Official Rugby World Cup 2007 Thread

[Andy Mac]

I do think it was quite cunning of Hadden to keep his best players out of a game he figured he couldnt win.
 
Its all about Italy for Scotland we know the AB will choke somewhere along the way but they were always going to hammer us.
 
If Scotland beat Italy then its a quarter final against France or Argentina both are hard games but winnable.
 
So actually keeping his best players, few as they are, away from the AB's and potential injuries is probably a good thing if a tad cynical roll on Italy !!!! 

[JudgeDredd]

Absolutely.

He's being slated for it here, but the AB game wasn't ever winnable for Scotland, whereas the Italy game is - and that isn't saying it's a done thing...as we've already seen first hand, Italy have more than the ability to beat Scotland (6 Nations, 2007 anyone?)

I don't know what the commentary about it up north is like, but he's being slated by the English commentators for it. I say good on him.

I, like every other Scot, would like to see how the 1st Scotland team could do holding off the ABs...but that's all it would be...a holding action. And what about any injuries going into the Italian game.

We wouldn't beat the ABs. They've beaten us in 20 meetings, with teams much worse than they have now....so I say it's a good call. Keep your squad and rest them for the match that counts to the quarters.

[7th Somersets]

If I were one of the Scots first team I would be disappointed at having missed playing one of the finalists (if not the winner of) the 2007 world cup.
 
Let's face it - Scotland getting through to the next round is the most that they will achieve this year - so the 'cynical' approach will hardly get them very much further.
 
 

[JudgeDredd]

It's not a cynical view. You of all people (being a wargamer, I presume) should understand the strategy involved.

If Frank Hadden had played his first team and suffered injuries and/or the team ended up being beaten by Italy, he would be lambasted for it, and rightly so.

If, on the other hand, he loses to Italy for the choice he made on Sunday, then he will be lambasted for that! The point is, strategically, he stands a better chance getting his squad to the quarter finals with an intact and rested first squad.

You're damn right the players will be pissed about it, but they would rather progress than go home in the group stage. As I was. I was wanting to see Scotland play the ABs...but we can take them later [:'(]

As for not progressing past the quarters, you've been watching a different Rugby World Cup. Scotland and Wales have been the most impressive northern hemisphere teams so far. If Scotland beat Italy, they play either France, Argentina or Ireland...and all three of those games Scotland stand as good a chance as the opposing side of winning.

Scotland, going into the World Cup were offered odds of 300-1...it's now 150-1 to win. Now you and I know that aint gonna happen, but at 6-1 odds for Scotland being eliminated at the Semi Final stage, it's more than worth a punt. England and France have only got 5-1 and 4-1 respectively [:D]

[JudgeDredd]

By the way, even Ireland are only at 66-1 to get eliminated at the semi final stage!!

[SMK-at-work]

Dread you've identified 4 players out of the starting 15 who you admit are not in the "top" starting 15.
 
Add MacDonald - he's good, but he's not the first fullback...so that's 5.....1/3rd of the team starting 15 were not the top players for their position.
 
It's still probably a good enough team to win the cup, but it's not the top team by any means.

[JudgeDredd]

Well, fine...1/3 of the team are not the top players...so if you are correct (and I assume you would know more than I, being as you are actually from NZ), then it's still not your second team...and besides, NZ second team would beat just about any rugby team bar SA and the Aussies!

[7th Somersets]

As for not progressing past the quarters, you've been watching a different Rugby World Cup.

 
I wait to be proved wrong. [;)]
 
 

[JudgeDredd]

Well, I wouldn't wait too long. My patriotism generally says things my mind tries to stop it saying! [;)]

[7th Somersets]

Sadly I doubt that many northern hemisphere countries will get much further.
 
Still, Bath are doing better than last year.

[SMK-at-work]

Dred on that basis it wasn't Scotland's 2nd team either, since they had some of their leading players in the starting lineup!
 
Interestingly here the similarities in the jerseys has had a rew reports over the last couple of days, with some suggestion they were affected by it (eg not offloading 'cos they weren't sure who was who in that spit second) and that it was a deliberate ploy by the Scots since their jersey was not the same as the one that was approved by the IRB!
 
As for nth hemisphere teams the Semi's...well Argentina are playing well and should beat Scotland in the quarters....but I wouldn't write of the English just yet.....they're quite capable of beating Australia if they can pull it all together on teh day so I'd put my money on the Aussies if I had to, but an English victory would not surprise me too much.
 
and of course the piece de resistance of eth quarters looks like New Zealand vs France at Cardiff....that's got to be a formula that could give a great game.  France are a bit of a bogey team for the AB's - when they get that "Gallic flair" going they've been known to run riot so it will take a determined, organised and disciplined effort to beat them.  I have no doubt the AB's will be favourites........but again in the back of my mind is a keen awareness that France can be bloody hard to sop if they get it all together on the day.

[JudgeDredd]

OK then SMK...it was your second team and our first...well done [:'(]

As for the jerseys, WHAT? I have no idea what the IRB sanctioned (as I'm sure you do not...so you are probably listening to reports which always come out after games insinuating foul tactics)...but Scotland have been wearing those jerseys for the last few months...if I'm not very much mistaken, the All Blacks normally play in an, erm, all black kit...so why did Scotland use underhand tactics?

Funny, because the spin is of a different type over here...people are wondering why the ABs didn't play in black...funny that...depending on what you read depends on what you hear

But well done for the win...the rugby world will be trembling at a 40-0 victory over, erm, Scotland (second squad)!

[SMK-at-work]

Where did I say it was your first team Dred?  There's no need to be stupid about it![8|]
 
The AB's didn't play in black because they were expecting to play Scotland who would be wearing an all-dark-blue jersey and it's a conflicting colour scheme.  Just like the French jersey now conflicts because they have darkened the colour of their blue.
 
The grey panelling on the Scottish jersies was apparently not on the versions that were approved by the IRB and which were shown to the AB's.
 
Whether they had been in use or not for some time prior is not relevant - the AB's expected the Scots to be wearing something else for this game.  Several teams have new jersey patterns for the cup (eg France) - they aren't set in stone.
 
You can see some NZ stories about it at http://www.stuff.co.nz/4214324a6429.html, http://www.stuff.co.nz/4213336a6429.html
 
It was a bit of a screw up by the IRB, it might have cost one side or the other a few points.  but in the end you still got nil! [8D]
 
 

[JudgeDredd]

SMK

Lighten up man...it was a joke. I put the cheeky smiley at the end?

[SMK-at-work]

Oh I'm smiling....'cos you stil got nil!![8D]

[SMK-at-work]

so the big question is....will hte AB's or France have to wear their alternate strip at Cardif?  Experts rate each side as 50/50, but it all depends on how hte coin is feeling on the day...it should be a coin of 2 halves, and all credit to the opposition.....[:D][:D]

[Bill Durrant]

Re the jersey argument: the commentator of the game I watched was very helpful:

"If you're having trouble differentiating between the teams then the All Blacks are the ones usually with the ball"

[SMK-at-work]

[:D][8D][:D]

[SMK-at-work]

Silver shirts it is - I predict the Froggies are going to get spanked

how about the others?

Aussies vs Poms....the Aussie scrum isn't that good, so Johnny may get a few dropped goals to squeak the Brits ahead.....but either way the rest of the world rejoices

Scotland vs Argentina? If the Argentines can play as well as they did to beat France then they'll have no problems....otherwise I think Scotland do actually have the ability to beat them on a good day...with the wind behind them...downhill...and a bit of luck!!

Who the hell is het other one?? Oh that's right...Sud Ufrika vs Fiji.....I can' see the Fijians getting to play their "natural game" against the boys from the Veldt....a thrashing I think.

[Raver508]

Yeah I reakon it should be pretty one way traffic this weekend.  The English just wont be able to hold out the aussie backline, the Fijians wont be able to counter the bok forwards and ditto the Scots vs Argentina.