How much Oil for OZ and how is the best way?

[freeboy]

ok, but how much oil is available (extra), how much supply readilly shippable from the us, My point is that while your shipping oil, this unlimited amount of supply and fuel waits in the us to be used, why bother.. is it really that much? Too much work for me to worry about unless you can show me it will be efficent and not "ship costly"

[worr]

ORIGINAL: moses

Oil is more effecient. Each unit of oil you get to Oz will give you one fuel, one supply as well as run the industry there. fuel only gives you fuel.

You sure?

I thought the fuel was produced at the oil sight....not upon transport.

Worr, out

[tsimmonds]

ORIGINAL: worr

ORIGINAL: moses

Oil is more effecient. Each unit of oil you get to Oz will give you one fuel, one supply as well as run the industry there. fuel only gives you fuel.

You sure?

I thought the fuel was produced at the oil sight....not upon transport.

Worr, out

Oil gives you fuel twice: once when the oil point is produced (1 fuel point per oil center), then again when it is converted to HI points (1.33 fuel point per HI point produced). In the first case the fuel appears at the oil resource center, in the second at the HI center where the oil is consumed. Note that since an oil center produces a single fuel point together with 6 oil points, and that a single oil point (together with a resource point of course) produces 1.33 fuel points, the amount of fuel produced in the second step is 8X the amount of fuel produced in the first step....)

[Central Blue]

If you're playing Lemur's scenario it helps to get oil to Australia to jump start their economy. Not so much of an issue in scenario 15 IIRC. Probably not so much of an issue in the late war.

"Excess" oil in the US seems to end up in San Diego. There is quite a pile there at the begining of the war, and two large oilers to move it. If I can read these formula's right, you can create aprox 53,000 fuel points and 40,000 supply points for the fuel spent on those two oilers. You can then run short supply hops around Australia, rather than try to supply and fuel each city there with runs from Pago Pago. And it's much easier to supply a place like Port Moresby from Australia.

Oil also goes into the manpower formula. So I assume some is needed if you want to keep your Anzac units up to strength.

[PeteG662]

So with all the transport of Oil, what is the cost in fuel for those ships to transport it half way around the world? Explain the cost benefit analysis of transporting anything really. Pull as much as you can out of DEI than work from the ends and let Oz deal with what they have in their limited economy. The resources used to transport need to be factored into the whole equation here.

[ZOOMIE1980]

G4M1's might be able to reach Canton from Tarawa. Pago-Pago is your best bet. Send a small TK TF to Pago with fuel so the island has something to refuel with! Set that TF to Computer Controlled (this is NOT auto-convoy) and it will make repeated fuel runs to keep Pago stocked up.


The create your oil TF, set it to Do Not Unload, homebase Brisbane or Sydney, destination Pago-Pago. Remember when it finally arrives to remove the Do Not Unload setting or it will just sit there forever and never unload. When done, set it's homebase back to SF or whereever and its destination Pago-Pago. Rinse and repeat.....

Your massive AK TF's hauling supply don't need the refuel stop over, though. However, route them to Auckland, not OZ, directly. Keep a fairly large collection of the 4500 or less sized AK's at Auckland. Use those to move the supplies where needed in the SW Pacific. Same with Fuel TF's, but TK's will need to use the Pago-Pago pitstop. You can go directly to Auckland from SF and stay out of G4M1 range at Tarawa. However if the Jap player has moved further down than that you will have to reroute to the south.

[Hartley]

Tarawa would have to be at least a size 4 airfield for Bettys.

[worr]

ORIGINAL: irrelevant
Oil gives you fuel twice: once when the oil point is produced (1 fuel point per oil center), then again when it is converted to HI points (1.33 fuel point per HI point produced). In the first case the fuel appears at the oil resource center, in the second at the HI center where the oil is consumed. Note that since an oil center produces a single fuel point together with 6 oil points, and that a single oil point (together with a resource point of course) produces 1.33 fuel points, the amount of fuel produced in the second step is 8X the amount of fuel produced in the first step....)

Does this mean it is possible to produce extra fuel each time you move oil around?

So you could take Oil from one base and take it to an island with a factory and watch it convert itself into fuel. Then you could take that same oil and deliver it to another factory location and get the same bonus once again?

Worr, out

[Mr.Frag]

Don't get confused Worr.

A Oil Resource location produces 6 Oil + 1 Fuel per turn.

When you ship that 6 oil somwhere where HI is, it is converted to (6 x 1.33) 8 Fuel

You are not getting any extra by doing anything special. This is the normal course of the game.

All that is being said is shipping Oil instead of Fuel (assuming you have spare HI capacity to convert it) nets you some extra fuel for the same amount of shipping used. ie: a 18,000 TK will be 18,000 fuel or 23940 (oil -> fuel)

This works dandy until you saturate the HI capacity *which* being the Allies, you can not expand at all. Past that point, you stop getting *any* extra fuel because the Oil just sits there waiting it's turn to be converted.

[worr]

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag
You are not getting any extra by doing anything special. This is the normal course of the game.

I wasn't suggesting otherwise, Mr.Frag.

Sorry if I confused anyone here. I was actually asking about a second shipment of the same oil to another HI location. Say you go from Palembang, to Singapore. You'll get the fuel production there. Understood. But if you pick up that same oil and take it to Japan, what will happen then as it reaches a new HI?

As I understand it there are some production equations that work on a pool and others that interact only with specific locations.

I hope this helps.

Worr, out

[DrewMatrix]

All this "oil to Oz" stuff seems a little theorectical to me (but that may be because I am only up to July 1942 and haven't started to consume mega quantities of supply yet).

All the West Coast ports are almost always at 999999 fuel and supply. I just can't ship it out fast enough. So what good does shipping a little Oil to Oz so it can make a little extra supply and fuel there do me?

I suppose you will tell me that by mid 1944 I will be consuming 100s of thousands of tons per day in bombing raids or something.

[Mr.Frag]

ORIGINAL: worr

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag
You are not getting any extra by doing anything special. This is the normal course of the game.

I wasn't suggesting otherwise, Mr.Frag.

Sorry if I confused anyone here. I was actually asking about a second shipment of the same oil to another HI location. Say you go from Palembang, to Singapore. You'll get the fuel production there. Understood. But if you pick up that same oil and take it to Japan, what will happen then as it reaches a new HI?

As I understand it there are some production equations that work on a pool and others that interact only with specific locations.

I hope this helps.

Worr, out

Oil is useless without Heavy Industry to use it. No pool stuff here ... It's either in the hex with the HI or the HI does not run and nothing is produced.

[moses]

Once you drop off the oil at a HI location and it converts to fuel the oil disappears. It has been used up to produce fuel. The oil no longer exists so you can't pick it up and tranport it anywhere.

[worr]

ORIGINAL: moses

Once you drop off the oil at a HI location and it converts to fuel the oil disappears. It has been used up to produce fuel. The oil no longer exists so you can't pick it up and tranport it anywhere.

Thanks, Moses.

I figured as much. In other words, it generates fuel when it is used, not as it is delivered.

Worr, out

[Hartley]

ORIGINAL: Beezle

AllAll the West Coast ports are almost always at 999999 fuel and supply. I just can't ship it out fast enough.

I'm in June '42 scenario 13, and none of these ports has more than 80,000 supplies or 50,000 fuel.

In fact, there a lot of AKs/TKs just waiting to load something.