM in addition to the imaging infrared. Seems like this could be a good SEAD/ASW weapon. Still passive, but with RF homing?
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Dysta
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RE: Naval and Defense News

Post by Dysta »

http://m.scmp.com/tech/science-research ... y-missiles
http://www.ibtimes.com/chinese-military ... be-2108797

Usually the chain effect from SCMP's Chinese military and technology reports aren't as big as it should be, but today this piece of news shows very different outcome.

The news is about a miniature laser weapon to jam IR missiles, which is ultra light that even a single man can carry it:
While researchers developed various ways of making high frequency laser beams, such as using purified gas or multiple crystals, they all required the device to be set up in a large room with delicate components that are vulnerable to external disturbances such as shaking.

Li's team claim to have solved this problem. They developed a special crystal with lithium and niobium that can convert a normal laser beam into high frequency waves as short as 350 nanometres, or three times faster than the ultrafast system in use today.

If that is true. That would be explainable the so-called laser weapons are actually not just a turret itself, but a massive chemical-optical amplifier underneath it, even for just to fry toy drones in 5 kilometers (as Chinese have it too):

Image

Extra info, such kind of special crystal is also in application for telecommunications:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_niobate

But something amiss, how IR-Jamming laser can be converted into a waveband without changing its own frequency? Since both infrared and radio wave are totally different frequency already, unless Chinese discovered IR-wave which is suppose to be the pseudoscience?

Nobody knows, but a miniature laser projector with massive energy is still an important piece of technology in the future.
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