"insert funny title here" DBB-C Jorge(A) vs Runnersan(J)

[Jorge_Stanbury]

In better news, it was a great turn, some highlights:

- Hong Kong destroyers wrecked some havoc in Samah area. Surprise was achieved and he was lucky the main fleet escape, hence the yield of this foray was low (one ship). At least it might get him nervous and make him delay a bit:






--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Tourane at 68,68, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAK Ayato Maru
xAK Chihaya Maru
xAK Enju Maru
xAK Hokko Maru
xAK Hokuriku Maru
xAK Kisogawa Maru
xAK Kiyozumi Maru
xAK Kuroshio Maru
xAKL Meiko Maru
xAKL Kashi Maru
xAKL Kasui Maru
xAKL Tatibana Maru
xAKL Tatebu Maru
xAKL Matsutan Maru
xAKL Nittatsu Maru
xAP Brazil Maru
xAP Koan Maru
xAP Huso Maru

Allied Ships
DD Scout
DD Thanet


Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 67% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 11,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAP Brazil Maru at 11,000 yards
Japanese Task Force Manages to Escape
Task forces break off...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Tourane at 68,67, Range 12,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAK Ayato Maru
xAK Chihaya Maru
xAK Enju Maru
xAK Hokko Maru
xAK Hokuriku Maru
xAK Kisogawa Maru
xAK Kiyozumi Maru
xAK Kuroshio Maru
xAKL Meiko Maru
xAKL Kashi Maru
xAKL Kasui Maru
xAKL Tatibana Maru
xAKL Tatebu Maru
xAKL Matsutan Maru
xAKL Nittatsu Maru
xAP Brazil Maru
xAP Koan Maru
xAP Huso Maru

Allied Ships
DD Scout
DD Thanet


Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 67% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 11,000 yards
Japanese TF attempts to evade combat
Range increases to 12,000 yards...
Range increases to 12,000 yards...
Japanese Task Force Manages to Escape
Japanese Amphibious TF evades combat


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Samah at 69,63, Range 15,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
TB Hayabusa, Shell hits 2
xAK Zyuyo Maru, Shell hits 31, and is sunk

Allied Ships
DD Scout
DD Thanet

Japanese ground losses:
1646 casualties reported
Squads: 21 destroyed, 40 disabled
Non Combat: 15 destroyed, 61 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 28,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 17,000 yards
Range closes to 15,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 15,000 yards
Range closes to 13,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 13,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 13,000 yards
Range closes to 11,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 11,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 8,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 4,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 4,000 yards
Range closes to 3,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 3,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 2,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 3,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 3,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 2,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 2,000 yards
Davies, E.S. orders Allied TF to disengage
Range increases to 6,000 yards
DD Thanet engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Scout engages xAK Zyuyo Maru at 6,000 yards
Range increases to 9,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 9,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Hayabusa at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 17,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Hayabusa at 17,000 yards
Task forces break off...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Samah at 69,64, Range 17,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAK Ayato Maru
xAK Chihaya Maru
xAK Enju Maru
xAK Hokko Maru
xAK Hokuriku Maru
xAK Kisogawa Maru
xAK Kiyozumi Maru
xAK Kuroshio Maru
xAKL Meiko Maru
xAKL Kashi Maru
xAKL Kasui Maru
xAKL Tatibana Maru
xAKL Tatebu Maru
xAKL Matsutan Maru
xAKL Nittatsu Maru
xAP Brazil Maru
xAP Koan Maru
xAP Huso Maru

Allied Ships
DD Scout
DD Thanet

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 28,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 17,000 yards
Allied TF attempts to evade combat
Range increases to 17,000 yards...
Both Task Forces evade combat


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Samah at 69,63, Range 16,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Tsuta
DD Yomogi, Shell hits 1, on fire
TB Otori

Allied Ships
DD Scout
DD Thanet

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 24,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 18,000 yards
Range closes to 16,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 16,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 16,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 16,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Otori at 16,000 yards
Range closes to 13,000 yards
DD Scout engages DD Yomogi at 13,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Scout at 13,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Otori at 13,000 yards
Range closes to 11,000 yards
DD Thanet engages DD Tsuta at 11,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 11,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Otori at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 8,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 8,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Otori at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Scout at 10,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Otori at 10,000 yards
Range increases to 14,000 yards
DD Thanet engages DD Yomogi at 14,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Scout at 14,000 yards
Range increases to 18,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Thanet at 18,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 18,000 yards
Task forces break off...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Samah at 69,63, Range 16,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Tsuta
DD Yomogi, on fire
TB Otori, Shell hits 1, on fire

Allied Ships
DD Scout
DD Thanet, Shell hits 3, on fire, heavy damage

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 25,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 18,000 yards
Range closes to 16,000 yards...
Japanese open fire on surprised Allied ships at 16,000 yards
DD Tsuta fires at DD Thanet at 16,000 yards
DD Tsuta fires at DD Thanet at 16,000 yards
TB Otori fires at DD Thanet at 16,000 yards
Range closes to 15,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Thanet at 15,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Thanet at 15,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Otori at 15,000 yards
Range closes to 11,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Thanet at 11,000 yards
DD Scout engages DD Tsuta at 11,000 yards
DD Scout engages TB Otori at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 10,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 10,000 yards
DD Scout engages DD Yomogi at 10,000 yards
DD Thanet engages TB Otori at 10,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Thanet at 9,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Scout at 9,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 9,000 yards
DD Scout engages DD Tsuta at 9,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Thanet at 8,000 yards
DD Thanet engages DD Tsuta at 8,000 yards
Katagi R. orders Japanese TF to disengage
Range increases to 9,000 yards
DD Yomogi engages DD Scout at 9,000 yards
DD Scout engages DD Yomogi at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 14,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Thanet at 14,000 yards
DD Tsuta engages DD Scout at 14,000 yards
Task forces break off...

[Jorge_Stanbury]

Philippines:
I attacked his amphibious landing, and he either missed to LRCAP Aparri, or his planes failed to fly. Vigan had LRCAP but it was not too effective
End result is a few ships destroyed/ damaged.. likely some supply lost, and a only a few troops due to early war amphibious advantage's fast unloading



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Aparri at 82,73

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 16 NM, estimated altitude 5,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-40E Warhawk x 10
PBY-4 Catalina x 9

Allied aircraft losses
PBY-4 Catalina: 1 damaged

Japanese Ships
xAK Maya Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Kotoku Maru, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage
xAK Kuwayama Maru

Japanese ground losses:
128 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x PBY-4 Catalina launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 22.4in Mk 13 Torp.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Aparri at 82,73

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 4,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Allied aircraft
PBY-4 Catalina x 13

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
xAK Atlas Maru, Bomb hits 1
xAK Ohio Maru
xAK Karachi Maru, Bomb hits 1
xAK Takaoka Maru, Bomb hits 1
xAK Kuwayama Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire

Japanese ground losses:
250 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 11 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 12 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x PBY-4 Catalina bombing from 1000 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
2 x PBY-4 Catalina launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 22.4in Mk 13 Torp.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Vigan at 80,73

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 4,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 7

Allied aircraft
P-40E Warhawk x 21
PBY-4 Catalina x 8

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed

Japanese Ships
xAK Oigawa Maru
DMS W-9, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x PBY-4 Catalina launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 22.4in Mk 13 Torp.

CAP engaged:
3rd Ku S-1 with A6M2 Zero (7 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
7 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 13000.
Raid is overhead



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Aparri at 82,73

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 16 NM, estimated altitude 4,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Allied aircraft
PBY-4 Catalina x 11

Allied aircraft losses
PBY-4 Catalina: 2 damaged

Japanese Ships
xAK Tenzan Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Okiyu Maru, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage
xAK Kotoku Maru, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Keisho Maru

Japanese ground losses:
154 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 4 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 4 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x PBY-4 Catalina launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 22.4in Mk 13 Torp.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Vigan at 80,73

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 12 NM, estimated altitude 5,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 1

Allied aircraft
PBY-4 Catalina x 2

No Japanese losses

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
CL Naka

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x PBY-4 Catalina launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 22.4in Mk 13 Torp.

CAP engaged:
3rd Ku S-1 with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 1 scrambling)
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters to 5000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 27 minutes

[Jorge_Stanbury]

other news:

- Philippines air war: He attacked Manila port, AV Langley, PG Tulsa, SS Sculpin, SS Swordfish were hit and probably won't make it home

- CVL Ryujo TF attack for 3rd day in a row the Manila fleet, he managed to sink xAP Rochambeau while Neptuna will follow soon... but he had to get close to Balikpapan to do so... and that might be a mistake

- Malaya on schedule, he captured Khota Bharu, I was able to kill a few Sallys that came unescorted

- He also landed/ captured Tarawa

[Jorge_Stanbury]

More on DEI:

Ryujo TF had been bombing the TFs fleeing Manila, he got too close to Balikpapan, and he must be running low on sorties (definitively he run out of torpedoes).

I will risk my Dutch-American cruiser fleets to see if I can put some shells on Ryujo, hopefully getting it at least out of action for some time, if not sinking it altogether. His heavy cruiser will be fighting handicapped because the need to protect the carrier, and I think I might not actually fight until daytime, which improves my chances



there are 2 more surprises for next turn

[Jorge_Stanbury]

Dec10.41

I couldn't catch Ryujo, as he decided to turn east, I might try next turn, as only one of the raiding TFs was sighted

[Jorge_Stanbury]

I was not lucky on Samah; I sent Hong Kong's MTBs but they only found a damaged TB (from the previous fight against DM Thracian)

But at least some of my xAKs were able to reach Pakhoi with badly needed supplies

and not loading TFs at Samah in a daily basis means delays for Japan, so that is also is also good




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Samah at 69,63, Range 15,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
TB Hayabusa

Allied Ships
MTB 7
MTB 8
MTB 9
MTB 10
MTB 11
MTB 12
MTB 26
MTB 27

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 17,000 yards
Range closes to 15,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 15,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 15,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 27 at 15,000 yards
MTB 26 engages TB Hayabusa at 15,000 yards
Range closes to 14,000 yards
MTB 27 engages TB Hayabusa at 14,000 yards
Range closes to 12,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 8 at 12,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 8 at 12,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 9 at 9,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 7 at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 12,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 27 at 12,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 7 at 12,000 yards
Range increases to 15,000 yards
TB Hayabusa engages MTB 7 at 15,000 yards
Task forces break off...

[Jorge_Stanbury]

Much better luck at Miri/ Brunei:

while cover force CA Chokai and DD Sagiri were sinking some of my run-aways Manila TFs; DDs Peary and Pillsbury found Brunei's invasion fleet and sink a few ships

AND In the air phase, the Dutch/ Australian squadrons at Tarakan decided to fly and put a few more bombs on it



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Miri at 64,86, Range 10,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Chokai
DD Sagiri

Allied Ships
AM Finch, Shell hits 2, and is sunk
xAP President Madison, Shell hits 13, and is sunk
xAK Cape Fairweather, Shell hits 5, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
xAK American Leader, Shell hits 3, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Brunei at 65,87, Range 10,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
APD Aoi, Shell hits 1, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
TB Kasasagi, Shell hits 6, on fire
AMc Wa 19, Shell hits 4, and is sunk
xAK Hokko Maru, Shell hits 7, heavy fires
xAK Zinzan Maru
xAK Kinkasan Maru, Shell hits 10, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
xAK Giyu Maru, Shell hits 4, on fire
xAKL Kembu Maru, Shell hits 1
xAKL Kiko Maru, Shell hits 5, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Anbo Maru, Shell hits 10, heavy fires, heavy damage

Allied Ships
DD Peary
DD Pillsbury, Shell hits 2

Japanese ground losses:
1291 casualties reported
Squads: 42 destroyed, 31 disabled
Non Combat: 22 destroyed, 41 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 15 (8 destroyed, 7 disabled)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Miri at 64,87

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-339D x 2
Hudson I x 3

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
xAP Hakusan Maru, Bomb hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Hudson I bombing from 100 feet *
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 lb SAP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Brunei at 65,87

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 17 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-339D x 2
Hudson I x 3

Allied aircraft losses
Hudson I: 1 damaged

Japanese Ships
xAKL Kembu Maru, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage

Japanese ground losses:
133 casualties reported
Squads: 4 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 4 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Hudson I bombing from 100 feet *
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 lb SAP Bomb

[BBfanboy]

Nice work with hitting those landings! He will miss both the ships and the troops during his busy expansion phase! [:)]

[RangerJoe]

+1

Anything to slow down the expansion is good. Just don't make it too expensive. Low aggression on your TFs should keep them from a long slug fest again the Japanese Navy.

[Jorge_Stanbury]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

+1

Anything to slow down the expansion is good. Just don't make it too expensive. Low aggression on your TFs should keep them from a long slug fest again the Japanese Navy.

I kind of disagree with regards to aggression; I prefer high aggression, even if that means heavy loses. I kind of think about this as having angry dogs on a leash; I control when they get unleashed, and I want to know that if and when I do, they will bite hard. A few more minutes of fighting or reacting to multiple TFs can mean the difference between no/light damage vs a shell hitting a carrier and triggering a gasoline explosion. For some reason, the Japanese surface fleet is very hard to kill, I have found that multiple battles is the only thing that can guarantee it.
That said, I won't blindly send them to their deaths for no gain, I mean, other than mistakes or poor recon. I won't challenge Japanese cruisers and an equal basis, not in 41 or 42

Also important to mention I am sill using the "expendable" fleet. I know I can lose Boise, Houston, Marblehead, Repulse, all the Dutch... and more... and I am still going to be OK in the near future

And there is a window of opportunity in which I need to take as much advantage as I can.
At least in terms of naval awareness, he is pretty blind while I have a lot of naval search assets. That window will get closed very soon, when he captures a base (typically Jolo) and sets Zeros and Netties

[BBfanboy]

The reasons for Japanese warships being hard to kill early on are:
-crew experience
- very good captains
- a bonus to visual sighting at night
- the CAs are 11-35% heavier than the Allied treaty CAs
- the DDs are often newer and bigger than the Allied ones, and their torpedo is very good. So is their torpedo doctrine (accuracy factor).
- allied ships have poor experience and many mediocre captains - they have poor accuracy in battle
- the US torpedoes only rarely work, and using part of the ship's attack phase to launch them takes away from gunfire attacks.

But once the Allies start getting substantial numbers of hits before the crew can deal with the damage, the Japanese weakness in damage control means they often sink or leave the battle with much higher damage than they should have.
Allied radar can negate or surpass the Japanese bonus for night sighting. I am not sure if crew experience or Captain's Naval Skill goes into the calculation of the visual sighting initiative - i.e. - experience using the radar may be a factor besides the tech stats of the radar.

[Alfred]

There is no "bonus to visual sighting at night".  Nor is being "heavier" a factor taken into account in the combat algorithms.
 
Alfred

[RangerJoe]

I think that he is referring to having better armour and durability.

Low aggression will keep them in the fight with transports but just hit and run against the surface task forces. You want to sink or at least damage the loaded transports as that will slow the Japanese down the most.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

There is no "bonus to visual sighting at night".  Nor is being "heavier" a factor taken into account in the combat algorithms.

Alfred

Isn't tonnage part of the durability factor?

So the perceived Japanese advantage in initiative for night fighting comes from Naval Skill and crew experience? I thought I had seen some discussion that the game tried to capture the Japanese doctrine of keeping night watchkeepers out of bright light in daytime, so I thought that was built in.

[Alfred]

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: Alfred

There is no "bonus to visual sighting at night".  Nor is being "heavier" a factor taken into account in the combat algorithms.

Alfred

Isn't tonnage part of the durability factor?

So the perceived Japanese advantage in initiative for night fighting comes from Naval Skill and crew experience? I thought I had seen some discussion that the game tried to capture the Japanese doctrine of keeping night watchkeepers out of bright light in daytime, so I thought that was built in.

1. There is no direct relationship between ship durability and ship tonnage.

One can have a large sized ship (as measured by its tonnage) with a low durability rating. An example would be an ocean liner. In either instance, it is not a metric fed into the combat algorithms.. More tonnage per se does not make a ship harder to sink.


2. A ship's durability rating does not determine how difficult it is to be sunk.

Durability, amongst other factors, is an important metric in determining the quantum of VPs gained from its sinking. It is also a very important metric for determining the "cost" of building the ship.


3. The Eyeball Mark I detection algorithms do not differentiate between night/day operation, nor between the different nationalities.

This generally extends to all detection algorithms. Pilot skill is very important, as is type of aircraft (and equipment on board). Weather conditions and speed of engaging TFs (in relative terms) are taken into account.


4. Crew experience is rated separately for night and day operation, on an individual ship basis.

As a generalisation, early war Japanese and British ships have a much higher night rating than do USN ships. This rating is an important input into the combat algorithms.



Much of what passes for discussion re game mechanics is just wrong. Other than commentary from the devs, there are only a very few non devs whose commentary is accurate and worth noting. The absence of dev commentary in a thread is not ipso facto, an indication that the contents of that thread are accurate. In fact I am aware of instances where devs decided to not correct thread commentary.

Alfred

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: Alfred

There is no "bonus to visual sighting at night".  Nor is being "heavier" a factor taken into account in the combat algorithms.

Alfred

Isn't tonnage part of the durability factor?

So the perceived Japanese advantage in initiative for night fighting comes from Naval Skill and crew experience? I thought I had seen some discussion that the game tried to capture the Japanese doctrine of keeping night watchkeepers out of bright light in daytime, so I thought that was built in.

1. There is no direct relationship between ship durability and ship tonnage.

One can have a large sized ship (as measured by its tonnage) with a low durability rating. An example would be an ocean liner. In either instance, it is not a metric fed into the combat algorithms.. More tonnage per se does not make a ship harder to sink.


2. A ship's durability rating does not determine how difficult it is to be sunk.

Durability, amongst other factors, is an important metric in determining the quantum of VPs gained from its sinking. It is also a very important metric for determining the "cost" of building the ship.


3. The Eyeball Mark I detection algorithms do not differentiate between night/day operation, nor between the different nationalities.

Now this really surprises me. I had no idea.

This generally extends to all detection algorithms. Pilot skill is very important, as is type of aircraft (and equipment on board). Weather conditions and speed of engaging TFs (in relative terms) are taken into account.


4. Crew experience is rated separately for night and day operation, on an individual ship basis.

As a generalisation, early war Japanese and British ships have a much higher night rating than do USN ships. This rating is an important input into the combat algorithms.



Much of what passes for discussion re game mechanics is just wrong. Other than commentary from the devs, there are only a very few non devs whose commentary is accurate and worth noting. The absence of dev commentary in a thread is not ipso facto, an indication that the contents of that thread are accurate. In fact I am aware of instances where devs decided to not correct thread commentary.

Alfred

[Jorge_Stanbury]

Thanks a lot for the comments!

Dec11.41
- not a lot of action, he moved Ryujo's TF west. He was able to sink a few xAKLs by doing so. It is now close to Manad and I will try, once again, to intercept it

- I had good luck with Dutch subs, I think 2 or 3 xAKs went down near Malaya

- Miri, Legaspi, Manus captured. Kavieng and Guam invaded, will fall tomorrow

- No invasion at Brunei, which means that it was hard hit

- CL Mauritius, at Singapore, is ready for action

[Jorge_Stanbury]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Soc Trang at 57,74, Range 21,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAK Arima Maru, Shell hits 30, and is sunk
xAK Nankai Maru, Shell hits 10, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Kenyo Maru, Shell hits 10, and is sunk
xAK Kogyo Maru, Shell hits 16, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Tatutaki Maru, Shell hits 10, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Teiyo Maru, Shell hits 14, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Tatumiya Maru, Shell hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Naruto Maru, Shell hits 11, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Noto Maru, Shell hits 9, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
xAK Mogamigawa Maru, Shell hits 26, and is sunk
xAK Koryu Maru, Shell hits 25, and is sunk
xAK Kokai Maru, Shell hits 15, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Yahiko Maru, Shell hits 13, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru, Shell hits 14, heavy fires, heavy damage

Allied Ships
CL Mauritius, Shell hits 1
DD Encounter
DD Isis
DD Jupiter

Japanese ground losses:
13012 casualties reported
Squads: 130 destroyed, 236 disabled
Non Combat: 301 destroyed, 506 disabled
Engineers: 29 destroyed, 49 disabled
Guns lost 254 (106 destroyed, 148 disabled)
Vehicles lost 83 (35 destroyed, 48 disabled)

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 28,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 21,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 21,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Kokai Maru at 21,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 21,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Noto Maru at 21,000 yards
Range closes to 20,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 20,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Koryu Maru at 20,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 20,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Noto Maru at 20,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Arima Maru at 20,000 yards
Range closes to 17,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Arima Maru at 17,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Kokai Maru at 17,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Arima Maru at 17,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Arima Maru at 17,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Kenyo Maru at 17,000 yards
Range closes to 16,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Arima Maru at 16,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Arima Maru at 16,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Arima Maru at 16,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Arima Maru at 16,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Naruto Maru at 16,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Kenyo Maru at 16,000 yards
Range closes to 12,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Tatumiya Maru at 12,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Koryu Maru at 12,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Arima Maru at 12,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Naruto Maru at 12,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Tatumiya Maru at 12,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Arima Maru at 12,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Kokai Maru at 9,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Arima Maru at 9,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Kokai Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Koryu Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Arima Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Noto Maru at 8,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Kenyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Arima Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 7,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Arima Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Koryu Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Tatumiya Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Tatutaki Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Nankai Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Arima Maru at 7,000 yards
Range increases to 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Arima Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Nankai Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Noto Maru at 8,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Tatutaki Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Kenyo Maru at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Arima Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Koryu Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Tatutaki Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 7,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Naruto Maru at 7,000 yards
xAK Arima Maru sunk by DD Jupiter at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Noto Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Koryu Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Koryu Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Koryu Maru at 7,000 yards
xAK Noto Maru sunk by DD Encounter at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Naruto Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 7,000 yards
Range closes to 6,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Koryu Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Kokai Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Kenyo Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Naruto Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Tatutaki Maru at 6,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 6,000 yards
Range increases to 7,000 yards
xAK Koryu Maru sunk by CL Mauritius at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Kokai Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Naruto Maru at 7,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Kenyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Nankai Maru at 7,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Kokai Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 7,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Tatutaki Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Nankai Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 7,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Kokai Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Kogyo Maru at 7,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 7,000 yards
Palliser, Arthur FE orders Allied TF to disengage
Range increases to 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Yahiko Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Kokai Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Tatumiya Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Nankai Maru at 8,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 11,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 11,000 yards
DD Isis engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 11,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Tatumiya Maru at 11,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Teiyo Maru at 11,000 yards
DD Jupiter engages xAK Tatutaki Maru at 11,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Nankai Maru at 11,000 yards
DD Encounter engages xAKL Yoshinogawa Maru at 11,000 yards
Range increases to 15,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Mogamigawa Maru at 15,000 yards
CL Mauritius engages xAK Tatumiya Maru at 15,000 yards
Range increases to 19,000 yards
Range increases to 24,000 yards
Task forces break off...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Jolo at 73,88, Range 18,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
APD Fuji
TB Hiyodori
AMc Toroshima Maru
PB Heiei Maru #7
xAK Syoka Maru
xAK Rokko Maru
xAK Igasa Maru
xAKL Ryoyu Maru #21
xAKL Sasago Maru

Allied Ships
DD Scout

Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions: 28,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 18,000 yards
Japanese TF attempts to evade combat
Range increases to 18,000 yards...
Japanese Amphibious TF evades combat


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Jolo at 72,87, Range 18,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
APD Fuji
TB Hiyodori, Shell hits 1
AMc Toroshima Maru, Shell hits 2, on fire
PB Heiei Maru #7
xAK Syoka Maru, Shell hits 1
xAK Rokko Maru
xAK Igasa Maru, Shell hits 2, on fire
xAKL Ryoyu Maru #21, Shell hits 9, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Sasago Maru

Allied Ships
DD Scout, Shell hits 1

Japanese ground losses:
138 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 9 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

[RangerJoe]

That looked like a division plus! [&o]

If you have a surface combat TF set for low aggression, they will stay and fight those but will try to escape from enemy combat units. That should slow the Japanese down. I wonder why no escorts. [&:]

[Jorge_Stanbury]

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

That looked like a division plus! [&o]

If you have a surface combat TF set for low aggression, they will stay and fight those but will try to escape from enemy combat units. That should slow the Japanese down. I wonder why no escorts. [&:]

inexperience... at least against a human player.

looks like he has not changed the starting TFs& destinations, which is a huge mistake,
I now know I hit TF108 "Singora followup".. which starts without escorts (he didn't add). I basically killed 2/3 of 18th Division... one of the best Japan can field + a few Art and Engineer regiments