Subs

[IrishGuards]

I hunt for Cv's ... spot em and hope they take a few damage from conducting missions ..
Them Prein goes in for the kill .. You might have to use all the Air and Naval assets you have ..
But .. this should really help Axis later in the war ..!! And I would really enjoy a replay so the Allied player can see these beauties sinking in the North Sea .. Instead of harrassing my Italian's in the Med .. [:D]
IDG

[SMK-at-work]

Naval combat in this game and another competing product is kind of silly all-round IMO.  Naval units mostly didn't operate like land units.  they mostly operated by patroling out of ports - so naval units should be static and have only strategic moves between bases.  They would then be allocated a role/area of operations in which they would have some effect (% attrition or chance of intercept and of suffering loss).
 
The only exception would be point attacks such as invasion support where the unit might indeed be moved adjacent to the target hex to represent considrable time spent there on active duty.  But even then it might be best simulated by "simply" targeting a hex from the home port in het same sort of manner as air does.
 
Of course with, say, the number of ships for D-Day you'd probably need stacking too for the number of naval units based in hte limited number of ports available on the map.......
 
I really wish more thought had gone into designing the sytems instead of just copying the "standard" of what has happened before & adding a few new features - oil & manpower are brilliant - pretty much everything else is 10+ years old in concept and it shows[:(]

[IainMcNeil]

A lot of thought went in to it - because it is not what you wanted doesn't mean it is wrong

[IrishGuards]

Well I am sorry you had some bad luck with your subs ...
I don't think they are a waste ... or dead meat .. or sad ... and I do believe they are very strategic ...
If used properly and in conjunction as Sarge showed in game I think this is a wonderful tool ... Otherwise what do you want .. U-boaten putting Uk out of the war in 1940 .. [8|]
I responded to his post .. thought about it .. and decided that I would use these pointy bits of my OOB .. strategically ... and hopefully luckily also .!! [;)]
If the UK or Allied navies are not tied up and you send the subs in .. you are hoping the Home Fleet is what .. totally imcompetent .. I bet he is doing the same thing you are ..
Waiting for the right moment .. You must be sure that at least a part of it is spotted before committing .. otherwise 3 years of builds .. yep ... right tot he bottom .. [:-]
7 Subs .. send in 2 and see whats up .. disperse between all the convoy lanes .. stay away from Uk ...
You dont say what year .. but if you had 7 .. that tells me maybe 42 - 43 .. any tech ..
By that time the UK fleet could be massive if he built that way ...
Just my thoughts ..
IDG

[Rocko911]

The fact is that the subs have a terrible avoidance on being attacked. I understand them getting hit once from a destroyer after their initial contact with the convoy , but after that they should be more difficult to be hit by the following ships surrounding them (as they always do). Subs had one thing going for them in the deep ocean, it was called diving and they could avoid attacks. In this game once you hit a convoy you should already start writing the letters to the crews families on their service for the fatherland, LOL.

[IrishGuards]

Yep .. Glad someone else said it .. [;)]
Action points for Sub's ... they hit .. they get to submerge or retreat after each attack by the swine Allied BB .. ASW squadron's .. [&o]
Destroyers .. or shall we say escorts have the ability to not only hit U-boat .. but then still be in contact with him .. [:-]
Maybe the damage is severe for the gain .. and then I am gonna spend Tech on these puppies .. and build new shiny type 21's ..
I know I will have a manpower shortage but by no means can Axis control the Ocean until the very end of the game ..
Ok .. All I need is to be able to produce some U-boat from the port of Marsailles ..
And maybe in the Black Sea .. let's get Rumania a port .. ship the U-boat down by rail .. [:D]
IDG

[IrishGuards]

Action points for Sub's ... they hit .. they get to submerge or retreat after each attack by the swine Allied BB .. ASW squadron's ..

I should have said a % chance depending on the attackers ..
They would be much more likely to submerge if Air is attacking ..
Look at it this way ...
Priorotize the attackers and give the sub a % chance to submerge .. retreat .. both .. whatever ..
DD's and Air .. higher the % they will run ... You have 1 unit taking a bead on you .. you think there might be more .. ok up to you .. then the Allies at least know that when they try to attack you ..
BB's and such maybe less ..
I still think Ger port in Rum is great idea .. very balancing ..[:D]
And the ability to have U-boat in Med .. outstanding .. [&o]
IDG

[Dave Ferguson]

No axis navy in the black sea is historic. They have no way of getting there until the bosphorus is cleared and remember ships provide supply for invading forces.  So Axis players might remember to garrison Ploisti and Bucharest etc, could be embarrassing having the rumanian army disappear !!!
 
The strait of Gibraltar was difficult to get through for u-boats as the UK had an anti sub 'barrage' line, see Das Boot. so you need to invade Spain and take out Gibraltar.
 
Sectional u-boats did not happen till late war IIRC and by then the Germans had better uses for their concrete.

[IrishGuards]

What is Gibraltar .. [8|]
IDG