A worthy opponent...

[Nemo121]

Segregative lists are always a bad idea. Particularly when the list creator allows personal animus to influence list creation.

In this instance every name mentioned by contributors, bar one, has been added to the list. The missing name is someone the thread originator got annoyed with about a week ago. So it seems that apart from the publicly quoted criteria of being nominated by an opponent you also are screened by aprezto's personal bias and whom he likes and dislikes.

Since the inability to actually be objective is so common this particular failing is common to such lists. Lists with this failing can never be representative and thus are worthless IMO. To have even minimal value these sorts of lists would have to be completely objective and they clearly are not.

[aprezto]

Nemo. Any paranoia? I've just missed your name - nothing sinister. Adding it now - althought by the sounds of it, you don't actually want to be on it anyway.

[scott64]

[8D]

[Nemo121]

Aprezto's, even still it is a useful example of the even subconscious biases which make these sorts of lists less than useful.

As to being on the list: I'm neutral. Listing my name or anyone else's is neither help nor hindrance since such lists are, by their nature segregative popularity polls riven with bias which don't have validity beyond their face validity.

If a committee were to be formed which checked pbem dates reached and formed a list which was stickied with a view to running for months and years and in which multiple members and a transparent protocol insured against biases of individual members holding sway then I think we'd be on to something worthwhile even though still, necessarily less than complete. This current incarnation though is not very useful IMO.


With that said, and unbidden, I would suggest AndyMac, n01487477, hart wig.morrow, jwilkerson, nikademus and 1eyedjacks. Each of them more than meets the criteria you have established above. If this is going to be done it might as well be done as properly as possible.

[Chickenboy]

Whew. I'm relieved that you've shown us how to do this list properly, Nemo121. For a minute there, I thought our praise for excellent and upstanding opponents was being improperly displayed. Now that it has your approval and repeated input into the process, I can rest assured.

That being said, I can tell you that listing of my PBEM partner herein (USSHenrico) was based not upon popularity or 'riven with bias', but a culmination of many other factors. This includes subjective assessments of his communication style, adaptability to impediments to gameplay (adoption of HRs as necessary), acceptance of interruptions in the game cycle, willingness to teach and willingness to learn. My listing is also based on a culmination of objective factors, such as turn 'turn around time', frequency of interruptions of gameplay, duration of current game (very important track record) and adherence to previous agreements (e.g., HR fighter sweep altitudes).

I am currently playing three PBEMs, yet I listed only one opponent on this list. That doesn't mean that my other partners are wanting, it means that USSHenrico is the one that I would put into this 'great' category at this time based upon the factors I cite above.

Accepting a PBEM opponent is like accepting a long-term relationship. You're going to be with this person for a long time based upon a common bond. Having some feedback from others ahead of time is a great way to increase the chance that your partner is a quality one.

How refreshing that Azpresto / Wobbly is looking at this from the positive point of view.

[AW1Steve]

Might I suggest , that rather than an endless lovefest of nominations, newbies might do what practiced and responsible participants have done for some time? Ask for referrences when you post an "opponents wanted?" Anyone who is unwilling to provide refrences to his skill,character and honesty is either a total newbie (having never played a PBEM) or someone that you might want to avoid. You might ask , how many PBEMs they've played, who with and general character information. ASK, Then Verify, to misquote a president of the 1980's. In other words, take some responsibility upon yourself (not to mention do a little work ) and find out. Don't expect every other member of forum to do YOUR work for you. Or to broadcast everyones greatness, or faults. USE that PM button. Get off your virtual butt and show that YOU are worthy of playing against. [:-][:@]

[Nemo121]

Chickenboy,

Well feel free to misrepresent things if you wish. I had thought that one of the reasons for a forum was to gather feedback. It seems however, here, that there is only interest in getting feedback one already agrees with and then misrepresenting the rest through the distorting prism of personal animus.

I offered my input in the same way others have offered theirs ( eg AW1STEVE etc ).. You can feel free to ignore it if you wish -that's fine - but to actively misrepresent it is unnecessary.

[jhdeerslayer]

Jomni - Never seen such a reliable and fast turn around in all my years of PBEM of whatever game! We were well matched.

[bigred]

Probably the best advice is below. Ask your future opponent for a few referrences.
Not all your good players make posts. All the players on AARs are our Hollywood players. The best player you may face will finish you off quick and not have a very long AAR.

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

Ask for referrences when you post an "opponents wanted?" Anyone who is unwilling to provide refrences to his skill,character and honesty is either a total newbie (having never played a PBEM) or someone that you might want to avoid. You might ask , how many PBEMs they've played, who with and general character information. ASK, Then Verify, to misquote a president of the 1980's. [:-][:@]

IMHO AARs are good for our collective ego as now most of us are too old to fight w/ our bodies so we fight w/ our minds. Keeps the mind and sword sharp as we study our future opponents.

I did recieve a comment about my partner from OSO once. After my partner stopped making turns.

[bigred]

FYI, I made some good friends on UV forum. I figure most of them will one day gravitate to AE.
Bourner
IKE99-who may be permanently banded from the forum.
RGIJN and
TOCAFF, who took my pbem virginity. He only plays newbies...

[tocaff]

OK, my contributions to this list, in no particular order are:  bigred,  Capt and SierraJuliet.  I won't bother mentioning others that are already on the list.

Actually I don't only play newbies, though some can be true gems in the rough.

Wouldn't this be better severed being moved to another location and possibly being stickied?

[bigred]

Define---

possibly being stickied?

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: bigred

Define---

possibly being stickied?

Botching the placement of flypaper???