Dispatches from OKH: Q-Ball (Axis) v. Von Beeanie (SOV)

[2ndACR]

Yep, Sir Robin will deny you the pockets. Find a defense line and that is where you dig in deep. Use armor to build a buffer zone and then pull them back.

If he would have stayed and fought, you would not be as far as you are now, well, you would be but would also be slamming into units everywhere slowing you down.

[PeeDeeAitch]

Of course, if you do catch him in time, his units will not be that experienced - you could catch up with the infantry, HQ buildup the armor for that turn, then try to see what happens. If he runs til mud, then you will just have to pick a good spot.

[Swenslim]

How did you make your units to move for such long distances in one turn ? I just begun to play this game and started Road to Kiev scenario. In my game even during firts turn panzers  must push thru numerous soviet divisions and then have barely enough move points to reach Ternopl, but not to push towards Chernovtsy.

[2ndACR]

Use the infantry to open those holes for you, not your panzers. Look in the war forum and check for the 1st move threads.

[Altaris]

I did some testing this week regarding Leningrad. It is possible to isolate Leningrad by attacking the Light Woods hex just east of Pavlovo, then taking the port hex NW of that. Once this hex is taken (assuming the Finns have taken the other Lake Lagoda port on the west side of the lake), you'll cut off Leningrad from supply.
 
This isn't particularly an easy feat, since it's quite easy to get that river side hex up to lvl 4 forts before the Germans can arrive, but since you're hitting in before Turn 10 and coming up this route, I think it's probably you're best shot, especially if he doesn't man it with a full 3 divisions. I think you need at least 2-3 corps of infantry that you can cycle on the river attacks to ensure breaking through, and it will probably take a few weeks. But once you're over the river, cutting the port should be pretty simple.
 
Considering it's really you're only viable approach (taking the 3 eastern Lagoda ports is pretty difficult on your approach vector), I'd say go for it. Just make sure to load up your attackers with lots of arty and pioneers.

[Q-Ball]

2ndACR, MYNOK: Good comments from AE brothers, I may halt a bit early to build. At this point, with space on my side, I can probably trade a bit in the Winter. At this point, I don't see attacking in the snow, but you never know.....

ALTARIS: That hex is a B****H. There is a big fort already. Notice I moved a pile of units to try a Delib attack next week, including the SS div; hope that's enough. If not, we'll have to assault Leningrad directly

SVENSLIM: Check out the thread we did on AGS first moves. You have to borrow a Panzer Corps from Pz Gp 2, AND plan your move very carefully. Use 17th Army to smash the border defenses west of Rovno, and send 6th Army through the gap. The hardest part is running into those Mech Corps north of Tarnopol; they are big tank units, but your Panzers can handle them. The other trick: Make sure you cover the Tarnopol area, as there are units around there that can cut the pocket, and as you are driving to the Romanian Border, make sure your Panzers open a wide corridor, by taking different routes. Provided you divert some Pz Gp 2 units, you can create, and hold, that Lvov pocket every time. It's worth it, because there are a pile of units in there.


Turn 9/10: August 21, 1941:

I am skipping ahead a turn, since I didn't have time to finish an AAR entry for the last turn. But I think Von Beanie's defense is hardening.

The "Comrade Robinsky" defense is over. I am now facing pretty good checkerboard defense, with decent units in 2-3 forts. Von Beanie was delaying, until I reached these fortified defense lines. Clearly, he is starting to stand his ground.

With the exception of Pz Gp 4, my Panzers at the start of turn 9 all had between 10-16 MPs. Ouch! Clearly, I had outrun my supply lines. That turn, I halted the tanks, allowing them to rest and accumulate fuel, and allow the infantry to catch up.

Turn 10 is the first turn I have had some infantry support; even this turn, a few divisions were catching up, but at least a handful began the turn on the front line (AGN excepted; we have been in trench warfare there for a couple turns). As a result, we finally started to pocket a few units this turn.

The last 4 turns before 10 featured mostly marching, and little pocketing of Soviets. I hope that changes, because to date we have only caused 1.6 mil Red casualties, which is not enough.

So, Von Beanie is now fighting, so I think his strategy was to fall back to a stronger defense line. Might be smart since his losses have been light and my tank losses have been heavy.

Army Group North, Turn 10:

The map should show all the progress; I am sending more infantry reinforcements to this sector. We are making slow progress, this turn we have 4 units isolated, so that certainly helps.

Any suggestions here, gentlemen, are welcome.

[Q-Ball]

Turn 10, 8/21/41, Army Group Center:

Here is the advance on Moscow. I don't think I have the strength to take it, but we will keep going to create space, eat Red Army units, and force him to send reserves. Good checkerboard defense, though. Von Beanie seems to be stacking units, which I wouldn't do, but other than that the principal is sound.

[Q-Ball]

Turn 10, 8/21/41, Army Group South:

Still moving into the Ukraine. Here, we are running into fortified lines, but we are choosing to maneuver rather than smash at this point. We might make more progress next turn, when all my infantry will be close to the front. My landsers have been walking a LONG time.....

[PeeDeeAitch]

South/Central - Have your tanks end a turn close to their HQs, only do limited attacks the next turn when the infantry approaches/attacks and HQ buildup to spring a massive 45-50mp assault.  It will burn trucks, but it could be worth it...
 
North - you are doing quite well here - keep pushing. A powerful assault (with pionere for the infantry) toward the Volkhov might spring open some lanes for the panzers and help cut off Leningrad more...if not, it will force him to move backup there.
 
As has been seen, 1941 is the year to smash bash and smash some more - taking land is a good thing, hurting the Soviets is too.  Even if all you do is force him back more, you will earn yourself space to fall back during the winter (assuming he doesn't turtle...)

[PeeDeeAitch]

Not to take anything away from you, and by far you have the most audacious advances of any AAR I have read, but do you think that the "good" opening moves we all talked about helped set up the advances?  It seems your opponant quickly abandoned his ideas of defense to flee as you pressed him mightily in the first couple of turns.  I think your implementation of the attacks helped immensely, and seems to me a sign that at least some of the spirit of the Summer-Fall advances can be learned, even if the German side does seem tougher.

[2ndACR]

The key will come to see if you can hold that during the blizzard. And we know what is going to happen to your army once the recovery period begins. Pray the patch gets here before your winter.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: PeeDeeAitch

Not to take anything away from you, and by far you have the most audacious advances of any AAR I have read, but do you think that the "good" opening moves we all talked about helped set up the advances?  It seems your opponant quickly abandoned his ideas of defense to flee as you pressed him mightily in the first couple of turns. 

I think the opening moves were key, particularly in the South. IMO, everyone should be using Pz Gp 2 troops to take out all the units in the South. I didn't count the surrounded divisions, but it must be nearly 40. That's a huge first-step.

In the North/Center, he ran because with that opening, there is virtually nothing to stop the Germans with until turn 3.

[Klydon]

Some observations I see.

Leningrad area: great job to get the city cut off where he can't get reenforcements in and also to get those guys in the rough out of supply. That area helps protect the front door to Leningrad, so well done there. Kicking the two stacks out just south of the Neva will set you up for the big river crossing attack that will usually spell the end for Leningrad. The issue is you will need some room to manuver and that means kicking the other Russians back across the Volkhov. Novgorod has to be on the short list to take as well. I would not worry about pushing past the Volkhov because once the Finns are in, that whole area will be outflanked and screwed from the north unless he commits even more troops to the Svir river to try to hold the Finns back.

Center and south: I agree with PeeDee. Look for the opportunity to gas up the panzers. Still plenty of campaign time and some big encirclements to be had at certain points. I would also not really push the Crimea hard with your German 11th army units since you are not sending much to AGS at the moment for reenforcements unless you can at least get into the top part of it. If he has stacks of units guarding the entrances in big forts, I would just screen it and bypass. You are better off making sure you get to Stalino if not Rostov if you can, but that will likely be the limit you have for logistics purposes. Obviously grabbing Kharkov is big too.

One note on his checkerboards. Watch for what units he is using. Any chance to isolate cav, paratrooper and tank/motorized units should be taken. Paratroopers become Guards later and cav are nasty during mud and winter because of their movement, so the fewer of them he has to use, the better for you. Tank/motorized is pretty much something that most don't checkerboard with, but you never know.

[Q-Ball]

OKH SitRep: Turn 11, August 28, 1941:

We finally liquidated some Soviets this turn, after a couple dry turns; 16 divisions surrendered in various small pockets, the largest being a 5-division pocket near Poltava. The most important, though, were the 3 units near Leningrad; any units I can take from the Leningrad garrison is key!

I am short on time before tonight, so I can't finish a turn, but I will post a BEFORE shot showing some life in the Red Army! Von Beanie is oozing accross my thin lines. I have plenty of MPs to keep from getting isolated, the question is do I fall back, reinforce, etc. The fact that he is coming out of his trenches into the open can present an opportunity to really whack some units, like a couple Cav units hanging out in the breeze....

[Q-Ball]

Leningrad! Turn 11, 8/28/41:

I said I was short of time, but over lunch I just had to at least see about Leningrad. And we made MAJOR progress this turn!

Using a big stack of units, we forced our way accross the Neva. Our Tanks had just enough MPs to exploit the breakthrough, and march across. We got lucky on the combat a bit, even with a couple units routing out of the Leningrad sector. (which at this point we want).

I said that Leningrad is impossible to take against a competent opponent. Von Beanie is competent, so I am about to eat my words. That's OK, they are tasting extremely delicious in this case......

It isn't over yet, but if we take Ostinovets next turn, it will be. I air-dropped everything I could on that hex just to be sure; something like 400 tons! That will allow us to free the Finns, who can hold the Volkhov line over the winter by themselves. That, in turn, will free up about 10 badly needed divisions for elsewhere on the front.

Happy times!

[Mynok]

Impressive work at Leningrad. Is there a port in the hex NW of your panzers?

Also, you might be better off using regiments in a solid line when you need to screen him.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: Mynok


Impressive work at Leningrad. Is there a port in the hex NW of your panzers?

Also, you might be better off using regiments in a solid line when you need to screen him.

Yes, that's the port hex for Leningrad. The way I understand the supply rules, capture Ostinovets, and Leningrad is isolated, regardless of the coverage elsewhere on Lake Ladoga.

At the moment, there are two units there with a Defense CV of 10. The most he could probably get on the hex is a CV of 20-25. If so, I should be able to take it with a Deliberate attack. That is assuming he rotates out the Brigade currently there, and sends in a couple tank and Rifle units that he has.

[Encircled]

Very impressive German advance

Its the key to the success in '42 if you can really pile across as far as you can

Leningrad looks doomed, which is absolutely fantastic

The more territory you can grab now, the more you can afford to give up in the blizzard, and the less combat you have to face in the blizzard, the better

[Flaviusx]

Leningrad is yours. Just a matter of time.

What was the fort level in the hex you took? That back door to Leningrad needs some time to build up, and you may have simply preempted him from getting the forts up.

Edit: looking back at some of the screens, it appears the Soviet never dug in there. Rookie mistake. You have to lock down that back door to Leningrad. Not just that hex, but several others nearby. Need to get diggers in there early on.

[Q-Ball]

That hex had Lvl 2 forts. It was well-defended, with 1 tank and 2 Rifle Divs. It took 5 divisions on Deliberate attack with piles of Pioneer, Artillery, Planes, SS, kitchen sinks, etc to clear it. The tanks were just exploitation units.

I don't think it's because Von Beanie was unaware of the need to dig-in around Leningrad. The other hexes were Lvl 3-4, but I flanked a number of those. Overall though I think I just got up there too quick to get that hex up to Lvl 3 in time. The rough hexes I isolated each were Lvl 4, which is why they were isolated.

But he is well-aware of the bonus you get digging in around cities, because the Moscow area is starting to become very fortified. I doubt I'll get much closer to Moscow.