The Japanese from a newbie’s perspective

[Hartmann]

ORIGINAL: Mercutio

I get them to at least 2 in amphib research.
Thailand will join you as will Indochina. Invading them is like Germany invading Hungary, Bulgaria and Romania

Ok, I'll try to go for level 2 amphib research next game then and see whether that's sufficient.

Yup, Thailand joined me the very turn after I had posted the question. If I had known, I probably would have transported those troops (i.e. those I had on regular transports) not to Hanoi, but rather to Saigon to go to Burma from Bangkog ("three pagodas pass") instead of coming from the North (via "Burma road"). Indochina "joined" earlier by an event where I had to invest 25 MPP to occupy them.

Damn, there's *already* American subs showing up everywhere and my torpedo boats need two more turns to arrive! Also, the Philippines desaster is having consequences as they got a strategic bomber there blowing up my oilfields. I somehow have to whip up resources for staging another invasion of the Philippines soon.

[wevilc]

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

ORIGINAL: Mercutio

I get them to at least 2 in amphib research.
Thailand will join you as will Indochina. Invading them is like Germany invading Hungary, Bulgaria and Romania

Ok, I'll try to go for level 2 amphib research next game then and see whether that's sufficient.

Yup, Thailand joined me the very turn after I had posted the question. If I had known, I probably would have transported those troops (i.e. those I had on regular transports) not to Hanoi, but rather to Saigon to go to Burma from Bangkog ("three pagodas pass") instead of coming from the North (via "Burma road"). Indochina "joined" earlier by an event where I had to invest 25 MPP to occupy them.

Damn, there's *already* American subs showing up everywhere and my torpedo boats need two more turns to arrive! Also, the Philippines desaster is having consequences as they got a strategic bomber there blowing up my oilfields. I somehow have to whip up resources for staging another invasion of the Philippines soon.

Yeah, those American subs show up fast. I am not a fan of MTBs due to their short range. A destroyer can travel 16 hexes along your convoy route and hoover up any subs it finds. Like I said, I operate 3 destroyers and improve their ASW to at least 2. In fact, I am now hitting 4 in my current game. It’s worth it though to keep the convoy routes open. I am getting 200 per turn from territories connected by convoys which is well worth having. The cruisers and carriers help out too of course.

And as Mercutio said, no need to invade Indo China or Siam (Thailand) as you get them anyway. You can then operate or transport a force to Saigon to attack Malaya, just as really happened in WW2. I use an army, two SNLFs, the parachute unit and an HQ for that. That’s 5 amphibious craft. Stick the HQ in Kota Bharu and then knock out Penang and Singapore. The AI defends Malaya weakly. I wonder what a human player might do.

[Hartmann]

I just found out that I can't move my troops from Hanoi over the mountains to Kunming - so my aging eyes failed me and that line seems not to be a road. Argh - which means I need to operate them to Saigon area now (I really wish I had put them on long range amphibs earlier). At least I can try to get them to Malaya then (HQ, 2SLF and army).

I had played lots of carrier/naval Pacific games in years past (Carrier Strike, Carriers at War, Uncommon Valor), but never had paid attention to what exactly happened on land there. Thus, though I knew about Japan taking over Indochina, I didn't know what exactly was the case with Thailand in WW2.

Also: I got 100 MPP left - at this point, would it be still worth it to try and bring amphib research up to 2 (probably not, huh)?

[Mercutio]

ORIGINAL: wevilc

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

ORIGINAL: Mercutio

I get them to at least 2 in amphib research.
Thailand will join you as will Indochina. Invading them is like Germany invading Hungary, Bulgaria and Romania

Ok, I'll try to go for level 2 amphib research next game then and see whether that's sufficient.

Yup, Thailand joined me the very turn after I had posted the question. If I had known, I probably would have transported those troops (i.e. those I had on regular transports) not to Hanoi, but rather to Saigon to go to Burma from Bangkog ("three pagodas pass") instead of coming from the North (via "Burma road"). Indochina "joined" earlier by an event where I had to invest 25 MPP to occupy them.

Damn, there's *already* American subs showing up everywhere and my torpedo boats need two more turns to arrive! Also, the Philippines desaster is having consequences as they got a strategic bomber there blowing up my oilfields. I somehow have to whip up resources for staging another invasion of the Philippines soon.

Yeah, those American subs show up fast. I am not a fan of MTBs due to their short range. A destroyer can travel 16 hexes along your convoy route and hoover up any subs it finds. Like I said, I operate 3 destroyers and improve their ASW to at least 2. In fact, I am now hitting 4 in my current game. It’s worth it though to keep the convoy routes open. I am getting 200 per turn from territories connected by convoys which is well worth having. The cruisers and carriers help out too of course.

And as Mercutio said, no need to invade Indo China or Siam (Thailand) as you get them anyway. You can then operate or transport a force to Saigon to attack Malaya, just as really happened in WW2. I use an army, two SNLFs, the parachute unit and an HQ for that. That’s 5 amphibious craft. Stick the HQ in Kota Bharu and then knock out Penang and Singapore. The AI defends Malaya weakly. I wonder what a human player might do.

1 HQ would change everything IMO

[wevilc]

ORIGINAL: Hartmann

I just found out that I can't move my troops from Hanoi over the mountains to Kunming - so my aging eyes failed me and that line seems not to be a road. Argh - which means I need to operate them to Saigon area now (I really wish I had put them on long range amphibs earlier). At least I can try to get them to Malaya then (HQ, 2SLF and army).

I had played lots of carrier/naval Pacific games in years past (Carrier Strike, Carriers at War, Uncommon Valor), but never had paid attention to what exactly happened on land there. Thus, though I knew about Japan taking over Indochina, I didn't know what exactly was the case with Thailand in WW2.

Also: I got 100 MPP left - at this point, would it be still worth it to try and bring amphib research up to 2 (probably not, huh)?

Actually, what the heck is that line? [&:]

[wevilc]

ORIGINAL: Mercutio

ORIGINAL: wevilc

ORIGINAL: Hartmann




Ok, I'll try to go for level 2 amphib research next game then and see whether that's sufficient.

Yup, Thailand joined me the very turn after I had posted the question. If I had known, I probably would have transported those troops (i.e. those I had on regular transports) not to Hanoi, but rather to Saigon to go to Burma from Bangkog ("three pagodas pass") instead of coming from the North (via "Burma road"). Indochina "joined" earlier by an event where I had to invest 25 MPP to occupy them.

Damn, there's *already* American subs showing up everywhere and my torpedo boats need two more turns to arrive! Also, the Philippines desaster is having consequences as they got a strategic bomber there blowing up my oilfields. I somehow have to whip up resources for staging another invasion of the Philippines soon.

Yeah, those American subs show up fast. I am not a fan of MTBs due to their short range. A destroyer can travel 16 hexes along your convoy route and hoover up any subs it finds. Like I said, I operate 3 destroyers and improve their ASW to at least 2. In fact, I am now hitting 4 in my current game. It’s worth it though to keep the convoy routes open. I am getting 200 per turn from territories connected by convoys which is well worth having. The cruisers and carriers help out too of course.

And as Mercutio said, no need to invade Indo China or Siam (Thailand) as you get them anyway. You can then operate or transport a force to Saigon to attack Malaya, just as really happened in WW2. I use an army, two SNLFs, the parachute unit and an HQ for that. That’s 5 amphibious craft. Stick the HQ in Kota Bharu and then knock out Penang and Singapore. The AI defends Malaya weakly. I wonder what a human player might do.

1 HQ would change everything IMO

Can you explain how, Mercutio? Where would you put it that was out of harm’s way?

[Mercutio]

Hedgehog? Not sure, I haven't tried it. It would be an expensive mistake if it doesn't work![:D]

[amandkm]

I've had good results from a diplo offensive on the DEI. Getting them to join axis not only frees up my units slated to invade, it adds the Dutch as auxiliaries, and prevents the loss of MPP due to embargo and later sabotage.

Costs a fair bit, and takes time, but the payoff is immense.

[Mercutio]

Interesting strategy! Thanks for sharing

[Hartmann]

ORIGINAL: amandkm

I've had good results from a diplo offensive on the DEI. Getting them to join axis not only frees up my units slated to invade, it adds the Dutch as auxiliaries, and prevents the loss of MPP due to embargo and later sabotage.

Costs a fair bit, and takes time, but the payoff is immense.

How many chits did you put into it and how long did it take for them to join?

[amandkm]

I toss them all in. Usually takes until late '40- early '41. Still, considering the return (Forces as well as economic, to say nothing of freeing up my own forces) I find it to be worthwhile if I don't feel like working on Yugoslavia (which is my alternate favorite target for diplomacy)

[Hartmann]

ORIGINAL: amandkm

I toss them all in. Usually takes until late '40- early '41. Still, considering the return (Forces as well as economic, to say nothing of freeing up my own forces) I find it to be worthwhile if I don't feel like working on Yugoslavia (which is my alternate favorite target for diplomacy)

I see. As I only play Japan (leaving the other Axis powers AI controlled in all respects) I could only allow myself to use the three Japanese chits (and this would probably take too long then).

[amandkm]

You could start a game as them all, place the chits, then save it. When you restart I think you could change who you choose to play as.

So, start as Germany and Japan, place chits, then save and restart, playing as Japan only. Not *sure* it will work, but it may.

I may try myself, just to see.

[Hartmann]

ORIGINAL: amandkm

You could start a game as them all, place the chits, then save it. When you restart I think you could change who you choose to play as.

So, start as Germany and Japan, place chits, then save and restart, playing as Japan only. Not *sure* it will work, but it may.

I may try myself, just to see.

Even if your buddies are computer controlled, you CAN move their units and do their research, production and diplomacy manually. What I meant was: In my game I set myself the house rule to leave the AI buddies to themselves. The only exception for me (in my WIE games) would be combined fronts, like in Africa.

+++++++++

On another note: I was just about to buy a maritime bomber when I noticed that tac an medium bombers have sub attack 2 right off the bat. That is actually enough to do quite some damage. Naval upgrade 2 (which I already got) bumps sub attack to 4. So if these planes have enough reach, they can be very effectively used for sub hunting in home waters even from China (I'm just doing that). Thus I decided to not buy a maritime bomber and rather invest the sum into long range aircraft research.

The only reason to do ASW research for ships as the Japanese is when you really plan to make forays very far away from home(as the sub attack of unupgraded destroyers sucks ass).

[wevilc]

Hartman

I have been getting on fine with destroyers, obviously with ASW researched a bit. The test must be whether you consistently get MPPs via convoy and, apart from the occasional hiccup, I find that I do. My 3 destroyers have so far sunk 5-6 subs (it’s mid-1945). Not that many but then their presence has probably had something to do with that.

On yet another note, I just took Mongolia from the north after chasing the Soviets round to Irkutsk. It’s very easy. Just drive a tank to Ulan Batoor and kill whatever is there (a corps I think - seems to be the whole Mongolian army). Don’t know yet how many MPPs will be flooding my coffers. None probably. But you get a supply source which might be handy.

Does anyone ever think the game is a bit distorted by the use of the Mercator projection? India is tiny, Russia is absolutely huuuuge! It takes ages just to scroll across its vast emptiness. Not sure what could be done about it.

[Hartmann]

Yeah, Mercator projection is a double edged sword. It's somewhat benefitting the European theater scalewise, but then again there's so many hexes wasted way up North it's not even funny.

[wevilc]

MPPs yielded by Mongolia .... none.

[Hartmann]

ORIGINAL: wevilc

MPPs yielded by Mongolia .... none.

Good to know. I took Hawaii - took me like 6 months, though. US navy never showed up to intervene, instead Eisenhower transported to Lae, seemingly alone and with no escorts.

[Hartmann]

When Japan conquers DIE, Philippines and all those islands - how do you guys propose to garrison all that? Would you leave special forces on towns that generate MPP, or would you produce garrisons and ship them over there to free up the special forces, or would it even be advisable to leave the whole shebang unguarded except for navy patrols? All those units would come in handy elsewhere ...

Also: Is it even worth it to spend amphib MPPS to take islands like Wake, Midway, Nauru etc which are either only secondary supply centers or at best have some slight national morale effect?

[Hartmann]

Nobody got any suggestions regarding the questions of my last post?

I think I will do the following: I will garrison all starting points of convois. Brunei, Kuching and Batavia with special forces, also all three MPP generating cities in the Philipines (plus I will leave the HQ there). Singapore will also receive special forces treatment. I will leave 2 special forces and a HQ on Oahu and another special force at the other Hawaiian island (with Hilo). I will also leave some fleet there because the US already tried to retake the island with 4 LR amphibs. At Bangkok, I will leave a normal garrison because mainland. Not sure what to do with Japan itself and near islands like Taiwan - I rather think they will not try to land there before they didn't get other stuff back, but maybe I'll buy a lot of normal garrisons.

I'm not sure what to do about the "worthless" islands. I didn't take any of those from the US, and the ones they take from me by sneaking transports in - like Peleliu last turn - I think are not worth taking back because they don't generate MPP. Or would there be a reason to reinvade?

Finally I'm not sure what to do with mainland South-East Asia. I got a HQ and some units at Hanoi because it seemed that English-Indian units approach from the North, but now it seems they got as stuck as I did when I tried to go to Kunming from there. Same seems to be true about the whole mountain range separating Indochina and Thailand from Burma - I garrisoned the northernmost towns, but it seems the enemy doesn't invade from there. So I guess the only way for me to invade Burma would be via Moulmein->Rangoon? I could use the HQ and most of the troops I took Singapore with to do that.