Unit Depictions on Screen

[Froonp]

I have adjusted the positioning of almost all of them. Here are the USA fighters with a few flying boats.

I just thought of something.
How will you depict Subhunters ?
Subhunters are those planes that you can built if playing with CoiF. They are a version of a normal plane, more suited to ASW combat.
In paper WiF FE, they are depicted with their Air to Sea factor in a Pink or Red circle.
But, as you already put the Air to Sea factor of the Seaplanes and Flying Boats into a blue circle, how will you depict Subhunters ???

I have a suggestion :

Have the Seaplanes and Flying Boats Air to Sea factor back to normal, and have their Range Circle be Blue.

That way, you will be able to depict the Subhunters the same way they are in paper WiF FE, that is with their usual pink / red circled Air to Sea factor.

Edit : Hey, after all, this is logical to have the Range Circle be blue, as it is the way they move that makes Flying Boats & Seaplanes what they are : seaworthy.
They move in the water, thanks to their hull or their floats [:D]

[Froonp]

Some of these planes are lend lease.

There is also one in Post #452.
That pretty Spitfire IX.
[:D]

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

The color for the Netherlands air units is off. It should (and will) match the land unit background colors perfectly.

Didn't you say previously that you had the ART units square transformed into a circle ?

I have set up for doing them, but I guess the actual coding got lost in the shuffle. Since it's not too hard to do, I'll put it in my next pass through the code.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

I have adjusted the positioning of almost all of them. Here are the USA fighters with a few flying boats.

I just thought of something.
How will you depict Subhunters ?
Subhunters are those planes that you can built if playing with CoiF. They are a version of a normal plane, more suited to ASW combat.
In paper WiF FE, they are depicted with their Air to Sea factor in a Pink or Red circle.
But, as you already put the Air to Sea factor of the Seaplanes and Flying Boats into a blue circle, how will you depict Subhunters ???

I have a suggestion :

Have the Seaplanes and Flying Boats Air to Sea factor back to normal, and have their Range Circle be Blue.

That way, you will be able to depict the Subhunters the same way they are in paper WiF FE, that is with their usual pink / red circled Air to Sea factor.

Edit : Hey, after all, this is logical to have the Range Circle be blue, as it is the way they move that makes Flying Boats & Seaplanes what they are : seaworthy.
They move in the water, thanks to their hull or their floats [:D]

Not a viable solution. There are ATRs that are also flying boats too, so coloring their range blue would comflict with them being white for ATRs.

--

There are 2 subhunters that are also flying boats (one pink and one red). How about a red/pink number inside of a blue circle for those two? The other flying boats would have black numbers indicating normal air-to-sea factors. The other subhunters would have black numbers inside of red/pink circles.

[Froonp]

I have a suggestion :
Have the Seaplanes and Flying Boats Air to Sea factor back to normal, and have their Range Circle be Blue.

Not a viable solution. There are ATRs that are also flying boats too, so coloring their range blue would comflict with them being white for ATRs.

--

There are 2 subhunters that are also flying boats (one pink and one red). How about a red/pink number inside of a blue circle for those two? The other flying boats would have black numbers indicating normal air-to-sea factors. The other subhunters would have black numbers inside of red/pink circles.

Why not having the range circle half white, half blue ?

[Froonp]

There are 2 subhunters that are also flying boats (one pink and one red). How about a red/pink number inside of a blue circle for those two? The other flying boats would have black numbers indicating normal air-to-sea factors. The other subhunters would have black numbers inside of red/pink circles.

I also like this suggestion.

[YohanTM2]

I agree go with the red number inside the blue circle. Just like some of the nightfighters have for their combat value.

Rob

P.S. Those poor BEL and NE troops, up against the Gustav rail gun and Jagd Tigers in 1940...sheesh <g>

[Zorachus99]

ORIGINAL: Yohan

I agree go with the red number inside the blue circle. Just like some of the nightfighters have for their combat value.

*eyes explode*

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Zorachus99

ORIGINAL: Yohan

I agree go with the red number inside the blue circle. Just like some of the nightfighters have for their combat value.

*eyes explode*

Yeah, the red number inside of a blue circle is a bit much.

However, there are just 2 air units out of 1335 in the game that would have this combination and they do not arrive until 1943 and 1944. You have to be playing with the Convoy in Flames rules too, so we can assume anyone who has these units on the map are very serious WIF players. They will just be real happy with having a range of 20+ on units that have strong ASW numbers (3 red and 2 red).

There wouldn't be any pink numbers inside of a blue circle since that combination isn't in the game.

[Capitaine]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Also, to tell it again, I think that the units would be definitively terrific if they had a tiny 3-d touch, with even a slim shade added to them (as in this screen shot of SSG's most excellent "Battles in Italy" game.

ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
You guys certainly are pushing for this aren't you?

I may be joining this discussion a bit late, but in my view some type of 3D effect for the counters is a must. It looks much better than just having 2D counters.

As an example, here is a screenshot of a counter mod I am experimenting with for GGWAW. It uses subtle shading and highlights for the various counters.

The counter art is looking great, but I'll add another plea for a 3D effect on the counters. Even a simple 2-edged effect on the right and left side of the counter, as can be seen on Froonp's "Manstein" avatar, adds tremendous substance to the perception of the pieces. A strict 2D effort will look like a "budget" title compared to virtually every other quality board and counter PC game I can think of. A slight 3D look to the counter art (and possibly a slight rounding of the corners) would greatly increase the graphic appeal of the game.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

The counter art is looking great, but I'll add another plea for a 3D effect on the counters. Even a simple 2-edged effect on the right and left side of the counter, as can be seen on Froonp's "Manstein" avatar, adds tremendous substance to the perception of the pieces. A strict 2D effort will look like a "budget" title compared to virtually every other quality board and counter PC game I can think of. A slight 3D look to the counter art (and possibly a slight rounding of the corners) would greatly increase the graphic appeal of the game.

I have been making progress towards this - sort of. I haveplaced the status boxes at the top of the units outside the 96 by 96 pixel frame for the counter and I have removed the black outline around the counters. This has given me a little bit more room to work with. One consequence has been to reduce the number of units in a stack whose status boxes are continuously visible (it use to be 4, now it's 3).

What still gives me pause here are the status boxes at the top. The other units in the screen shots from other games do not have this feature.

I want to review what each of the 6 status boxes indicates. I expect to reduce their number back down to 5 (as CWIF had originally) and to make them of varying sizes, so the more important ones (e.g., disrupted unit) are slightly larger. Doing away with the status boxes seems to me to be a very bad idea. Besides indicating which units are disrupted, they show supply status, whether a unit is transporting/being transported, and whether a unit has been committed to a land attack. These are crucial aspects of a unit the player needs to know when playing the game. Putting more numbers or other indicators inside a unit's frame would be insane.

I'll get to this design problem eventually, but I think the edging for the counters (shadows, rounding) has to be resolved simultaneously with defining the status boxes.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Yohan

I agree go with the red number inside the blue circle. Just like some of the nightfighters have for their combat value.

Rob

P.S. Those poor BEL and NE troops, up against the Gustav rail gun and Jagd Tigers in 1940...sheesh <g>

No, no , you have it all wrong. Germany waited until 1944 to attack the Lowlands. Busy in the east, I guess.

[YohanTM2]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Yohan

I agree go with the red number inside the blue circle. Just like some of the nightfighters have for their combat value.

Rob

P.S. Those poor BEL and NE troops, up against the Gustav rail gun and Jagd Tigers in 1940...sheesh <g>

No, no , you have it all wrong. Germany waited until 1944 to attack the Lowlands. Busy in the east, I guess.

Damn revisionists

[Shannon V. OKeets]

Here are the new unit types from Convoys in Flames.

1 - I have not added the bitmap graphics yet. When I do, they will be generic for all units of the type. Indeed, there is just one bitmap for all the submarines, which will be used for all their variations.

2 - I will probably make the font for these generic names larger, but that decision will wait until after I've put in the bitmap images.

3 - Notice that I have removed the large TRS, CONV, and SUB labels that CWIF used. Instead of abbreviations, I prefer to use the full words whenever possible. I am thinking of changing the color of the font to white for the special submarines; so they will stand out more when you're playing.

4 - Several types of submarines can be missile subs. Because of that, I have not made them a special submarine type. I just have the program detect that they have a bombardment value greater than zero. To make this capabilty more noticeable, I am displaying it as a white number in a red circle. [WIF FE simply used red numbers - which is less forceful visually.]

5 - Another change from WIF FE is that I have labeled each of these generic unit types. WIF FE relies upon the player detecting small differences in the graphic image (I often had trouble telling naval transports and amphibiouos units apart).

6 - Notice the flying sub with its carrier capacity - the only unit in the game like this.

7 - There are 2 Walther subs shown: one with missiles and one without.

8 - Once the bitmap images are added, all of these unit types will become a little more differentiated. They're still too similar visually for my taste.

[Zorachus99]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

You will have the opportunity to intervene between the time that your ally moves a loaned unit and the team leader sends off the moves. To intervene is rather simple: as the original owner, you just reassert control of the loaned unit. At that point you can undo its move, should you so desire.

There are some moves that cannot be undone IMHO...

I'm not terribly sold on having a screen monitoring my allies on a regular basis. A nice feature perhaps.

Instead what I'm asking for is a mechanism that alerts the phasing player that an activity that is limited for the impulse chosen is being used by another player.

A simple truth table would be something like this.
ask for permission when:
Air mission, Land Movement, Naval Movement
Impulse:
Air - ignore, ignore, ignore
Land - prompt, ignore, ignore
Naval - prompt, ignore, ignore
Combined - prompt, prompt, prompt
Pass - ignore, ignore, ignore

as you can see there would not be a lot of pop-ups based on activity limits. A yes/no dialogue to allow the limited movement for a loaned unit would be nice... Dont know how realistic it would be to code....

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Zorachus99

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
You will have the opportunity to intervene between the time that your ally moves a loaned unit and the team leader sends off the moves. To intervene is rather simple: as the original owner, you just reassert control of the loaned unit. At that point you can undo its move, should you so desire.

There are some moves that cannot be undone IMHO...

I'm not terribly sold on having a screen monitoring my allies on a regular basis. A nice feature perhaps.

Instead what I'm asking for is a mechanism that alerts the phasing player that an activity that is limited for the impulse chosen is being used by another player.

A simple truth table would be something like this.
ask for permission when:
Air mission, Land Movement, Naval Movement
Impulse:
Air - ignore, ignore, ignore
Land - prompt, ignore, ignore
Naval - prompt, ignore, ignore
Combined - prompt, prompt, prompt
Pass - ignore, ignore, ignore

as you can see there would not be a lot of pop-ups based on activity limits. A yes/no dialogue to allow the limited movement for a loaned unit would be nice... Dont know how realistic it would be to code....

This is still in the design stage so exploring possibilities is a good thing.

I need to keep the game up-to-date on everyone's computer during Internet play. That is a primary goal.

To do that, transactions (groups of moves) are sent between the computers of players on the same side. Since the information is coming in anyway, and the game state is being updated to reflect what everybody on the same side is doing, we might as well show it on a detailed map. Actually, if you are looking at your French units in France facing the Germans in 1940, and the Commonwealth player moves a unit in Belgium (say), then your copy of the map will be updated automatically. You need to know what he is doing with his land and air units.

Having a second detailed map is more for situations such as when you, as Germany, are movnig units in Western Europe and Italy is moving units in North Africa. You don't have to have a separate detailed map window open, but the option exists.

As to the status of activity limits, how about a small form that shows the current number of each available. You can keep it on display at all times, and if your ally uses one of the precious few air missions, then besides immediately updating this Available Activities form, it might blink the change for a while, or emit a loud whooping noise over your sound system.[;)]

At some point you have to trust your allies. I would not enjoy playing with an ally who wanted me to say "Mother, may I" every time I wanted to move one of the units he had loaned to me. Nor would I want to impose such a restriction on an ally to whom I had loaned units.

[Manic Inertia]

The blue circled air-to-sea factors that denote flying boats are great, but how will you denote flying boats upgraded with ASW factors? I think there is one .. is it the Sunderland?

[amwild]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

The color for the Netherlands air units is off. It should (and will) match the land unit background colors perfectly.

I noticed that the CR.42bis aircraft bitmap doesn't look too good against the dark background - the dark areas of the camouflage tend to get lost in the background. At first glance, I saw an engine and wheel, a wing, and a fuselage, all seemingly separate, until I looked much closer, and even then... Perhaps these sorts of bitmaps need a single pixel white/light outline to separate them properly from dark backgrounds.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: amwild
I noticed that the CR.42bis aircraft bitmap doesn't look too good against the dark background - the dark areas of the camouflage tend to get lost in the background. At first glance, I saw an engine and wheel, a wing, and a fuselage, all seemingly separate, until I looked much closer, and even then... Perhaps these sorts of bitmaps need a single pixel white/light outline to separate them properly from dark backgrounds.

Let me see, you're complaining that the camouflage works too well?[;)]

Yeah, I need to figure something out for the 3 or 4 air units for which this is a problem.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

Final insepction for minor country units from counter sheet 7.

1 - The PZL's need to move up a couple of pixels (or should I say Pizels?). Also the Boston IV.

2 - Do you like the stripes for the lend leased planes?

3 - All the circles need smoothing. Now where did I put that sander?

4 - The extended range for the Liberator needs a black circle around the yellow circle. The name should be hyphenated too.