fast transport...

[bigbaba]

i had a FT-TF from rabaul with lae as destination. 2 CL and 3 DD...all above 34 knts. speed. i set "retirement allowed" and sent them to lae..and what happend? 2 turns later, they were in lae unloading in the day-phase and were of course attacked and damaged!

[pasternakski]

Take it from somebody who has been there and done that. Fast transport has never worked in this game, and it has never been fixed. Use it at your peril. It will perilize ya, sooner or later.

[tocaff]

Overland supply for PM is barely enough to keep a minimal force there going and barges from Lae to Buna can't support a large fore either.  The fast trans TFs are good for small forces, but if you go to the well once to often I'll bet you punishment will be dealt out.

[Kingfisher]

ORIGINAL: pasternakski
Fast transport has never worked in this game, and it has never been fixed.

What part doesn't work? As long as you know their limitations and work within it it should produce favorable results.

[pasternakski]

ORIGINAL: Kingfisher

ORIGINAL: pasternakski
Fast transport has never worked in this game, and it has never been fixed.

What part doesn't work? As long as you know their limitations and work within it it should produce favorable results.

Where have you been? This has been a given here for over three years. It's not a question of limitations, it's a question of the game system not doing what you expect it to do no matter how hard you try.

Keep on whistling past the graveyard. Sooner or later, the zombies will rise up and teach you the sense of what I say.

[Kingfisher]

ORIGINAL: pasternakski
It's not a question of limitations, it's a question of the game system not doing what you expect it to do no matter how hard you try.

What exactly are you expecting of FTs, and what are you getting? I ask because I've encountered no problems so far.

Keep on whistling past the graveyard. Sooner or later, the zombies will rise up and teach you the sense of what I say.

Uh...ok.

[bigbaba]

@Kingfisher:

i expect from a FT-TF containing 5 ships with 34+ knots speed, that they deliver the supply into a level 3 or 4 port (GG or lae) OVER NIGHT and leave the port long before the sun raises instead of sitting at the port at day and getting bombed.
[align=left] [/align]

[Kingfisher]

ORIGINAL: bigbaba

@Kingfisher:

i expect from a FT-TF containing 5 ships with 34+ knots speed, that they deliver the supply into a level 3 or 4 port (GG or lae) OVER NIGHT and leave the port long before the sun raises instead of sitting at the port at day and getting bombed.
[align=left] [/align]

What are the conditions at the base? Is it damaged? Is there enough base support? Are the ships damaged?

My experience has been limited to only the allies, and as I've mentioned the FTs perform as expected. For instance, I create a TF comprising 4 APDs at Luganville, load it up with 1000 pts of supply and order it to supply Tulagi. One full day later they are sailing back to Luganville and Tulagi's supply level has increased by 1000 pts.

What am I missing?

[pasternakski]

ORIGINAL: Kingfisher
What am I missing?

Believe me, you haven't lived.

It's already been mentioned how your fast transport TFs will frequently - and to your horror - spend the next morning lingering over coffee at their destination hex, only to wish they had glass bottoms installed in their boats so that they could see where enemy LBA is sending them.

Wait until they react away from enemy carriers that have not been sighted and, as far as you know, are not within 2,000 kilometers of them. You can't put them on "do not react," because then they will not perform a fast transport mission.

Enjoy watching while one APD is damaged by a submarine and the rest of the ships in the convoy suddenly become empty - with no further trace of what they were carrying, including troops, to be found anywhere - except in the enemy's total of VPs.

I could go on, but these few examples from years and years of play ought to suffice to get my point across.

The zombies are lurking, boys, just like I said...

[SuluSea]

ORIGINAL: bigbaba

@Kingfisher:

i expect from a FT-TF containing 5 ships with 34+ knots speed, that they deliver the supply into a level 3 or 4 port (GG or lae) OVER NIGHT and leave the port long before the sun raises instead of sitting at the port at day and getting bombed.
[align=left] [/align]

That is exactly why I use...

Sometimes for added control ,once they're loaded I give my FT-TF a surface mission till I get them on the exact hex I want them to be. Then I change them back to FT and let them make their dash.

I don't use that technique at all times but when FT destinations are close enough to their loading point they show up at daylight and get bombed. It would be great if the player was given the choice whether the FTs should deliver their cargo/troops at night or not.

[RGIJN]

the player should be given more control at all. TF movement in particular. Plotting the course manually, with fixed waypoints to determine when a certain TF is where! The actual movement "control" in UV sucks and is rather superficial IMHO. It doesn´t deserve calling it CONTROL. It´s alot of hope and concern in it... [&:]

[anarchyintheuk]

UV never defined a player's role in the game. Are you King of SoPac and SwPac, Minister in Charge of Rabaul or are you are part of the oversoul, in every plane or CiC in theater. Hence, you can't control the route a tf or fttf takes to a base (or you'll have to individually plot them) but you can control the altitude of your cap.

[tocaff]

Way points gentlemen, we need way points like the WITP AE will have.  It's so easy to put a sub in the line of travel between Rabul and Buna, for example.

[pasternakski]

ORIGINAL: anarchyintheuk

UV never defined a player's role in the game. Are you King of SoPac and SwPac, Minister in Charge of Rabaul or are you are part of the oversoul, in every plane or CiC in theater. Hence, you can't control the route a tf or fttf takes to a base (or you'll have to individually plot them) but you can control the altitude of your cap.

One of the best posts I've ever read. Both UV and WitP suffer from not defining more specifically what the player's role - AND LIMITATIONS - are. I know that, in this world of "Me, me, more me now, I wanna control everything, I wanna change the world to suit the way I see it," you're never gonna sell the idea of "shut up and do your job, and here's what your job is," but I keep trying...

[pasternakski]

ORIGINAL: tocaff

Way points gentlemen, we need way points like the WITP AE will have.  It's so easy to put a sub in the line of travel between Rabul and Buna, for example.

You know? If you give orders to individual units despite being the Great Guiding Spirit of the Yamato People, you ought to be able to tell them when to be where. I did like the "semi-official" comment on another thread that in the new games you will be able to assign your submarines to patrol areas rather than having to stick them in a single hex and hope for the best. That being the case, we can no longer tolerate limitation to preset routes for our TFs (this dates all the way back to PacWar, and needs to be tossed into a Brewster Buffalo and sent out to fend for itself).

As an aside, have you ever noticed how the automatic routing of your TFs invariably "bends" the course so as to run your ships into the worst possible trouble they can get into along the way?

And the WitP "I know you ordered our CVTF to move to a hex only 120 miles away, but we can't go through shallow water, so we will do a 1,200 mile end run that will becalm us in the morning within range of our girlfriends Kate and Betty, who will proceed to shove about two dozen torpedoes up our silly arses" dynamic is even worse than absurd.