Hell bent on Lebensraum IV

[Michael T]

T1 22nd June 1941 (Clear)

Nothing too outlandish to start with. A fairly stock opening after such a long break. Still it’s not entirely watertight, some things went wrong. If the Soviets get lucky with MP’s they might break some pockets. I only sent 1 Pz and 2 Mot divisions to AGS. This opening attempts to minimise the number of routed escapee’s from encirclement. Hence the foray in to the swamps with motorised units. I will post some stats next turn. Its good to be back playing this again.

[mktours]

ORIGINAL: Michael T

T1 22nd June 1941 (Clear)

Nothing too outlandish to start with. A fairly stock opening after such a long break. Still it’s not entirely watertight, some things went wrong. If the Soviets get lucky with MP’s they might break some pockets. I only sent 1 Pz and 2 Mot divisions to AGS. This opening attempts to minimise the number of routed escapee’s from encirclement. Hence the foray in to the swamps with motorised units. I will post some stats next turn. Its good to be back playing this again.

I think that sending an extra Pz corps to south to lock 16A will be a better deal. We could view it in this way: Soviet will certainly rail 16A to the land bridge, and suppose it is willing to sacrifice it to slow the Germany advance, then it may cost more delay comparing with having the 16A killed in the south.
I didn't know why you try to kill the routed units? from my experience as SHC, those units are useless in the early stage, with the soviet NM stay at 40 in the first 2 turns, they are more like burden than useful asset, it will take ages before they return to combat ready.
Still, it is better to postpone Minsk and Lvov pockets for one turn, that way, the doomed units will suck huge replacement: men, weapons, supply, fuel, trucks, for example, a div is 8000 men if cut off, will be 11000 if in supply. It will cost 30000 more armaments to the Soviet side. In T1, soviet Armaments will be 1190000, Motor pool will be 80k. All units got their Cv down (because of lacking trucks and replacement all around). You could have a check of my opening. Link: tm.asp?m=3890124
As for Capturing Moscow, it isn't difficult to get your Pzs from South to Moscow in 1.08, I pocketed Moscow in T13.

[Michael T]

I have already made comment on the ploy of not closing pockets on T1 in sillyflower's AAR v BrianG. I won't repeat myself here.

As for 16th Army, IMO too many extra units are required from AGC to trap them and pull of the Lvov pocket. It's just not my MO at this point.

IMO the Soviet side (as of 1.08.09) is still the stronger if using the stock blizzard.

[chaos45]

stock blizzard will make for an interesting read if the game gets that far. The non-random weather will make for a tough/long summer for the soviets as its all clear weather auto until october, having seen alot of 1.08+ games now the soviets not having a single mud turn very well might just decide the game as we are seeing very close matches with both players being close to the same skill. An the single mud turn over the summer is often one of the few things saving the soviets from more massive losses. Time will tell will be watching both the AARs on this with interest.

One thing of note tho is stock blizzard = less Soviet guards units....so it might not be as huge a swing really...not sure as I havent seen many games go forward with stock blizzard.

[Michael T]

I am hopeful David (sillyflower) and I can have a return match under the same conditions once this game is done, unless some future patch warps the status quo.

[Michael T]

Well the TOE bug has killed this game. We are going to start again. Will post a new T1 when its done. Groan.

[ericv]

A nice way to start playing again after so long.

On the bright side, you get to do the things over that went wrong. Hopefully this gets patched soon.

[HITMAN202]

MT, what do you mean TOW bug ??? I suspect Sillyflower is doing some ledgerdemain behind the scene. He is a tricky dude, as we all know.

This will be a fun daily browse. It's special to have 2 top players that excel playing either side. I think MT is the top Axis expert; Sillyflower in the top 5 Soviet. Who'll win ?? It will be tough to beat a top Ruskie, but MT has shown remarkable strategic and tactical skills with the Germans in the past. Also I think he's very hungry. It could be bad for my friend. (MT, I'm going to call you out. you've got to call D. Mason by his avatar, Sillyflower. If not I think his stamen will dry up and you'll have a weak opponent. Ms. M can only accomplish so much.)

[HITMAN202]

It will be interesting to see if MT's repeat Turn1 is any different. MT had 16 routed units outside of pockets on the entire front (those which could be counted on his screen shot.) That number is high, at least for a player of MT's skill whose main first turn strategy was to limit it. No units routed into the Lvov pocket, so I think that's what MT was referring to when he wrote "some things went wrong."


Three observations.

1) MT is not pushing AGN infantry quickly to Pskov.

2) Massed a huge group of Pz's around Minsk.

3) Possibly set up a turn two pocket in eastern Pripet with an unusually placed Pz on the southern rim of the large AGC pocket and another strangely placed Pz NE of Rovno.

[Michael T]

My swamp dwellers have quite a bit to do with the meta game, based on my recollection of my first game with Silly a few years back.

[Michael T]

Challenge has been accepted again so work will begin on another T1.

[schascha]

Have a good turn!!!

I follow this AAR with great interest and pleasure.[&o][&o][&o][&o]

[Michael T]

Ok here is the new T1. Not much different from the last one. A little looser in some places.

[Michael T]

T1 26th June 1941 (Clear)

Bad things happened in the North in the Soviet turn. My opening up there was too loose and a pocket was reopened which will hold things up and will probably result in a cascade of more badness this turn.

In the Centre things go fairly well and 4 fat Soviet ID are herded in to the swamps west of Mogilev. I was surprised that the Soviets deployed such strong units here, where there is not much hope of hanging on. But they did suck up fuel and MP to get them out of the way so they did achieve something.
Hopefully next turn I might have enough fuel to put a bit of a dent in the land bridge before the Red’s get fully dug in. That is the plan anyway.

In the South the Red’s chose to defend west of Zhitomir and Vinnista. So we slice away a big chunk of their line between Proskurov and Kishinev. I was confident this pocket would hold but right at the death just before I closed it I discovered a Cavalry unit (they are so difficult to contain) so my Mech units have spawned in to regiments in an attempt to block the breakout.

On a another negative note the Kovel pocket was also broken, this incurs more delays. Groan.

So far my performance has been well below where I was 2 years ago. My opening was too leaky, several pockets were broken. These errors will compound against someone like Sillyflower. I like the opening, but it needs a tweak or two.

Also I have noticed it is much more difficult to reduce the Lvov pocket now, those guys are tough. This is one of the biggest changes I have noticed.

So much has changed with this game since I last played that I feel like a newbie. I need to get up to speed quick or this offensive will bog down even faster. But I am having fun and learning as I go. Back to HQ to ponder…..

[HITMAN202]

AGN has turned into a semi-disaster (maybe taking Riga has it's pluses), but you should still have a smile on your face. AGC has surrounded a few extra units and AGS may be a semi-disaster for Sillyflower. He will temporarily break the pocket, but how much more will he add to your harvest. My grade AGN D, AGC B+, and AGS A-. A strange turn 2 MT.

[Michael T]

In the south you can only take what is given. In the North/Centre I try to keep the Soviet guessing as to the Axis of the attack, so the weight is meant to be where it is. Unfortunately the leaky AGN T1 has held up a lot of Infantry which has made the whole northern wing very messy now. But my AGC Armour is where I want it to be, maybe a few hexes further east would be the norm but his sacrificial fat ID held me up.

[M60A3TTS]

ORIGINAL: HITMAN202


AGN has turned into a semi-disaster (maybe taking Riga has it's pluses), but you should still have a smile on your face. AGC has surrounded a few extra units and AGS may be a semi-disaster for Sillyflower. He will temporarily break the pocket, but how much more will he add to your harvest. My grade AGN D, AGC B+, and AGS A-. A strange turn 2 MT.

When was the last time you played?

[HITMAN202]

Man on man campaign ??? Over 2 years ago. It's too great of a time commitment in my RL (though all 6 kids re out of the house. I replay old campaign turns versus the computer and occasionally the road to Leningrad versus the A-1. I have a huge respect (and admiration) for all AAR posters.

[A game]

ORIGINAL: HITMAN202


AGN has turned into a semi-disaster (maybe taking Riga has it's pluses), but you should still have a smile on your face. AGC has surrounded a few extra units and AGS may be a semi-disaster for Sillyflower. He will temporarily break the pocket, but how much more will he add to your harvest. My grade AGN D, AGC B+, and AGS A-. A strange turn 2 MT.

Have to agree here AGN T1 looked sloppy and now your paying for it, also Im surprised you didnt take Riga MT, do you normally leave it on turn 1?
AGC is about standard for where the panzers should be.
AGS is looking fine as he has given you some free units to gobble up by putting his forward line way to far forward. Im very interested to see what sillyflower will do in the south committing to a close defense will be a disaster but Im sure he is smart enough to avoid that.

[Michael T]

I am not worried about Riga. I usually leave it as I prefer to have my mech units further south so they threaten the north of the centre as well. The north is bad but I wouldn't call it a disaster. Leningrad is not my priority ever early on. Momentum in the centre is the key. If you make good gains in the centre the north will fall back anyhow as otherwise the line gets stretched too long and thin for most Soviets. If you look at my old AAR's and others from my opponents (where I did not write one) you will see that AGC is my number one mission. I will let AGN slip behind so I can force more in the middle. But, this time I have let it slip further than usual due to my opening being a little too leaky. Not just in the north but also in the south. I will remedy that next time. I am only just coming to grips with all that has changed. My game will get back to where it was, even better. But it will take a game or two under my belt first.

As the German you have to sail close to the wind. Sometimes you roll over.