lincoln

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Gents

If this is kept civil, I will - an an "outsider" - be really interested to hear American views on this subject. I know very little about the US Civil War - other than some of the battles - and am keen to understand more about the political situation at the time.

My initial thoughts - based purely on (very) high level knowledge is:

Lincoln was fundamentally a good man, who no doubt had to make some difficult decisions, but was able to keep the USA together - a USA that became the leader of the free world and helped save Europe from itself twice (albeit she was a tad late for the parties [;)]) and from the communist menace.

Are some people saying that they would rather the south have been allowed to leave the union? If so, what would the countries - USA and CSA? look like today. How would history have been affected?

warspite1

Anyone have a view re the questions I raised please?

Well I did state earlier that if secession had succeeded America would have been Balkanized. The US would have crumbled into mini-nations, with northern and southern states continuing to seceded anytime they disagreed with the federal governments.

Ironically Lincoln did encourage and accept the secession of West Virginia from Virginia. Despite this blatant hypocrisy I still have great admiration for Lincoln.

[SLAAKMAN]

Warspite1

Would the USA and CSA have fought themselves? What about Mexico? Tons of questions/possibles. Has anyone written a decent book on the subject?

There have been books on this from one degree to another but all you need to really know is that one day I will seize power and when I do, there will be the Comfy Chair to pay!

warspite1

Thank God for Abraham Lincoln

His obstructionism was only a temporary setback. Everything that has transpired has done so according to my design. Your friends, in the Western Hemisphere are walking into a trap, as is your British fleet. It was *I* who allowed the Allies to know the location of the ABM shield. It is quite safe from your pitiful little band. An entire legion of my best troops awaits them. Oh, I'm afraid the Iron Dome shield will be quite operational when your friends arrive. [:'(]

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: SLAAKMAN

Warspite1

Would the USA and CSA have fought themselves? What about Mexico? Tons of questions/possibles. Has anyone written a decent book on the subject?

There have been books on this from one degree to another but all you need to really know is that one day I will seize power and when I do, there will be the Comfy Chair to pay!

warspite1

Thank God for Abraham Lincoln

His obstructionism was only a temporary setback. Everything that has transpired has done so according to my design. Your friends, in the Western Hemisphere are walking into a trap, as is your British fleet. It was *I* who allowed the Allies to know the location of the ABM shield. It is quite safe from your pitiful little band. An entire legion of my best troops awaits them. Oh, I'm afraid the Iron Dome shield will be quite operational when your friends arrive. [:'(]

You really must remember to take your meds.

[Sarge]

“Preserved The Union”

Suggest secession justified war would be like saying that the US withdrawing from the UN would be an act of war , in 1861 no law existed in terms of prohibiting secession………..none

Lincoln clearly committed treason according to his oath and the limits the architects of the Republic put of the office , if a modern President sent the military door to door to confiscate weapons as Lincoln did there be a revolt, not to mention the endless list of other unconstitutional crimes he imposed on citizens. ……there was a reason the Republic was drawn up as “These” United States and not “The” United States which is becoming more obvious and increasingly relevant every day.

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: Sarge

“Preserved The Union”

Suggest secession justified war would be like saying that the US withdrawing from the UN would be an act of war , in 1861 no law existed in terms of prohibiting secession………..none

Lincoln clearly committed treason according to his oath and the limits the architects of the Republic put of the office , if a modern President sent the military door to door to confiscate weapons as Lincoln did there be a revolt, not to mention the endless list of other unconstitutional crimes he imposed on citizens. ……there was a reason the Republic was drawn up as “These” United States and not “The” United States which is becoming more obvious and increasingly relevant every day.

Well I can't win you over on that line of thinking.

So would be happier if there were a dozen or so little Amerikas carved out of the USA??[:o]

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Gents

If this is kept civil, I will - an an "outsider" - be really interested to hear American views on this subject. I know very little about the US Civil War ...

Didn't Europe have officers and ambassadors observing that conflict for both its military and political edification?

Didn't one such Prussian officer call the American Civil War a riot between two opposing rabbles, or words to that efffect?

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Gents

If this is kept civil, I will - an an "outsider" - be really interested to hear American views on this subject. I know very little about the US Civil War ...

Didn't Europe have officers and ambassadors observing that conflict for both its military and political edification?

Didn't one such Prussian officer call the American Civil War a riot between two opposing rabbles, or words to that efffect?

Something like that

[Gilmer]

One thing I loved about the movie Lincoln is the revelation to a huge number of movie goers that the Republican party supported the 13th amendment while the Democrats, to a man, opposed it. Lincoln engaged in a lot of back room deals to get enough Democrats to insure passage of the amendment.

There are a lot of misconceptions about American history and what Republicans supported and what Democrats supported.

[rodney727]

My two cents....or three....
Al was simply the best president we have had or will ever have. Most Americans don't understand that the Republican Party back then was and is more like the Democratic Party today. He did what he had to do to save the union. Please make no mistake. The ONLY reason for the civil war was slavery and I love how the OP TRIED TO DANCE HIS WAY OUT OF THAT FACT. Confused? Watch Gettysburg . Slavery was unconstitutional ....so the right to succeed based on that fact only was unconstitutional .

[SLAAKMAN]

So would be happier if there were a dozen or so little Amerikas carved out of the USA??

Absolutely!! No Obamacrap, no insurance companies, labor unions, feminists, Progressives, Socialists, Freemasons, Communists, Democrats, Marxists of any kind, Cholo gangbangers, Rockefellers, or Goldman Sachs or George Soros agents allowed in my turf!
[:'(]

[rodney727]

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Gents

If this is kept civil, I will - an an "outsider" - be really interested to hear American views on this subject. I know very little about the US Civil War ...

Didn't Europe have officers and ambassadors observing that conflict for both its military and political edification?

Didn't one such Prussian officer call the American Civil War a riot between two opposing rabbles, or words to that efffect?

At the end of the civil war the United States had the most advanced most powerful army in the world. Unmatched and could stand toe to toe with any nation in the world and win. When did the US become a world power? The minute the UK agreed to pay war damages to the US government after the civil war for building ships for the confederacy.

[SLAAKMAN]

At the end of the civil war the United States had the most advanced most powerful army in the world. Unmatched and could stand toe to toe with any nation in the world and win. When did the US become a world power? The minute the UK agreed to pay war damages to the US government after the civil war for building ships for the confederacy.

Oh those Gumbys! Did they actually pay it to those cretins in Washington??! No wonder the US is so doomed. Too bad I wasnt there & in charge of the Confederate Navy. That bogus blockade wouldve been crushed! [8|] [:@] [:'(]

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: rogo727

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Gents

If this is kept civil, I will - an an "outsider" - be really interested to hear American views on this subject. I know very little about the US Civil War ...

Didn't Europe have officers and ambassadors observing that conflict for both its military and political edification?

Didn't one such Prussian officer call the American Civil War a riot between two opposing rabbles, or words to that efffect?

At the end of the civil war the United States had the most advanced most powerful army in the world. Unmatched and could stand toe to toe with any nation in the world and win. When did the US become a world power? The minute the UK agreed to pay war damages to the US government after the civil war for building ships for the confederacy.

Absofreakinlutely!

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: SLAAKMAN

At the end of the civil war the United States had the most advanced most powerful army in the world. Unmatched and could stand toe to toe with any nation in the world and win. When did the US become a world power? The minute the UK agreed to pay war damages to the US government after the civil war for building ships for the confederacy.

Oh those Gumbys! Did they actually pay it to those cretins in Washington??! No wonder the US is so doomed. Too bad I wasnt there & in charge of the Confederate Navy. That bogus blockade wouldve been crushed! [8|] [:@] [:'(]

IF, IF, I agree to your appointment as all High Lord Dictator of the Unite States of Amerika, will you agree to leave the Bill of Rights alone??????

Also, I want to be appointed American Playboy Ambassador to the Playboy mansion! And I want a million, no a billion NO TEN BILLION DOLLARS.

[SLAAKMAN]

Also, I want to be appointed American Playboy Ambassador to the Playboy mansion! And I want a million, no a billion NO TEN BILLION DOLLARS.

You can have the moolah if you like but since our currency will actual silver, gold, platinum & palladium, fiat greenbacks might not be worth anything. But feel free to spend them if you can. [:'(]

IF, IF, I agree to your appointment as all High Lord Dictator of the Unite States of Amerika, will you agree to leave the Bill of Rights alone??????

Of course my Lord parruski. If you didnt get it, thats the reason for secession in the first place! [:D]

[rodney727]

Perhaps good sir you have a picture of Washington in your latrine....

[Sarge]

ORIGINAL: parusski

ORIGINAL: Sarge

“Preserved The Union”

Suggest secession justified war would be like saying that the US withdrawing from the UN would be an act of war , in 1861 no law existed in terms of prohibiting secession………..none

Lincoln clearly committed treason according to his oath and the limits the architects of the Republic put of the office , if a modern President sent the military door to door to confiscate weapons as Lincoln did there be a revolt, not to mention the endless list of other unconstitutional crimes he imposed on citizens. ……there was a reason the Republic was drawn up as “These” United States and not “The” United States which is becoming more obvious and increasingly relevant every day.

Well I can't win you over on that line of thinking.

So would be happier if there were a dozen or so little Amerikas carved out of the USA??[:o]

I wasn’t responding to present day “what if’s” hypotheticals, I was pointing out the ironic idolization many in the States have with Lincoln’s presidency ……………

[parusski]

ORIGINAL: rogo727

Perhaps good sir you have a picture of Washington in your latrine....

One of Lincoln's funniest stories about the picture of Washington in an English 'water closet'-“Nothing makes an Englishman sh*t faster than a picture of George Washington.”[:D][:D][;)]

[rodney727]

ORIGINAL: Sarge

ORIGINAL: parusski

ORIGINAL: Sarge

“Preserved The Union”

Suggest secession justified war would be like saying that the US withdrawing from the UN would be an act of war , in 1861 no law existed in terms of prohibiting secession………..none

Lincoln clearly committed treason according to his oath and the limits the architects of the Republic put of the office , if a modern President sent the military door to door to confiscate weapons as Lincoln did there be a revolt, not to mention the endless list of other unconstitutional crimes he imposed on citizens. ……there was a reason the Republic was drawn up as “These” United States and not “The” United States which is becoming more obvious and increasingly relevant every day.

Well I can't win you over on that line of thinking.

So would be happier if there were a dozen or so little Amerikas carved out of the USA??[:o]

I wasn’t responding to present day “what if’s” hypotheticals, I was pointing out the ironic idolization many in the States have with Lincoln’s presidency ……………

In time of peace yes but in time of war is another matter. Based on the fact the southern state succeeded for no other reason than slavery with the pretense of states "rites" behind it.

[Sarge]

ORIGINAL: rogo727
Most Americans don't understand that the Republican Party back then was and is more like the Democratic Party today. He did what he had to do to save the union..

Then by all means enlighten us , I don’t recall any ”he did what he had to do” limit clause on executive powers (I’ll take your word for it) but what was Honest Abe saving the Union from ?..........




PS/EDIT

ORIGINAL: rogo727
Based on the fact the southern state succeeded for no other reason than slavery with the pretense of states "rites" behind it.

seriously ?............. please disregard my above question