War Plan Orange Mod, November Update! (Screens) (New Gunboat Screens now added!)

[Tankerace]

I make no promises to that effect, but I have been planning that when this is released to release new scenarios covering the Battles at Tsushima (Russo-Japanese War) and Manila Bay (Spanish American). But, that is at least a few months in the future.

[Skyros]

Oh to be young and have spare time. Thanks Tanker your efforts are appreciated by all of us.[&o]

[CatLord]

Just for my personnal culture:

I have seen a book today named "War Plan Orange: United States Strategy to Defeat Japan, 1897-1945" by Es Miller.

Is that the best book on this subject (if I want to read only one out of curiosity ?) or do you have another to recommend ?

Cat

[Tankerace]

Personally, from what I have seen and heard, it is the best book on the subject. I'd still read other works, but I know I want to buy it (kinda strapped for cash at the moment).

The thing to understand about the Orange Plans (all three of them) is that the first and the second were plausible (War Plan Orange - 1 from about 1897-1920 and War Plan Orange - 3, late 1920s-end of World War II). In fact, War Plan Orange -3 was used to help determine the counteroffensive strategy during World War II.

War Plan Orange -2, which this mod will be using, bordered on fantasy thanks to the Washington Naval Treaty. The plan was, upon declaration of war, the American fleet would sail from San Diego to the Phillippines, refueling at Pearl Harbor, Wake, Guam, and finally Manila. Upon arriving at the Phillippines, the fleet would form a battleline, and blockade the Japanese home islands, and make it impossible to attack the PI, or any resource area. So, the Japanese would be faced with one of two possibilities (in theory):

1: Keep your fleet at bay, and try to run the blockade with small ships.

2: Form your fleet, and seek battle with the American Battleline.

If the Japanese took option 1, eventually (again, in theory) they would starve, and be forced to sue for peace.

If the Japanese took option 2, their fleet would (according to the plan) be destroyed by the larger numbers of American ships.

The Washington Naval Treaty, despite helping ensure number 2's success (The infamous 5:5:3 ratio), invalidated the success of the plan. The Plan bordered on fantasy, because the scrapping of most of the fleet rendered a successful blockade all but impossible, and with limits on battleship and carrier construction, left the fleet vulnearble to air attack (Say, at Guam when refueling).

Since this mod assumes that the Washington Naval Treay did not happen, it is therefore possible that War Plan Orange -2 might have succeeded.

Another really good one is:

Plans for War Against the British Empire and Japan: The Red, Orange, and Red-Orange Plans, 1823-1938 (American War Plans, 1919-1941, Vol 2) by Steven T. Ross

This is a very good book, because it shows just what was being thought after World War I. Plan Red, a naval war against Canada, Britain, and Australia; Plan Orange a naval War against Japan; and Red-Orange, a naval war against The British Commonwealth and Japan. Very tricky stuff.

Though I make no promises, I may have a Red-Orange scenario variant after the release of the main mod.

[CatLord]

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

Personally, from what I have seen and heard, it is the best book on the subject. I'd still read other works, but I know I want to buy it (kinda strapped for cash at the moment).

OK, thanks. [:)]

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

Another really good one is:

Plans for War Against the British Empire and Japan: The Red, Orange, and Red-Orange Plans, 1823-1938 (American War Plans, 1919-1941, Vol 2) by Steven T. Ross

I can't find this one, but a paperback on the subject by the same author is available in the UK:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASI ... 30-5579832

It's probably good enough if I don't want to dwell too much in the subject. I may have a look [:)]

Thanks again,

Cat

[Desertmole]

Tankerace, have you ever read Great Pacific War By Hector Bywater? Interesting book written in 1925 on a fictional war in the 1931-33 timeframe. Bywater was a former agent for British Naval Intelligence (are they ever really former?) and a naval correspondent for several US and British newspapers and periodicals. About 10-15 years ago a fellow named Honan wrote a biography on him, and also had GPW republished. Honan had two theories the first was that the Japanese based all their war plans on Bywaters works (he wrote two Pacific strategy books in addition to GPW) and secondly that the Japanese murdered Bywater in 1940 because he understood their plans and was a threat to them.[8|]

[Jorm]

Hi there i have read some of this book by Bywater
Its not very good and i doubt it will assist Tanker in his grand endevour. Perhaps to clarify, its not that its a bad book its just that it has not aged well
a vastly better book is "War Plan Orange: United States Strategy to Defeat Japan, 1897-1945" by Es Miller which im rereading now and if tanker can get a copy i think it will assist him greatly in when he gets to the scenario editor part of the MOD, either way , its a fasinating period of "what if" history that im keen to get to explore through Tankers manifestation of WPO.

cheers
Paul

[Tankerace]

I'm using a great variety of sources to complete this work. However, those strategies will be more useful to you, the player, than me, the designer. I give you the tools, you do the strategy.

Some of this mod will be ahistorical. I can find the locations and homeports of all the major ships, but references to submarines and Destroyers in this period are lacking. What this means is that in San Diego you will have fifty 4 stack destroyers in reserve, just as in history. However, the probably won't be the same fifty that were actually there.

Bywaters book is a fascinating read, but I honestly don't think it could help. I too am very excited about playing this project. it will be interesting reads in the AAR section of convoy battles, or the grand "Jutlandesque" showdown of forces.

One thing I am trying to do is to accurately model the ship classes. For instance, instead of giving you 1 generic graphic and 1 generic "V and W" class British destroyer, you are instead getting 8 different classes, complete with 8 different graphics. That for the moment is my key aim. For the scenarios, I am going to put LCUs and ships where they were historically. It is up to you the player to execute War Plan Orange, or make up a plan of your own.

On those 8 classes, for those interested, here they are:

Admiralty V Class
Thornycroft V Class (Same as above, but different layout, 3-4", and Thornycroft Funnels)
Admiralty W Class (Same as V, but 6 TT instead of 4)
Thornycroft W Class (Same as Thorny V, with same differences as Adm. V)
Admiralty V Leader Class (Same as regular Adm. V, but different layout and fitted as a Destroyer leader)
Admiralty Modified V Class (Same as Adm. V, but 4-4.7" instead of 4-4")
Admiralty Modified W Class (Same as Adm. Mod V, with differences of regular Adm. W)
Thornycroft Modified W Class (Same as Admiralty Mod. W)

[jcjordan]

Great art files & effort put into them but one thing is missing from the gunboats - Richard Crenna & Steve McQueen [;)]. Will be looking forward to it to try it out.

[Tankerace]

[:D]

Sorry guys, I know I promised an update today, but I just finished doing all British cruisers and destroyers, in classes, graphics, and individual ships, so I am a little tired. I'll put one up on Friday. If I can get some more work done, I'll even put up some battle screens.

[showboat1]

The types of ships being included in this monster are unreal. I just can't wait! Everytime I come to this forum and check out the screen shots its all I can do to not drool uncontrollably.