Hairy Yankee Reports: Q-Ball (A) v Greyjoy (J)

[obvert]

This set-back will only make this game an even more epic struggle. Just think. If the timetable gets pushed back far enough, you'll get jets! [8D]

[Cap Mandrake]

ORIGINAL: obvert

This set-back will only make this game an even more epic struggle. Just think. If the timetable gets pushed back far enough, you'll get jets! [8D]

Obvert is the guy who yells "jump" to the guy on the ledge. [:)]

Q-Ball;

While annoying I am sure, the squadron training mistake was not the main reason for the one-sided excahnge. You simply had bad luck on the separation range. If you lost no decks then the airgroups are preserved and the money spent on repairing the carriers is good for US GDP. This will probably get FDR re-elected.

Just attack without the carriers for a bit. Of course, you do have to find out where his carriers are first. [:)]Put all the B-24's in one level 7-9 airfield under one HQ and just bomb the crap out of something. It's fun!

If you recon bases north of Rabaul (not sure) then you can probably still take it even without the carriers.

[JohnDillworth]

So the CV's are down. Take Rabual and points north. Nothing to stop you. Rabual is a great base. You can put the whole fleet there and use it to consolidate all of you Land forces. Put tons of supply and fuel there. Every kind of support ship you can imagine. Send search planes to Truk every day. Flatten Truk every day if you like. Put every support ship you can imagine at Rabual. You will have one of the best bases on the map and it's a strait shot from Pearl. Take 3 months and reload. Prep everything , for everywhere. In 3 months you will have the superior Navy in every way and an unlimited supply of everything you need.

[DOCUP]

I'm am with the others.  Don't quit.  Somebody put Qball in rest mode in a nice Base (Tropical Beach location) with lots of supply (lots of Beer, TV, Women, no kids or wife).  He will recover his morale and move on.

[JohnDillworth]

I'm am with the others. Don't quit. Somebody put Qball in rest mode in a nice Base (Tropical Beach location) with lots of supply (lots of Beer, TV, Women, no kids or wife). He will recover his morale and move on.

Thats what I'm saying. Here is a recent picture of Rabaul (not mine) looks nice. He just has to take the base and bring the beer! [:D]

[Nemo121]

Hell, you don't even NEED the carriers in order to win. I've won several games when I took over after Allied players lost their CV fleets.

[Q-Ball]

Actually, I'm not quitting. Momentary loss of morale, but we press on. I can always pretend someone else made the mistakes and press on from there, right?

8-26-43 to 8-30-43:

At any rate, I will post a map, but here is the basics of what happened:

--IJN CVs positioned exactly 8 hexes from mine.....perfect positioning! My DBs have a normal range of 7, of course.....
--We sank several transports at Hollandia, but the IJN launched many strikes against us
--YORKTOWN is moderately damaged, non-operational, but can make 16 knots. She will live, but will be in the yard awhile
--3 other CVs took some damage, but all remained operational
--We shot down something like 300 planes

Withdrawl:

Turned out uneventful. I pulled everyone together in a hex 2 hexes from Long Island; there, because that is the max travel distance for YORKTOWN. We had all nearby airbases packed with fighters, I almost with there was a major attack; I counted something like 600 Allied fighters up over those CVs, or at least ordered to be on LRCAP and whatnot and on the CVs themselves, so any attacks would have been a buzzsaw. Next turn, pulling everyone back to Deboyne.

I will post an update on what is operational; I think 3 CVs are going into the yards, though 1 or 2 can make 25 knots and could stick around. I have USS CONGRESS plus 2 CVLs about to join the fleet, and WASP is nearly finished repairs at Sydney. So I can make good losses almost immediately.

Burma:

Greyjoy constructed a really good line of defense in Burma, that works well with stacking limits; put about 20K guys in each jungle hex (max stack of 35K), and it's pretty much impregnible without total air superiority. Because the RAF really stinks (does anyone else find the Hurris useless vs. Tojo and later?), you can't get that without committing USAAF 2nd gen planes.

He left a soft spot guarded by just Thai Troops though, so we managed to sneak 2 Indian Div there, with tank support. They should be able to knock them out of the hex, which would bust it open, hopefully....we'll see next turn.

UPDATE: First attack was 2-1, and forced the withdrawl of one of the units. I have 100s of bombers hitting the hex tomorrow, plus another attack. If this works, I'll have a hole in the line, and he'll probably start pulling out of Burma.

Hansa Bay:

Fell easily to first assault; soon this will be a major base.

[crsutton]

Mostly reading and commenting on GJs AAR so don't want to say too much here. But I would take your position any day and be content as an Allied player. In spite of your best efforts you have not lost your carriers.[:D] Simply put, if you have not lost your carriers by now then you should win-eventually.

Stay the course and you should do just fine. There is no doubt that GJ is a top notch player. Enjoy the thrill of taking him on..

However, I highly recommend that you quit trying so hard to sink your own carriers...[:D]

[JohnDillworth]

--IJN CVs positioned exactly 8 hexes from mine.....perfect positioning! My DBs have a normal range of 7, of course.....

He is good with positioning the KB. He guesses the range correctly, strikes, and withdraws into his interior lines. Not for the first time. He is a sniper with the discipline not to get into a stand up fight with you. He inflicts as much damage as he can while remaining safe. pick, pick, pick. He has tendencies and patterns. How can these be used against him?

[Q-Ball]

8-29 to 9-1-43:

Burma:

We almost cracked Greyjoy's lines in Burma, but I think we're going to come up a tad short.

We had 2 successful attacks against Thai units in a hex near Kalemyo; last one was 3-1. Forts held me off, and my guys were VERY tired after 2 shock attacks, and the Chinese Div I had there was completely fried.

I paused a day, and during that time an IJN Regt occupied the hex. I am going to try one more, but I am not optimistic.

I also lost alot of planes over this hex, though we shot down a bunch of IJA....this last turn, we did sweep 30 Franks for only 2 P-47, so finally getting the upper hand there.

But I think this is going to hold. This is the way to defend Burma: Plant 20K troops in every jungle hex, and with stacking limits it's very tough to crack. Especially, without air superiority.

Has anyone else cracked Burma with stacking limits? Without limits it's easy, I would have 5 divisions in that hex instead of 2. The other issue is the RAF: It's terrible. The Hurricane is a bad plane.

Molu:

IJN BBs bombarded Molu again; I've been mining it though pretty heavily, and it finally paid some dividends, sinking a modern DD. Was hoping for a BB hit though.

I will be doing something about this shortly.

CV Status:

The result of that battle turned out not bad at all. There is a major USN AA upgrade in 10/43 anyway, so now is a good time to take a break and initiate that. You can see below; most of these CVs will repair at Sydney, and should take about a month or so. In the meantime, additional CVs are set to join the fleet, including CONGRESS, BUNKER HILL, 2 CVLs, and WASP (finishing repairs from a sub torp hit)

[witpqs]

Has anyone else cracked Burma with stacking limits? Without limits it's easy, I would have 5 divisions in that hex instead of 2. The other issue is the RAF: It's terrible. The Hurricane is a bad plane.

You can see my AAR for some ideas, but how much will pertain to the troop configuration in your game is for you to decide. In my view, air superiority at the point of attack is critical. Your bombers must get through, his bombers preferably not but that's less critical. On the ground, many have commented about concentration of firepower, and I agree. Look at the anti-soft and anti-hard value of the squads you are using. Tanks and powerful arty units in an attack should be helpful as well.

The Chinese squads are very weak compared to other Allied squads, and as such they should not be the tip of the spear. From what I have seen shock attacks succeed far, far less often than in old WITP and are actually a splendidly effective way to blunt your own sword.

The Hurricanes must be managed carefully, and plenty of well-skilled pilots kept available to fly them. They can perform certain tasks anywhere from passably well to well, but are best not used for other things. I'm sure you've already found out the difference!

I'm reading both sides so I won't say anything specific, only this kind of general stuff.

[JeffroK]

In addition to witpqs's comments about getting the most efficient force together, dont forget, stacking limits dont stop you from exeeding the limit, its the point where you suffer penalties.

Weigh the cost, if you could scrape together 100,000 men and plenty of supply you might be able to blast a way through?

[Q-Ball]

9-4-43 to 9-10-43:

Air Losses:

Greyjoy majorly ambushed several of my bombing runs, and did a great job. I need to do a better job of mixing it up and not being predictable, I've gotten a little lazy, and paid. I lost about 320 planes on the 7th, shooting down 95 Japanese, but that's a bad ratio for me.

I need to get better planes to Burma; Hurris and P-40s won't cut it on sweeps. I am moving Hellcats there shortly, which is good because I actually have plenty of those, and can sustain high losses. Can't say that about P-47 or P-38.

So, I need to get better at air war for sure! I've been kind of lazy.

I also need to accumulate stocks of planes. I lost 30 P-47s on that one day (had them set to escort by accident), but I have lost very few Corsairs or P-38.

IJN Air:

I've been amazed at how Greyjoy can have 100s of fighters seemingly everywhere. He has rapidly expanded the IJN Air, I am sure by re-sizing air units. For example, "Hosho-1" is split into 3 units, each of 20+ planes from what I can tell. Several are like that, pretty much all the Zero units. Many are then upgraded to N1K1. As a result, the IJN probably has over 1000 fighters in front-line units, more than I have. I am outnumbered on every front for the most part.

So, until I get more quality planes, I can't dominate the air very easily.

Burma:

I think our attack was stopped for now; Greyjoy managed to reinforce the hex quicker than I can, and 19000 guys is enough to stop me in rough terrain. I will try again in a few days just to be sure.

In the long run though, I'm going around his lines in Burma, so I kind of hope he stays where he is; he has well over 150,000 troops in Burma, and I would like them to be stuck there.

Solomons:

We've been rapidly consolidating in the Solomons, setting up bases for future ops.

Hansa Bay is a large airbase, and we are about to land at Manus. We have units prepped for Rabaul; I want to clear it for a nice base.

[crsutton]

Yeah the hellcat was my go to fighter as soon as it came on board. It can handle any Japanese first generation plane-especially the damn tojo and only the Frank can hurt it. Until you start to get a lot of corsairs you will just have to lean on this one.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Yeah the hellcat was my go to fighter as soon as it came on board. It can handle any Japanese first generation plane-especially the damn tojo and only the Frank can hurt it. Until you start to get a lot of corsairs you will just have to lean on this one.

That's what I am thinking...it's not the greatest plane, but with 130 replacements a month, it's the most plentiful. I've been converting some Marine units too, just paying the PPs for that. I have plenty.

9-15-43:

Greyjoy cursed his luck in an e-mail to me that his KB planes didn't launch (below), but I wish they had; he may have thought I had cruisers at Hansa Bay, instead of just DDs. I can afford alot of DD losses, I haven't lost very many in this game (unlike other ships!), and US yards crank out almost one a day right now.

I have alot of fighters at Hansa Bay; I hope he tries to bombard Wewak (he has a cruiser TF seemingly teed up for that), but I don't think he will.

Molu:

Was bombarded again; we need to sneak some supplies in there, hope we can in between the bombardments.

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

As a result, the IJN probably has over 1000 fighters in front-line units, more than I have. I am outnumbered on every front for the most part.

Hence my comment on the over expansion of his airforce. Tactically a good move, strategically maybe not. He's invested a lot of supply and HI to get these. Both of which you need to make him pay for in '44 and beyond.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

As a result, the IJN probably has over 1000 fighters in front-line units, more than I have. I am outnumbered on every front for the most part.

Hence my comment on the over expansion of his airforce. Tactically a good move, strategically maybe not. He's invested a lot of supply and HI to get these. Both of which you need to make him pay for in '44 and beyond.

Not just fighters, but Greyjoy has nearly 900 Jake Ops losses so far. That's a ton! I think a) he probably expanded the Floatplane units like crazy, including one unit from each cruiser, and expanded to 24 or so, and/or b) he is flying them at low altitude on ASW. Probably a bit of both, as I have given up on Sub commerce raiding; I was just getting subs hit by bombs for no impact, and it was more trouble than it was worth.

9-16 and 9-17-43:

Hollandia:

Greyjoy managed to reinforce Hollandia, with KB covering; a transport TF dropped-off something like 10,000 troops. I sent several FLETCHER TFs into the hex; we did sink 3-4 transports, but we didn't stop the reinforcement.

Unlike my cruiser losses, my DD losses to date have been light. At the same time, US Yards are crapping Fletchers for breakfast. I am going to be very profligate with little Fletcher TFs, hopefully I can drive Greyjoy crazy. I can afford a couple dozen losses easily; many of my surface TFs are already DD-heavy. (As Japan, I never felt I had enough DDs)

House Rules:

Advice on this one: I haven't night bombed, because everyone says it's broken. We don't have a rule, but I'm OK to make one, but I think there should be one exception: B-29s can strat night bomb Japan. Is that fair? B-29s certainly did in real life. Thoughts?

We also had a no strat bomb rule until late 1943 (except Japan can strat bomb India/Aus). This was to prevent cheap oil hits by Allies, and Japs starving the Chinese. I think it's time for the gloves to come off here. Fair?

[obvert]

House Rules:

Advice on this one: I haven't night bombed, because everyone says it's broken. We don't have a rule, but I'm OK to make one, but I think there should be one exception: B-29s can strat night bomb Japan. Is that fair? B-29s certainly did in real life. Thoughts?

We also had a no strat bomb rule until late 1943 (except Japan can strat bomb India/Aus). This was to prevent cheap oil hits by Allies, and Japs starving the Chinese. I think it's time for the gloves to come off here. Fair?

We allowed strat bombing anywhere, including China, recently. After one foray in the light that suffered a bit, Jocke has been flying at night. While the damage done is a bit more extensive than I would think plausible (i.e.- all HI at bangkok destroyed in one 90 plane raid at 7% moonlight), the strikes are intermittent due to the service rating of the B-29s. I don't have a problem with it in terms of balance. In fact it would be odd if the USAAF couldn't strat bomb. But airfield attacks are a bit overly accurate at night in my opinion, especially since you can launch these virtually every night without a rule.

[Captain Cruft]

I think strategic night bombing is fine as long you limit it to targeting Manpower.

[JocMeister]

Regarding the float planes my opponent has done the same thing. In May -44 he has lost 1464 Jakes. About 800 to OPS losses. I have also just come to the realisation commerce raiding with subs are contra productive...wish I had figured that out sooner! [:D]

Regarding night bombing. If you want to do any kind of strat bombing you will more or less have to do it by night or within fighter range. Your B29s will suffer just as heavily versus fighters as your B24s. I lost 22 B29 against 18 Zeroes over Medan in a single raid. I have tested it pretty extensively and the number looks to be somewhere between 0.6-0.7 lost B29 per airborne fighter on CAP depending on fighter model. With only 18 per month...

Night bombing IS very powerful and its pretty easy to knock out both oil and HI in pretty big numbers using only night bombings. While this might seem unfair to use its pretty much the only way to do it. This is balanced somewhat by fatigue. I can only launch about once every 4-5 days at best. Daylight bombings outside fighter range is just not doable due to losses.