::Felix, Ferdinand and FRUPAC:: obvert (A) v Greyjoy (J)

[Bullwinkle58]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I don't even think that scenario modifications can access the hex side color. That blue color is the same as when the F6 key is toggled to show hex side codes (white=ground and sea units pass, blue=only sea units, green=only ground units, red=neither), rather than the w key toggled to show hex side ownership.

How that hex side is blue in your pic I don't know.

The scenario can't vary it, but a new hex file for a new map could. That's what I meant by the DBB map. It's not the stock map.

A blue side shows if the side SHOULD be blue both when the F6 key is used (preference for hexside detail is ON) and when the 'W' hotkey, for hexside ownership/control, is pushed. The blue color should never change. It's a water-side hex. It's in the map design.

I think we're saying the same thing. Just wanted to be clear on my part.

[witpqs]

No, I don't think a hex file could. It can vary the hex side definitions (make this one a river, change that hex to mountain, etc.), but not the color code the game engine uses when the toggles are pressed to display things. Is that what you are saying?

[Bullwinkle58]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

No, I don't think a hex file could. It can vary the hex side definitions (make this one a river, change that hex to mountain, etc.), but not the color code the game engine uses when the toggles are pressed to display things. Is that what you are saying?

Nope. The color calls are, I think, in the EXE. Maybe not.

I'm saying the DBB map could make the hex definition of that one hexside throw a blue color to indicate the river there was impassable to Ground (rapids, a dam, rocks, what have you) because the graphics don't allow for fat and narrow rivers. You have to put in a pretty big lake, a la some on the fringes of the Himalayas.

I don't know the DBB map at all. I'm not saying that hexside was altered in that hex file. But if it wasn't I don't see any way that side should be blue.

[Bullwinkle58]

Brain fart. What I get from looking at obvert's close up. It's a road, not a river. So I have no idea AT ALL why it's blue.

Blue is a primary color. It can't be from a mix. So I'm guessing a bug or corrupted save.

[obvert]

It's definitely not part of the map, it's only present when hex side control is keyed using the 'W.' Sorry, I should have mentioned that but I did explain it in the original post when talking about how this was a path that my unit moved through, now which it's unable to move through, and which is blue. Only blue on both sides which is also interesting. the road goes from one hex to the other and the river is between 76, 46 and Chungking.

This is a path I've been using frequently from 76, 46 to 76, 47. Then the IJ took the 76, 47 hex (marked J here) but I moved back in opening the hex sides on both the NE and SW side of the hex, then which he recaptured completely, owning all hex sides, and then which I moved through again before he could move into 76, 46 with his units ( I already had a unit started which only required one day to move and he did not/could not have had the same as he had just taken the hex the day before). So I should own that hex side again but instead it's blue and I at least can't use it at all.

Rather than a resampled image here is a full enlarged pixel look, which is more clear.

[Bullwinkle58]

Yeah, blue is not part of the palette for hexside movement. It's a permanent color there no matter what moves through. And Ground units can't. So it's some kind of bug, corruption, or artifact. It can't be there under the design through movement. And there's no reason for the map designer to have coded that side to be blue. It's a road hex.

You broke China, man. [8D]

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

Yeah, blue is not part of the palette for hexside movement. It's a permanent color there no matter what moves through. And Ground units can't. So it's some kind of bug, corruption, or artifact. It can't be there under the design through movement. And there's no reason for the map designer to have coded that side to be blue. It's a road hex.

You broke China, man. [8D]

Ha! I think you're right, unfortunately. [:)]

This is doubly bad because I don't want to replay turns due to other things going on, but I really could use that movement to get under the stacking in 76, 46. I'm at 53k (50k) now, so not bad, but not helpful when really digging to hold it. I' also want to move one more unit through from Chungking that has supply into the 76, 47 hex to make it tougher.

Ok. So looks like a candidate for michaelm.

I did notice an error message on loading a few turns ago. I think we might be off sync for versions. We've had that a few times. I'll ask Nick.

[witpqs]

A couple of thoughts. Does this persist when the game is exited and rerun (AE, not just the turn)? If it does, I wonder if it was put in at some point and none of the three of us noticed. For example, I have seen where a unit from each of the opposing sides arrive in a previously empty hex on the same turn, nobody gets hex side ownership. Is it possible that this is the equivalent for this situation, where it means 'either side can move through this hex side from either direction'???

Obviously that is just speculation.

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

A couple of thoughts. Does this persist when the game is exited and rerun (AE, not just the turn)? If it does, I wonder if it was put in at some point and none of the three of us noticed. For example, I have seen where a unit from each of the opposing sides arrive in a previously empty hex on the same turn, nobody gets hex side ownership. Is it possible that this is the equivalent for this situation, where it means 'either side can move through this hex side from either direction'???

Obviously that is just speculation.

1. He took the hex.
2. My units moved in one day later from both sides on the road as they had already started and thus got hex side control again along the road.
3. He took the hex again.
4. I had another unit moving (from 76, 46, so through the blue line area) which did move and should have gained the hex side control again. Instead the blue line appeared. Units moving from the other side got hex side control a day later (as shown in the map with green on both sides).
5. I tried to move another unit through literally the next turn, but it would not go that way, and instead rerouted to an adjacent hex if sent. That's when I checked with the 'W' key and saw this blue line.

Yes, it does persist.

[witpqs]

Then maybe it's a bug that Michael should see?

[Lokasenna]

Maybe it's dual control, which turns into neither? I really have no idea.

Isn't it possible for units to "swap" hexes if they end up moving at the same time?

[Bullwinkle58]

But the color blue can't occur in any case by movement of any kind. It's in the pwhex file, or ordered by it rather.

[HansBolter]

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Maybe it's dual control, which turns into neither? I really have no idea.

Isn't it possible for units to "swap" hexes if they end up moving at the same time?

The Moose

(in reply to witpqs)

Isn't dual control, or neither white?

Looks like a map error to me.

[BBfanboy]

Looks like the map designer got to watching one of those new TV series with invisible domes or other force fields and subliminally put one in the pwhex file, with random appearance! Never watched the program enough to discover if there is a way past the force field.
Maybe try one of these ...

[obvert]

I'll post it in tech to see what happens anyway.

[crsutton]

Yeah, no reason at all that blue line should be there. It has to be a bug.

[ny59giants]

Could the "blue line" be a PWHEX issue??

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Could the "blue line" be a PWHEX issue??

I don't see how because it is only there when the 'w' hotkey is toggled.

[obvert]

[font="Times New Roman"]June 30 - July 1, 1943[/font]

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[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]SUBS: [/font] Finally a sub pays off in So Pac. It's hard to get an attack let alone a hit with all of the air patrols near Rabaul, but Tinosa finally gets in to nail Hyuga with one TT. Steelhead hits an xAK near Manokwari with one fish.

[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]INDIA: [/font] The Thunderbolts make it across India and are in Ledo waiting to transfer to Chungking. Another groups is arriving to Aden in a few days. I know these are not ideal defensive planes, but they are better than anything else I can field, and they're service 1 amazingly! So this is where they'll go. I also need to move the Hellcats out and get them back to the Enterprise. I have two Corsair groups in range too if he starts pushing up there.

Tried a tank only DA near Imphal, which went okay, but it now leaves us without any fit units. I'll simply hold until he finally walks out here and keep bombarding.

[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]CENT PAC: [/font] The invasion of Wotje is moving to a rendezvous spot. I'll have tanks, combat engineers, a Marine regiment and some arty for this one.

[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]SO PAC: [/font] The torpedo into Hyuga started a frenetic day in the South Pacific as Nick went for my ships sitting at Vangunu. He picked a good day as I'd literally that turn removed a bunch of 70-80exp pilots from the P-40E and P-39D groups, but I'd also left them short after filling up the newly arrived P-47s. Three of the groups had only ~15 planes ready and manned, and an extra 30 fighters would have made it a tough day for him I think. The weather helped us out too, and altogether it turned into a pretty big slaughter of Japanese planes.

He did manage to get a TT into Colorado leaving her out of the next action with 33 float damage. Should be a few months in the Sydney dry dock. I've got a few more BBs at PH just finishing upgrades though. Pretty awesome to see DBB flak in action, as 25+ Kates made it through the interception phase and made an attack run, but only one hit even on the old BB.

This should leave the door open finally for the invasion of Buin. I didn't go on the 1st to allow groups to recover, and will push ahead on the 2nd. Tense moments.

[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]CHINA: [/font] Nick has also seen the blue line now and he can't move there either. We'll just keep playing and see what develops. I'll imagine it was an earthquake that wiped out the road. [:D]

A DA at 76, 46 leaves the Chinese with some big disablements but lots more IJA vehicles ruined too.

[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]SIGINT:[/font] Looks lke more than I thought is at Horn Island. I'll avoid that and hopefully let it stay there!

[font="Trebuchet MS"]31st Division is located at Horn Island(91,128).[/font]

[font="Trebuchet MS"]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR June 30, 43
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Sub attack near Feni Islands at 107,127

Japanese Ships
BB Hyuga, Torpedo hits 1
CL Isuzu
DD Nenohi
DD Tatsuyuke
DD Kikuzuki
DD Oboro

Allied Ships
SS Tinosa, hits 1

SS Tinosa launches 6 torpedoes at BB Hyuga
DD Tatsuyuke attacking submerged sub ....

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Morning Air attack on TF, near Vangunu at 111,135

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 100 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 42 minutes

Japanese aircraft
B5N2 Kate x 35
Ki-43-IIIa Oscar x 42

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 21
P-40E Warhawk x 6
F4F-4 Wildcat x 18
FM-1 Wildcat x 14
F4U-1 Corsair x 9

Japanese aircraft losses
B5N2 Kate: 7 destroyed, 7 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 3 destroyed by flak
Ki-43-IIIa Oscar: 9 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F4F-4 Wildcat: 1 destroyed
FM-1 Wildcat: 1 destroyed

Allied Ships
BB Maryland
BB Colorado, Torpedo hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
23 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp

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Morning Air attack on Vangunu , at 111,135

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 185 NM, estimated altitude 25,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 51 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5c Zero x 45
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 35

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 24
P-40E Warhawk x 13
F4F-4 Wildcat x 18
FM-1 Wildcat x 18
F4U-1 Corsair x 9

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-44-IIc Tojo: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed
FM-1 Wildcat: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
30 x Ki-44-IIc Tojo sweeping at 25000 feet

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Morning Air attack on TF, near Vangunu at 111,135

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 115 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 33 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIb Oscar x 36
Ki-48-IIb Lily x 27

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 19
P-40E Warhawk x 1
F4F-4 Wildcat x 11
FM-1 Wildcat x 7
F4U-1 Corsair x 8

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-IIb Oscar: 7 destroyed
Ki-48-IIb Lily: 10 destroyed, 7 damaged
Ki-48-IIb Lily: 2 destroyed by flak

Allied aircraft losses
P-39D Airacobra: 3 destroyed
F4F-4 Wildcat: 1 destroyed
FM-1 Wildcat: 1 destroyed

Allied Ships
BB Colorado, Bomb hits 1
BB Maryland, Bomb hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x Ki-48-IIb Lily releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 2 x 100 kg SAP Bomb
2 x Ki-48-IIb Lily releasing from 1000'
Naval Attack: 2 x 100 kg SAP Bomb
4 x Ki-48-IIb Lily releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 2 x 100 kg SAP Bomb

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Morning Air attack on TF, near Vangunu at 111,135

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 120 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 35 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 36
A6M5c Zero x 31
Ki-48-IIb Lily x 22

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 5
F4F-4 Wildcat x 4
FM-1 Wildcat x 2
F4U-1 Corsair x 4

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 3 destroyed
Ki-48-IIb Lily: 3 destroyed, 12 damaged
Ki-48-IIb Lily: 3 destroyed by flak

No Allied losses

Allied Ships
CL Honolulu
CL Nashville

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x Ki-48-IIb Lily releasing from 2000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 100 kg SAP Bomb
3 x Ki-48-IIb Lily releasing from 3000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 100 kg SAP Bomb
4 x Ki-48-IIb Lily releasing from 1000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 100 kg SAP Bomb

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Afternoon Air attack on Vangunu , at 111,135

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 34 NM, estimated altitude 26,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 40

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 17
P-40E Warhawk x 16
F4F-4 Wildcat x 27
FM-1 Wildcat x 9
F4U-1 Corsair x 15

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 8 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-39D Airacobra: 3 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 2 destroyed
F4F-4 Wildcat: 3 destroyed
F4U-1 Corsair: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
19 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 25000 feet

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Afternoon Air attack on Vangunu , at 111,135

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 127 NM, estimated altitude 31,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 31 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIb Oscar x 13
Ki-84a Frank x 18

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 11
P-40E Warhawk x 9
F4F-4 Wildcat x 15
FM-1 Wildcat x 6
F4U-1 Corsair x 10

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-IIb Oscar: 3 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed
F4F-4 Wildcat: 2 destroyed
F4U-1 Corsair: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x Ki-84a Frank sweeping at 25000 feet

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Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Vangunu at 111,135

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 120 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 31 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5c Zero x 24
D4Y1 Judy x 36

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 6
P-40E Warhawk x 8
F4F-4 Wildcat x 5
FM-1 Wildcat x 6
F4U-1 Corsair x 8

Japanese aircraft losses
D4Y1 Judy: 9 destroyed, 1 damaged

No Allied losses

Allied Ships
BB Maryland

Aircraft Attacking:
1 x D4Y1 Judy releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 500 kg SAP Bomb

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AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR July 1, 43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 76,46 (near Chungking)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 31214 troops, 430 guns, 1505 vehicles, Assault Value = 1259

Defending force 52797 troops, 132 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1692

Japanese adjusted assault: 676

Allied adjusted defense: 1525

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1073 casualties reported
Squads: 20 destroyed, 78 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 62 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 23 disabled
Guns lost 28 (2 destroyed, 26 disabled)
Vehicles lost 91 (4 destroyed, 87 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
2011 casualties reported
Squads: 13 destroyed, 243 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 16 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 9 disabled

Assaulting units:
7th Ind.Tank Brigade
19th Tank Regiment
18th Tank Regiment
3rd Tank Division
39th Division
4th Tank Regiment
3rd Tank Regiment
Guards Tank Division
Tonei Hvy Gun Regiment
6th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
4th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
11th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
1st Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
5th Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
4th Chinese Corps
25th Chinese Corps
3rd Prov Chinese Corps
56th Chinese Corps
80th Chinese Corps
72nd Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
11th Group Army
10th Chinese Base Force
20th Artillery Regiment
4th Heavy Mortar Regiment
3rd Heavy Mortar Regiment
17th Chinese Base Force

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Ground combat at 59,41 (near Imphal)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 6970 troops, 94 guns, 990 vehicles, Assault Value = 795

Defending force 31158 troops, 402 guns, 206 vehicles, Assault Value = 675

Allied adjusted assault: 184

Japanese adjusted defense: 3073

Allied assault odds: 1 to 16

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
588 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 64 disabled
Non Combat: 6 destroyed, 30 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Guns lost 35 (10 destroyed, 25 disabled)
Vehicles lost 15 (7 destroyed, 8 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
288 casualties reported
Squads: 12 destroyed, 12 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 56 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Guns lost 9 (2 destroyed, 7 disabled)
Vehicles lost 80 (10 destroyed, 70 disabled)

Assaulting units:
3rd Carabiniers Regiment
150th RAC Regiment
3rd Marine Division
194th Tank Battalion
754th Tank Battalion
762nd Tank Battalion
627th Tank Destroyer Battalion
50th Tank Brigade
6th Medium Regiment
134th Field Artillery Battalion
183rd Field Artillery Battalion
2/1st Med Regiment
1st West African AA Regiment

Defending units:
33rd Division
55th Division
54th Field AA Battalion
31st Ind.AA Gun Co
1st Art.Mortar Regiment
2nd Area Army
2nd Ind.AA Gun Co
2nd RF Gun Battalion
1st RF Gun Battalion
6th Air Defense AA Regiment
41st Air Defense AA Battalion
36th Field AA Battalion
12th Ind. AA Battalion

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/font]

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[font="Trebuchet MS"]I'll take a torpedo in Colorado for this kind of carnage, but it was a close run thing on the 30th. i have to be more careful, and it's good Nick is still thinking offensively to keep me on my toes. I like it. [8D][/font]

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: obvert

[font="Times New Roman"]June 30 - July 1, 1943[/font]

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[font="Microsoft Sans Serif"]SO PAC: [/font]
He did manage to get a TT into Colorado leaving her out of the next action with 33 float damage. Should be a few months in the Sydney dry dock.

Does this mod give Sydney a larger drydock than stock? At 30K in stock, a Colorado-class BB will not fit the dock and unlike upgrades that just use the dockyard shops and cranes, you need to put the ship in the dock to repair floatation damage. Better start her for PH or a large enough floating dock.