Turnaround? Lowpe (J) vs Tiemanj (A) Stock

[Lowpe]

Ok, speaking of Myojo, my first training pilots are reaching 60+ in LowN. To what should I train my potential Kamikazes before returning them to the pools?

Is it pointless to train try and get their defence up?

[Lokasenna]

ORIGINAL: obvert

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: obvert




From what I remember the Myojo is pretty fragile and it's definitely pretty slow. It was originally a modified Val made of wood to save on precious aluminum! [:)][X(]

So it packs punch. The question is whether the punch will ever arrive at target. For me a Judy of any kind, and especially a Grace, is a better option.

I am going to give them a try, and they are made of lots of wood.[:)]

I made the plane based on early comments to the AAR, I think from Spidery, but also backed up by you that there were several training squadrons that can upgrade to the Myojo but not Judies for kamikaze work.

Of course I have to survive till I get the training squadrons first.[:)]

However, I shut down my Judy factories until the D4Y4 comes along in a month or so, so the Myojo will probably get pressed into duty as a landbased bomber.

I was wondering what a squadron bombing at Chungking would do? Perhaps if used as a divebomber it would really eat up the supplies inherent in the Chinese corps there? Might be ugly those as they are fragile.

Funny. Looking at their durability the Myojo comes in at 30! The Tsurugi is much less durable at what, 22?

So the Myojo is actually more durable than the Judy. Go figure.

It's a hell of a lot faster than the bi-planes that come in those training groups and some other late arrivals at 292, so it might be better than i'd been thinking. I guess I dismissed it in relation to the speed of the Judy/Grace, but by the time I had the late game groups forgot that it was actually much better than what arrived in them and might be the best available in some upgrade paths.

DBs should suffer at Chungking because of the Chinese small AA guns, of which they have a lot. Although they have very few medium and heavy AA guns, they have a lot of 50 cal MG devices that will hit the DBs below 4k. I'd stay at 6k or above, but stye might do okay from there.

Ah, but once they're out of supply.... [;)].

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Ok, speaking of Myojo, my first training pilots are reaching 60+ in LowN. To what should I train my potential Kamikazes before returning them to the pools?

Is it pointless to train try and get their defence up?

All of these factors improve survivability. I had some kami pilots that were China veterans of 75-80exp and 70 defense with 70 low naval bombing skill. Flying a solid airframe like the Peggy(T) they get through pretty well.

The basic kami pilot for me would be 40-50exp trained only in low naval skill to 65-70. I had a lot though that were not the basic pilots and I don't know really how much that changed outcomes. I'd have to test it.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

Ah, but once they're out of supply.... [;)].

Or even on the day of deliberate attacks to reduce supply even more. Might speed up the siege, which would make losing a few planes ok.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: obvert

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Ok, speaking of Myojo, my first training pilots are reaching 60+ in LowN. To what should I train my potential Kamikazes before returning them to the pools?

Is it pointless to train try and get their defence up?

All of these factors improve survivability. I had some kami pilots that were China veterans of 75-80exp and 70 defense with 70 low naval bombing skill. Flying a solid airframe like the Peggy(T) they get through pretty well.

The basic kami pilot for me would be 40-50exp trained only in low naval skill to 65-70. I had a lot though that were not the basic pilots and I don't know really how much that changed outcomes. I'd have to test it.

Thanks, that is helpful. [&o] I was wondering what might happen end game with those guys.

[Lowpe]

Dec 2, 1943

No night bombing.

Guam invaded. Trinkat's runways get 4E love from Allies. Moulmein and Chiang Mai holding.

April 15th, bad, bad day IRL; too busy, sad, mad, and poor to write more.[:(]

[DanSez]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

April 15th, bad, bad day IRL; too busy, sad, mad, and poor to write more.[:(]

May all those demons run away...
You will live to fight another day...
Troubles come in tide and flood...
Just keep the faith with those you've loved...

[Lowpe]

Bombarding Car Nicobar this day...

Musashi getting radar upgrade....

Myojo started production...

Frantically moving troops...

and oil, and fuel and supply.

I have burned thru all my midget subs to no effect, one scare. Much better track record with MTBs.[:D]

Looking at getting my Sentai's that upgrade to Nicks back to the HI...for upgrade in a month to Nick D night fighters.

[Lowpe]

Nov 3, 1943

In the bleak midnight hours, Bunji leads a big group into Cap Nicobar....

Unfortunately, LCTs' are like fall leaves, no matter how many you clean up there are always more come morning.

[mind_messing]

It's even worse when your ships start to waste Long Lances on those low value ships. Even more so now that the Long Lance is the only qualitative edge you have over the Allied ships.

It is something I wished the code accounted for. If DL on the TF was high enough, they'd only use secondary weapons, or something to that effect.

Why waste the Long Lances when the hoards of 25mm cannons will do the job for a fraction of the rearm cost?

[ny59giants]

Looking at that TF composition, I would have had a SC TF with 4 DDs lead the bombardment TF in as you had 9 DDs in it. They would have dealt with any merchants unloading.

Yes, the Allies have lots and lots of LSTs, but not that many come in India. So, he would have to ship them in to replace losses.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Looking at that TF composition, I would have had a SC TF with 4 DDs lead the bombardment TF in as you had 9 DDs in it. They would have dealt with any merchants unloading.

Yes, the Allies have lots and lots of LSTs, but not that many come in India. So, he would have to ship them in to replace losses.

They are LCTs, don't even show up in the ships sunk screen.[&:]

I agree, it is a large TF, but I have been using it to evacuate troops from Trinkat, and since the Allies have DL on it, I am hoping they can't quite figure out what it is doing.

Plus, I have noticed that when I break down a fleet like that and try to run a surface bombardment they often stop short the first day.

Bombardment was very successful![:)] I have managed to keep those two Allied bases below serious offensive air missions, which would be a bummer since Great Nicobar is 18 hexes from Singers, but as long as the damage stays up, it isn't getting past AF size 1.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

It's even worse when your ships start to waste Long Lances on those low value ships. Even more so now that the Long Lance is the only qualitative edge you have over the Allied ships.

It is something I wished the code accounted for. If DL on the TF was high enough, they'd only use secondary weapons, or something to that effect.

Why waste the Long Lances when the hoards of 25mm cannons will do the job for a fraction of the rearm cost?

No torpedoes launched. Who knows, it might be in the code...subs don't shoot torps after them, can't get a firing solution. Unfortunately, they don't attack on the surface either, but I never checked if the particular sub had a deck gun for it either.

[Lowpe]

Bombardment attacks at Guam, Moulmein, Chiang Mai.

Two Allied divisions at Chiang Mai now; Americal at Guam; Moulmein won't hold for long...

[Lowpe]

Downfall game. Below is the result of a 400+ B29 raid during the daylight (rain). What CAP there was didn't exist after Jugs and Mustangs swept them aside, but for the most part they were inferior fighters. By this time Japan really needs to field only Frank r; the latest George or Jack, or better.

Shindens and Karyu did better over Nagasaki for example.

America suffers 14 losses to flak, and 4 to ops for a total cost of 18 B29s.

Almost all bombers target the manpower...

Boy is it ugly in 45.[&:]

[mind_messing]

Shindens and Karyu did better over Nagasaki for example.

The Shinden has excelled.

The Karyu has been disappointing so far. With it's big service rating, I don't think it's had any more than 60% operation since the start of the scenario. That would be fine if I'd 200 of them, but when you've only one depleted squadron of 50, less so.

This scenario is proving informative as to the air war. All the "good" Japanese planes in the late war that you mention (Frank "r" George, Jack) all have pretty high service ratings (bar one of the George models with SR 2, IIRC?), so you can't depend solely on them for CAP.

The take-home message from my end is to make sure you've enough trained pilots. If I had a good stock of pilots for both services, the air war in our Downfall game would be much more even-handed.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

The take-home message from my end is to make sure you've enough trained pilots. If I had a good stock of pilots for both services, the air war in our Downfall game would be much more even-handed.

You are quite correct and even more if you had better planes, however I am stunned at how fast the experience goes up in the mustang and jugs units. Overall, this is a terribly depressing scenario.[:D]

It really is quite informative playing this...for one thing, try not to let the allies have any base with 20 hexes of the HI for free. Even the worst atoll can hold recon float planes which help, and the lesser ones that can be built up to at least level two can host a 75 plane sweeping squadron and enough left over for defending the base.

Another thing, I think having a bunch of TRACOM eligible night bombers might be worrisome to the Allies.

Alhough you haven't done it, I think if you can sneak some surface raiders south from the Kuriles to threaten supply ships, that would divert some attention. It would force the Allies to dedicate a few CVEs to raider protection at the very least.

Another thing you realize as the Allies, is the huge amount of forces and ships you have. Mind boggling, but for most ships larger than a CL, damage pretty much takes them out of the war.

We are starting to get where it will be exciting...turn is back at you m-m.[:)]

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

Shindens and Karyu did better over Nagasaki for example.

The Shinden has excelled.

The Karyu has been disappointing so far. With it's big service rating, I don't think it's had any more than 60% operation since the start of the scenario. That would be fine if I'd 200 of them, but when you've only one depleted squadron of 50, less so.

This scenario is proving informative as to the air war. All the "good" Japanese planes in the late war that you mention (Frank "r" George, Jack) all have pretty high service ratings (bar one of the George models with SR 2, IIRC?), so you can't depend solely on them for CAP.

The take-home message from my end is to make sure you've enough trained pilots. If I had a good stock of pilots for both services, the air war in our Downfall game would be much more even-handed.

I've been toying with downfall and when I put good leaders into the training groups they can churn out trained pilots pretty fast, in about 5-6 weeks for a fighter pilot that's really decent, 4 weeks for a marginal one. In this scenario it feel like you almost have to dedicate month one to defending only the most important bases while you train better pilots. Having Denkos and Randy Ic is a big bonus for the night war though. Those go to Tokyo and Osaka and let the other groups fill around them.

[Lowpe]

Dec 4, 1943

No night bombing.

Allies sweep and bomb Yap with 4Es, George and Zeroes rise to the challenge getting 9 of the 4e beasties, 18 Lightnings, for about a dozen of our boys. But the base is closed.

Allies attack at Moulmein and Chiang Mai, both hold for now, but forts are knocked down. Won't hold for much longer.

At Ulithi, I have managed to sneak the Oyoda and 3 destroyers in without being spotted. Tanaka will lead the three destroyers into Guam tonight (TF#8) while the Oyoda will take a slightly different course and stop one hex short (TF#1). Both groups will attempt then to get back to Ulithi, both have LRCAP, and so does Ulithi. Lots of shipping at Guam, perhaps we can have some long lance goodness or I would settle for collisions.

From Saipan, three MTBs are heading south into Tinian where a fleet of 10 AP are spotted.

Other than that quiet, moving troops, preparing, digging in.

In three days the Irving Sa starts production. This will be my early nightfighter till Frances comes along (hopefully April). I will have a goodly supply of the Sa, it adds radar in 6/44, but also adds another 20mm cannon which I hope means the plane doesn't run out of ammo so quickly.

[Lowpe]

Dec 5, 1943

MTBs strike at Tinian, but are rebuffed by a small CA task force, got to within 3K yards, but needed to be closer to launch torpedoes.

Here, the Oyoda strikes at American picket ships protecting the landings at Guam...