MMO Group of Wargamers who also play MMOs?

[Zakhal]

Sorry Zarhal, must be in total disagreement. AS a MMO who tried both GW and WOW, I gotta say WOW takes GW out to left field.

Its okay to disagree. 10 million people seems to disagree with me. [:D]

Wow and GW and both great successes allthough they are different games. GW sold over 5 million but its more like mmo-lite. The best thing about GW is that at best (nightfall) its story equals single player rpgs. Usually mmos have almost no story at all.

In rpg the story is most important thing to me unless the game is an action-rpg. For me the "social multiplayer aspect" is secondary even in a mmo.

[Zakhal]

ORIGINAL: panzers
As I was saying earlier in this thread, I don't want to be putting all my hard earned dollars in a bunch of onlime subscriptions to MMORPG that I may never play, but the feedback from warhammer does sound very intriguing. Never actually played the cardboard game, but is it anything at all like battletech?

If you are afraid of wasting your money on yet another mmo you can check the status of the game on beta leaks. Once you register to the forums you can see everything from latest patch notes, test results to betatester comments, pictures and video.

[Veldor]

Is Age of Conan worth buying and playing now?

I had been completely ignoring it since I'd heard a lot about it having lots of missing content and other issues... But realize that might not be entirely fair since people are still ignoring Vanguard for those same type of rumors... And assuming you have the necessary hardware its actually not a bad game.

Still though... MMO's really should all have free trials.... EQ2 does, WOW does, Vanguard soon will. Those kind of titles really have no excuse.

I buy lots of games but no one likes that feeling of buying a $60.00 title only to realize literally minutes into the game that its just not for you. Reading only does so much and can be a real time sink. I'd much rather spend my time playing a demo than reading around on forums or elsewhere what "other people" do or don't like about a game. But I don't always have that choice.

As anyone can see from this and other treads here, we all have different likes and dislikes. The only real way to know if a game is for you or not is to PLAY IT! [:D]

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Veldor

Is Age of Conan worth buying and playing now?

I think it is. Its actually on a 48hr Madness Sale over at gogamer.com so I picked it up!

http://www.gogamer.com/viewproduct.htm? ... d=21524443

First MMO with a Mature Rating and made specifically with Adults in Mind.. Great Graphics.. Massive all player battles with Seige Engines to capture enemy fortresses manned by other player armies...full single-player mode in which to learn the game. Decapitations and other gore. 10x More interactive combat system than any other MMO to date. Less fantasy oriented unique setting.. Massive World.. etc. Made by veteran MMO developers...

Only real negatives for me... Not a huge Conan fan and uncertain what I will do once Warhammer comes out..

1 person signed up for the AOC Wargaming Guild so far!

[panzers]

ORIGINAL: Veldor

Is Age of Conan worth buying and playing now?

I had been completely ignoring it since I'd heard a lot about it having lots of missing content and other issues... But realize that might not be entirely fair since people are still ignoring Vanguard for those same type of rumors... And assuming you have the necessary hardware its actually not a bad game.

Still though... MMO's really should all have free trials.... EQ2 does, WOW does, Vanguard soon will. Those kind of titles really have no excuse.

I buy lots of games but no one likes that feeling of buying a $60.00 title only to realize literally minutes into the game that its just not for you. Reading only does so much and can be a real time sink. I'd much rather spend my time playing a demo than reading around on forums or elsewhere what "other people" do or don't like about a game. But I don't always have that choice.

As anyone can see from this and other treads here, we all have different likes and dislikes. The only real way to know if a game is for you or not is to PLAY IT! [:D]

Is there one for warhammer online?

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: panzers
Is there one for warhammer online?

Given that the game isn't even release yet, or in open beta for that matter, it remains to be seen whether or not they will have a free trial. Based on the games this one is going up against though it would make sense that they would have a free trial since all the competition does.

But worse case they will only allow "buddy codes" like Age of Conan so you will have to know someone that bought the game and hasn't already given away their buddy code or codes.

Some MMO companies choose to do this at launch because the servers are already bogged down without having all the freeloaders to add to it.. After the first month things usually taper off a bit even for good MMOs (Like when first time MMO parents are asked by their kid for that 14.99 renewal fee ) and then they may do a free trial.

If your really interested I'd just apply for open beta or pre open beta. That can be at least a month free pre-launch. I hope I am selected for the pre-open-beta phase but no word back yet. <crossing fingers>

[Krasny]

My main gripe with MMOs is that I always end up playing solo.

And everyone else seems intent on playing solo as well, since it is a far more effective means of leveling that spending hours trying to get a group togther.

So massive multiplayer games, invariably turn into massive singleplayer games, with the odd PUG for an instance.

Which isn't why I'm paying my £10 a month for.

So I quit. I'm not a bloody rat in a cage, performing repetative tasks so an occasional treat rolls into my cage when I press the right buttons.

Why are MMOs (sic) designed to be playable solo?

Asheron's Call (3 Years)
Asheron's Call 2 (3 Months)
SWG (3 Months)
FFXI (1 Day)
WoW (6 Months)
DDO (1 Month)
LotRO (3 months)

[Ketza]

I run a MMO guild called Harm. We are currently playing Age of Conan and Requiem Bloodymare. AOC has major issues and if Funcom doesnt resolve them by the time Warhammer launches AOC will become another dead title.

www.harmguild.com

Aztek

[donkuchi19]

I have been looking into EVE online. It looks interesting. I did play SWG for a couple of months, but it was hard to hook up with other people and just became a single player game (as someone mentioned earlier).

I did play what I consider the grandfather of all of these games on AOL with Neverwinter Nights. Limited Maps, Limited Quests, Poor graphics, Repetitive tasks to build up experience, but Great Fun when you hooked up with a good group. All sorts of Clans formed and it was easy to find others and do things together. I actually joined one clan and then formed another one with a friend. Nothing like getting 4 people to a side who were maxed out CLAM's (Cleric Magic Users) with reinforcements in the next section and fighting it out in PVP or just going to the tavern and BSing all night.

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Krasny

My main gripe with MMOs is that I always end up playing solo.

And everyone else seems intent on playing solo as well, since it is a far more effective means of leveling that spending hours trying to get a group togther.

So massive multiplayer games, invariably turn into massive singleplayer games, with the odd PUG for an instance.

Which isn't why I'm paying my £10 a month for.

So I quit. I'm not a bloody rat in a cage, performing repetative tasks so an occasional treat rolls into my cage when I press the right buttons.

Why are MMOs (sic) designed to be playable solo?

Asheron's Call (3 Years)
Asheron's Call 2 (3 Months)
SWG (3 Months)
FFXI (1 Day)
WoW (6 Months)
DDO (1 Month)
LotRO (3 months)

You've mostly been playing the wrong MMO's it would seem. The key to a non-solo experience is to join the right guild, or any guild at all for starters. I'd personally recommend:

A Medium-Sized, Family-Oriented, Mostly-Non-RAIDing, Casual Guild comprised of at least 33% altoholics. That last part is key if you dont play as much or else anyone who does will quickly level past you. I've had absolutely wonderful experiences with guilds in Ultima Online, Everquest 2, and Vanguard. Okay experiences in the very early days of SWG.

When I say wonderful experiences I mean nearly never having to play solo if I didn't otherwise want to.

That's not to say I don't understand where your coming from. Especially depending upon your playing style.

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Ketza

I run a MMO guild called Harm. We are currently playing Age of Conan and Requiem Bloodymare. AOC has major issues and if Funcom doesnt resolve them by the time Warhammer launches AOC will become another dead title.

www.harmguild.com

Aztek

Can you elaborate on the "major issues with AOC"? I spent what feels like 80 hrs researching the current status and it pretty much seemed as if they've done an awesome job of addressesing any initial release concerns. Really didn't see much negativity but instead a lot of really positive comments on its unique aspects as an MMO.

The only real applicable negative I've heard was that certain portions of content later in the game are light. Its also typical to see the diehard race-to-the-endgame type addicts gripe of boredom since they sailed past everything that is in the earlier game. Nothing wrong with having to initially experience more of a game through an alternate character class. Besides with the PVP and RVR style content you further can't complain unless your 100% strickly PVE and then your really playing the wrong game anyway.

Is the issue ganking, farming, even zerging or is it something far more sinister like actual game crashes etc?

[Hertston]

I'm not aware of any MMORPG that didn't have 'major issues' on release, and 'issues' for some months afterwards - certainly none that I've played. Regardless, having sold a million copies in the first three weeks AoC isn't going to be a 'dead game' anytime soon.

I'd rate it OK, not much more than that. The graphics are average at best (LotRO looks better with everything maxed out IMHO) considered the PC you need to even run it, but maybe the DX10 release will fix that. I was very disappointed with the combat after the hype - when will somebody finally have the balls to swap the 'classic' button clicking style (albeit it with the odd tweak in this case) for Mount & Blade or Dark Messiah style combat?

[Krasny]

Veldore

I am aware that finding the right guild is essential. Indeed I spend far longer selecting a guild that choosing a game. However it always seems guildmates rarely wish to play together, just participate in asinine chat.

The main reason for this I suspect are the games themselves, which seem to be structured primarily for solo play, thus making it easier to level solo, than it is in a group.

The one game where this is not the case is (or was) DDO. DDO is (was) a group game, which I regard as an admirable trait, which is spoiled by the fact that DDO is not that much better than NWN, and idiots that insist on rushing quests.

I read that AOC is another WoW clone (like LotRO), until you get to the end game.

[Twotribes]

I Play DDO, Used to play EverQuest, for 7 years. Tried Anarchy Online, Camelot and VanGuard , did not like any of them for long.

[String]

I've been playing Eve Online for about two years now and I recommend it if you are into sandbox type gaming. You really have to set your own goals there as noone else will do it for you. You also have to look after yourself for the same reason. Anything goes if it is done by ingame means and is not exploiting/hacking. Meaning that if you get scammed by someone or killed then noone, aside from your ingame friends, is going to help you. A game for an enterprising individual who knows what he wants and has a plan.

As a bonus the subscription numbers rise slowly but steadily, the game takes place in a single game world, no separate servers, and all the expansions are free of charge.

On the negative side, the learning curve is best illustrated by this picture . Also when 2-300 players (per side!!) face off eachother in large scale fleet combat in 0.0 space the local starsystems can get rather laggy.


I've also been playing WW2OL for the past few months and it's excellent as well. As realistic as it can be without scaring off 99% of even the most hardcore fps/ww2 enthusiasts and fun as well. Learning curve is steep though and it can be really frustrating as often you die without even knowing what killed you.

Both games are team oriented, both games are best when you end up in a good group, both games have trial periods.

edit: Oh and both games have an above the average average player age, which doesn't mean that there aren't any smacktards and 13 year old idiots, but there are a lot less of them than in wow.

[panzers]

ORIGINAL: String

I've been playing Eve Online for about two years now and I recommend it if you are into sandbox type gaming. You really have to set your own goals there as noone else will do it for you. You also have to look after yourself for the same reason. Anything goes if it is done by ingame means and is not exploiting/hacking. Meaning that if you get scammed by someone or killed then noone, aside from your ingame friends, is going to help you. A game for an enterprising individual who knows what he wants and has a plan.

As a bonus the subscription numbers rise slowly but steadily, the game takes place in a single game world, no separate servers, and all the expansions are free of charge.

On the negative side, the learning curve is best illustrated by this picture . Also when 2-300 players (per side!!) face off eachother in large scale fleet combat in 0.0 space the local starsystems can get rather laggy.


I've also been playing WW2OL for the past few months and it's excellent as well. As realistic as it can be without scaring off 99% of even the most hardcore fps/ww2 enthusiasts and fun as well. Learning curve is steep though and it can be really frustrating as often you die without even knowing what killed you.

Both games are team oriented, both games are best when you end up in a good group, both games have trial periods.

edit: Oh and both games have an above the average average player age, which doesn't mean that there aren't any smacktards and 13 year old idiots, but there are a lot less of them than in wow.

Good one, String. Kind of explains why I'm a 66 mage with no guild!

[Ketza]

The main problem with AOC is it was released far too early. The game in its current form is very unfinished. We were one of the first guilds on Deathwhisper to get a Battlekeep and the second guild on the server to be "sieged". Nothing concerning sieges even remotely worked. Our walls had huge holes in them. Siege equipment was not working. It seemed like a crude version of a beta test. As a temporary fix they made it so you could not lose a siege as the defender.

The crafting system has been broken and inconsistent since launch.

The pvp system is not in place and the one they are about to introduce is not the one they promised when the game was released. Even on a pvp server in the next patch any type of pvp will result in a murder count (even 80 vrs 80) which if it gets high enough will make it impossible to talk with vendors and NPCS. Also if you are a murdered you can drop items and money on death but of you are not you do not drop anything. Very confusing and borked system. It will kill guiuld vrs guild and world pvp.

The game stability is plagued by memory leaks. In large battles you have to tone down your graphics and turn off the sound or your framrate dips to below 10 fps or you crash.

They had an issue where female characters did not swing as fast as male characters. Rather then speed females up they slowed males down.

The endgame raids are plagued with bugs and zone in issues. it may take your 4 or 5 tries zoning into a dungeon just to get your whole party into the same place.

All of these issues has led to a mass exodus from the game. We are all used to MMOs getting off to a rocky start but this one is a total disaster. Of the 30 members and 40 recruits we came to the game with 2 months ago less then 20% are still playing. Most of the early guilds have left or disbanded. Of the original 8 Battlekeep guilds (you can only have 8 keeps per server) only 3 are still playing with any sort of consistency.

Maybe in 6 months the game will be worth a shot but for now I could not look anyone in the eye and honestly tell them to pick the game up and try it.

[NefariousKoel]

I'll definitely give Warhammer Online a go when it comes out.

I've been at these things since UO in 98 and played almost every one since.&nbsp; After leaving Conan due to bugs & unfinished content, I've gone back to WoW as a time-waster since an old MMO guildie or two are still there.&nbsp; But I'm so sick of WoW.

From my experiences, Eve and Pirates of the Burning Sea are probably a couple of the more popular wargamer-loved MMOs since they have a slightly slower pace to combat.&nbsp; However they both get very repetitive, very quick... especially Eve.

Anyway, if those of you who are gonna be doing some Warhammer, let us know what server you get into.

[String]

ORIGINAL: NefariousKoel

From my experiences, Eve and Pirates of the Burning Sea are probably a couple of the more popular wargamer-loved MMOs since they have a slightly slower pace to combat. However they both get very repetitive, very quick... especially Eve.

I've found running missions and shooting npc's repetitive as well, but pvp never gets repetitive in Eve. Ever. Also there is so much to do, so much to explore, literally tens of professions to try out. Mission running, mining, T1 industry, T2 industry, science, Capital ship building, drug/booster production, large scale corporation or even alliance management, exploration, pirating, just your standard pvp, alliance warfare, factional warfare and market manipulation/games. I'm sure if i spent some time i could add some more to this list.

By the way, playing and predicting eve market is probably the closest thing to the real stuff. It really is a fully functioning economy.

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Krasny

Veldore

I am aware that finding the right guild is essential. Indeed I spend far longer selecting a guild that choosing a game. However it always seems guildmates rarely wish to play together, just participate in asinine chat.

The main reason for this I suspect are the games themselves, which seem to be structured primarily for solo play, thus making it easier to level solo, than it is in a group.

The one game where this is not the case is (or was) DDO. DDO is (was) a group game, which I regard as an admirable trait, which is spoiled by the fact that DDO is not that much better than NWN, and idiots that insist on rushing quests.

I read that AOC is another WoW clone (like LotRO), until you get to the end game.

Well the only thing I can say is you've at least missed two of the most group oriented MMO games out there entirely. Id say the most recent success there was EQ2. It was SO group oriented at first that they lost the solo crowd altogether and had to do a rapid patch to litter the landscape with solo mobs just to quick-fix it. You see you can't really make a fully successful MMO targeting only groups because the average player is not actually that hardcore raiding might-not-have-a-real-life player that so often everyone thinks every MMO player is. They are casual players. And casual players, even if they often play for long periods, still need just as many times where they get in and get out.. So you have to solo for those times.

But why EQ2 is such a great group game goes to its design. You have to have a reason to group and there are tons. Not just the RAIDing content (which covers all levels) but even Guilds have levels (Just like players). Even in our non-RAIDING guild we grouped in order to level up the guild... to which we all get various benefits. By grouping for that purpose you make acquantances and friends to make it more natural to group later for other purposes. The whole thing really worked well and, at least in that game, there would be zero excuse for anyone to make any complaints about it. Obviously it also helps if the game is very popular and populated, which EQ2 also was/is.

Remember too that DDO and Guild Wars are not MMO's but Hybrid Games. Really to be a real MMO you have to have more than just a persistant game world. You need things like at least one large walkable/flyable main landscape, a guilding system, and most importantly a player driven economy WITH a crafting system. There are a few others but many fail on one of the previous things.... So they are just really hybrids between an MMO and any other online game.