New to the game - Basic Questions

[rkr1958]

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Were all French BB's and CV (if not interned by the US) in France? If not, than there was a modifier to the die roll, which makes the creation of Free France more difficult.

The majority of the French fleet was at sea. But those ships that weren't were based in a metropolitan French port. Do French ships at sea change things?

Interestingly, a number of French ships on patrol in the North Sea had to scuttled because there was no port for them to return to after France fell.

[Orm]

Do French ships at sea change things?

Yes. If they are at sea it makes a huge difference.



Cut from RAC:
17.2 Determine control
Roll a die for each of the other administration groups to determine who controls it. A group becomes
controlled by the (Free) French player if the roll is within the range shown on this chart. Otherwise, it remains
controlled by Vichy France.
Free-French Chart
Administration group Die
Morocco, Algeria & Tunisia 10
French West Africa 9-10
Syria 9-10
Indo-China 9-10
Madagascar 8-10
All Asian minors & territories 7-10
French Equatorial Africa 3-10
All Pacific Ocean minors & territories 2-10
All other territories & minors 9-10
Subtract 2 from each die roll if any on-map French CVs or BBs are not currently in a Metropolitan French
port.

[paulderynck]

When Germans are in Paris it is time to return all French ships to port in the Allied RTB step since that comes before declaration of Vichy. Sure it may not get declared, but you shouldn't take the chance. As France I return every ship I can except those which would have no choice but to return to New Caledonia (usually for me these are just some CPs).

And the ports they return to ideally are ones in Admin Groups more likely to go FF - like Equatorial Africa. Except the BBs of course, they ALL need to be sunk, damaged, or in a port in the French home country.

[rkr1958]

The more I play this game, the more I learn it. Thanks, I didn't know that.

[rkr1958]

Shifting gears (i.e., changing subjects). Here's the situation.

1. Romania allowed USSR's claim to Bessarabia.

2. Germany allowed Hungary's claim to Transylvania and Bulgaria's claim to South Dobruja.

3. Italy, with Germany's help, just conquered Greece.

Now are the following correct?

4. Germany once it declares war on the USSR can align Romania.

5. And, once Germany align's Romania, it can then align Yugoslavia assuming the Italians still hold onto Athens and Albania.

[paulderynck]

An Axis major power that controls Athens can declare that Yugoslavia is aligning with it during any Axis declaration of war step if:
- Yugoslavia is neutral; and
- Italy, Hungary, Rumania, Bulgaria, Greece and Albania are all Axis controlled.

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

When Germans are in Paris it is time to return all French ships to port in the Allied RTB step since that comes before declaration of Vichy. Sure it may not get declared, but you shouldn't take the chance. As France I return every ship I can except those which would have no choice but to return to New Caledonia (usually for me these are just some CPs).

And the ports they return to ideally are ones in Admin Groups more likely to go FF - like Equatorial Africa. Except the BBs of course, they ALL need to be sunk, damaged, or in a port in the French home country.

You don't need to do that, only BBs and CVs are affected. You can take away safely to French Minors all the cruisers and transport.

Or you could take the risk, after all the normal is that some Minor "survives" and then you have the juicy BBs, the CV most probably was interned before...

Also, remember that ships can be rebased up to double the range in this case (Vichyfication).

[paulderynck]

And let the Axis return them to where they are most beneficial to the Axis if the distances are equal? Sure.

"The Axis major power installing the Vichy Government now moves every French controlled unit at sea (even those face-down) to the nearest Vichy or Free French hex (port for naval units and their cargoes) within range in which they may stack."

[rkr1958]

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

An Axis major power that controls Athens can declare that Yugoslavia is aligning with it during any Axis declaration of war step if:
- Yugoslavia is neutral; and
- Italy, Hungary, Rumania, Bulgaria, Greece and Albania are all Axis controlled.

Paul, Thanks! How is control defined? What if both Italy and Germany have a unit in Athens? Can either then align Yugoslavia assuming the remaining conditions are also met?

[paulderynck]

Whoever advanced in with the most factors gets control. If equal - I'd have to look it up - something about defining who has greater influence in the country. But anyway MWiF already will know if you hide units and show control flags you should see who controls Athens.

[rkr1958]

Apparently the program has decided yet between the Germans and Italians as to who controls Athens, which fell last impulse. I guess I'll have to wait until the end of the turn to find who is given control of the city?

[paulderynck]

The glossary says: "Controlled [a minor country or territory that is either aligned with your major power or conquered by it]"

Anyway if Athens fell recently in this same turn, then Greece is not conquered and hence not controlled until the end of turn sequence Conquest step, and Yugoslavia can't be aligned until the next turn.

Maybe MWiF doesn't show hex control changes for capitals until the conquest step.

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

And let the Axis return them to where they are most beneficial to the Axis if the distances are equal? Sure.

"The Axis major power installing the Vichy Government now moves every French controlled unit at sea (even those face-down) to the nearest Vichy or Free French hex (port for naval units and their cargoes) within range in which they may stack."

Really? [X(]

We always did it like it was the Allied player who returned them. Now that you mention it, maybe once I had it right and that's why a french cruiser was stuck in a Pacific Island OOS for all the war (I seemed never to remember or have moves to restore supply).

Ok, to Morocco or Senegal, in Morocco you'd have a 70% to keep them and in Senegal 60%. You could even divive them Senegal/Morocco/Palestina, to have a better chance to get a good result.

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

An Axis major power that controls Athens can declare that Yugoslavia is aligning with it during any Axis declaration of war step if:
- Yugoslavia is neutral; and
- Italy, Hungary, Rumania, Bulgaria, Greece and Albania are all Axis controlled.

Paul, Thanks! How is control defined? What if both Italy and Germany have a unit in Athens? Can either then align Yugoslavia assuming the remaining conditions are also met?

You can only do with the power that controls Athens:

Yugoslavia
An Axis major power that controls Athens can declare that Yugoslavia is aligning with it during any Axis declaration of war step if:
ï Yugoslavia is neutral; and
ï Italy, Hungary, Rumania, Bulgaria, Greece and Albania are all Axis controlled.

To control Athens if there are GE and IT units (if it is being conquered, if you just conntrol Athens but it has not surrendered yet, it may differ):

To conquer any other home country, you must control its capital plus every printed factory hex in that home country. You do not need to control a hex that only contains factories that were moved, or built, there.
If more than one major power from the same side controls the capital and printed factories in a home country, the major power with the greatest influence in that home country is the conqueror. Use this priority to determine who has the greatest influence:
1. Whoever controls most factories in the home country (with the capital counting as an additional 3 factories for this calculation).
2. Whoever has the highest garrison value (see 13.1) in the home country.
3. Whoever occupied the home country’s last factory or capital city.

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

The glossary says: "Controlled [a minor country or territory that is either aligned with your major power or conquered by it]"

Anyway if Athens fell recently in this same turn, then Greece is not conquered and hence not controlled until the end of turn sequence Conquest step, and Yugoslavia can't be aligned until the next turn.

Maybe MWiF doesn't show hex control changes for capitals until the conquest step.

IMO, Athens hex is controlled by some ot another Power regardless on whether Greece has surrendered or not, just like any other hex. Obviously it's not so urgent to algin YU as soon as Athens falls but it could be (for example if you think it can be reconquered right away by the nearby Brits.).

I think no doubt Harry meant after it has surrendered but he didn't write it like that, so maybe that could be in the Clarifications...

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

Apparently the program has decided yet between the Germans and Italians as to who controls Athens, which fell last impulse. I guess I'll have to wait until the end of the turn to find who is given control of the city?

If you keep the control flags showing and remove the counters from showing then you will see if Italy or Germany control the Athens hex. The nation that controls the Athens hex will conquer Greece and will be the nation that is able to align Yugoslavia.

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

The glossary says: "Controlled [a minor country or territory that is either aligned with your major power or conquered by it]"

Anyway if Athens fell recently in this same turn, then Greece is not conquered and hence not controlled until the end of turn sequence Conquest step, and Yugoslavia can't be aligned until the next turn.

Maybe MWiF doesn't show hex control changes for capitals until the conquest step.

IMO, Athens hex is controlled by some ot another Power regardless on whether Greece has surrendered or not, just like any other hex. Obviously it's not so urgent to algin YU as soon as Athens falls but it could be (for example if you think it can be reconquered right away by the nearby Brits.).

I think no doubt Harry meant after it has surrendered but he didn't write it like that, so maybe that could be in the Clarifications...

You can not align Greece until Greece is conquered because you forgot that controlling Athens is not the only requirement in order to align Yugoslavia. Greece must be controlled as well.

An Axis major power that controls Athens can declare that Yugoslavia is aligning with it during any Axis declaration of war step if:
- Yugoslavia is neutral; and
- Italy, Hungary, Rumania, Bulgaria, Greece and Albania are all Axis controlled.

[paulderynck]

ORIGINAL: Orm

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

Apparently the program has decided yet between the Germans and Italians as to who controls Athens, which fell last impulse. I guess I'll have to wait until the end of the turn to find who is given control of the city?

If you keep the control flags showing and remove the counters from showing then you will see if Italy or Germany control the Athens hex. The nation that controls the Athens hex will conquer Greece and will be the nation that is able to align Yugoslavia.

I think the screen shot is with the units hidden and from his game. If so, it's hard to figure why there's no control flag in the Athens hex??? [&:]

Maybe it's underneath the port symbol. Yes that must be the case - look at Salonica.

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

ORIGINAL: Orm

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

Apparently the program has decided yet between the Germans and Italians as to who controls Athens, which fell last impulse. I guess I'll have to wait until the end of the turn to find who is given control of the city?

If you keep the control flags showing and remove the counters from showing then you will see if Italy or Germany control the Athens hex. The nation that controls the Athens hex will conquer Greece and will be the nation that is able to align Yugoslavia.

I think the screen shot is with the units hidden and from his game. If so, it's hard to figure why there's no control flag in the Athens hex??? [&:]

Maybe it's underneath the port symbol. Yes that must be the case - look at Salonica.

You are indeed right.

I once made a check to see what hexes the control flag was completely hidden and Athens was not among them hence I was fooled. Now I compared with another game and enough of the control flag is shown there to see which country controls the hex. It is the "major port damaged" symbol that is the culprit here.

Anyway. This information should be shown in text form anyway. See picture.

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: Orm

You can not align Greece until Greece is conquered because you forgot that controlling Athens is not the only requirement in order to align Yugoslavia. Greece must be controlled as well.

An Axis major power that controls Athens can declare that Yugoslavia is aligning with it during any Axis declaration of war step if:
- Yugoslavia is neutral; and
- Italy, Hungary, Rumania, Bulgaria, Greece and Albania are all Axis controlled.

Yes, you are right. I forgot that part because I went to the rules exactly to check before posting only the part of "who can align Yugoslavia" and it said "that who controls" Athens can. There I stop reading. It was a new idea for me, cause we always waited till Greece surrendered, but...

Anyway, as I mentioned, it was clear the spirit was that, and I guessed it would have been clarified afterwards, but thanks for correcting me.