Chapter 8 Roadwarrior (GHC) vs Q-Ball (SHC) Turn 25

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: jubjub

ORIGINAL: AlbertN

The persistently retreating Soviets is something that mindboggles me in my games.
It simply denies pockets and anything in general besides netting some terrain.
VPs need to be more granular across the map - or the system to me does not really work to stop Soviets from retreating consistently and persistently til they're fat enough to build up a wall. Ontop of their incessant CPP build-up.

Soviets that don't fight until winter are going to gift all of the bonus VP's to the Axis player and let them get a decent logistics network in place before the winter. Unless they have a spectacular winter offensive, the Axis player should be set up for a really high HWM in '42.

It is a dance if you will. Give up too much land it will come back to haunt you. Give up too little land you get surrounded. You have to know the balance & your opponent. Not knowing either one of those two will come back to haunt you.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: AlbertN

The persistently retreating Soviets is something that mindboggles me in my games.
It simply denies pockets and anything in general besides netting some terrain.
VPs need to be more granular across the map - or the system to me does not really work to stop Soviets from retreating consistently and persistently til they're fat enough to build up a wall. Ontop of their incessant CPP build-up.

Stop breaking the line and I'll stop retreating :[:D]

[RoadWarrior]

AGN takes a few more hexes and keeps digging the winter lines.

[RoadWarrior]

Looks like Q-Ball will be able to get all or most of his troops out.

[RoadWarrior]

3rd PG brakes into the Crimea.

[RoadWarrior]

OOB

[RoadWarrior]

Ground Losses

[RoadWarrior]

Air Losses

[RoadWarrior]

Leningrad is captured.

[RoadWarrior]

Nothing happening in the center or the south really at this point.

[RoadWarrior]

VP

[RoadWarrior]

OOB

[RoadWarrior]

Ground Losses

[RoadWarrior]

For the summer AGN has captured everything I had hoped for and has been digging in for several months, rail repair and supplies is stock piled with depots every 4-6 hexes along the front lines
to keep truck use to a min. AGN is now 9th, 16th and 18th armies with several Panzer Corp in reserve.

AGC did as planned, which was not much to be frank. It is still prepping for winter, supply lines about 2/3 done and reserves are in place or on the way.

As can be seen 4th PG is on the way to AGC and AGS. 1 Infantry Corp is being railed to the Crimea to mop up that area when the ground is solid.

[RoadWarrior]

AGS did not do everything I had hoped for, Stalino is still in enemy hands.

Most of 1,2 and 3 PGs will be in this area in reserve. Supplies are still not getting to the front depots dispite a good rail net in the area.
AGN and AGC are on normal supply and get more supplies than AGS set on 3 or 4. It is like distance from Germany is more important than the rail net ext.

[loki100]

ORIGINAL: RoadWarrior

...
AGN and AGC are on normal supply and get more supplies than AGS set on 3 or 4. It is like distance from Germany is more important than the rail net ext.

..

yes, that is indeed the key part of the WiTE2 logistics model compares to WiTE1 where raulhead location was all important [;)]

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: loki100

ORIGINAL: RoadWarrior

...
AGN and AGC are on normal supply and get more supplies than AGS set on 3 or 4. It is like distance from Germany is more important than the rail net ext.

..

yes, that is indeed the key part of the WiTE2 logistics model compares to WiTE1 where raulhead location was all important [;)]

Yup, that supply problem is in effect until end of March 42.

[RoadWarrior]

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain

ORIGINAL: loki100

ORIGINAL: RoadWarrior

...
AGN and AGC are on normal supply and get more supplies than AGS set on 3 or 4. It is like distance from Germany is more important than the rail net ext.

..

yes, that is indeed the key part of the WiTE2 logistics model compares to WiTE1 where raulhead location was all important [;)]

Yup, that supply problem is in effect until end of March 42.

That's good to know NOW!

Yes next game going harder in center probably as SU can't run 3-4 hexes per turn and supplies are never low after turn 4-6.
So could kill allot more and make a real push on Moscow. Do about the same until turn 4 than shift units to center as fuel in center is back to 90% by turn 7.

Basiclly no fuel in south even sitting on top of a RH 2 hexes past Dnep. Sitting in the city a unit will fill up to 150% in a few turns crazy what a difference 20 miles makes with this logistics system.

Game seems to easy for SU to avoid losses by simply running 2-3 hexes even in center going to be next to impossible to come close to historical KIA levels with a system that's based on retreating and not fighting forward as per historical.

As more AAR's are posted the running tactics will get better and better. Attacking is a fixed rule based on logistics so not much can be done to improve. Seems way to pro Russian to me and looking forward will be almost all game over by 44.

Just my 10 cents

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: RoadWarrior

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain

ORIGINAL: loki100






yes, that is indeed the key part of the WiTE2 logistics model compares to WiTE1 where raulhead location was all important [;)]

Yup, that supply problem is in effect until end of March 42.

That's good to know NOW!

Yes next game going harder in center probably as SU can't run 3-4 hexes per turn and supplies are never low after turn 4-6.
So could kill allot more and make a real push on Moscow. Do about the same until turn 4 than shift units to center as fuel in center is back to 90% by turn 7.

Basiclly no fuel in south even sitting on top of a RH 2 hexes past Dnep. Sitting in the city a unit will fill up to 150% in a few turns crazy what a difference 20 miles makes with this logistics system.

Game seems to easy for SU to avoid losses by simply running 2-3 hexes even in center going to be next to impossible to come close to historical KIA levels with a system that's based on retreating and not fighting forward as per historical.

As more AAR's are posted the running tactics will get better and better. Attacking is a fixed rule based on logistics so not much can be done to improve. Seems way to pro Russian to me and looking forward will be almost all game over by 44.

Just my 10 cents

I forecast excellent results in your next game pushing Center as priority!

[Q-Ball]

I'm told I can post here...I think the analysis on AGC and supplies is spot-on, and I also think based on this I would run a Soviet Campaign differently next time.

In this one, I way under-committed in AGN sector, and over-committed in AGS. I did withdraw a handful of hexes, but I also ended up with alot of forces, and stopped withdrawls in front of Kharkov and Stalino. By then, I had alot of reserves

A counter to an AGC focus and the supply constraints is to not defend AGS hardly at all, and just send everyone to the center; I am facing that in another game, where it's down to just screening forces basically in AGS. I'll be able to take Rostov and all the other cities, but supply will be a huge problem! Stalingrad is out of reach even if it's not defended, just no gas to get there.

"Just Run" is not a strategy. My #1 objective was to preserve the Red Army, and that means preventing encirclements was the #1 objective. Preventing encirclements can mean not allowing the infantry to plow holes for the Panzers to exploit.