Suggestions for Distant Worlds 2...

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22

Just discussed this in my last post.. CrowdFunding is just one example, Steam Early Access is another..etc..

If finding funding for a game were that easy, then we'd see far more crowd-funded games. It isn't.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22

ORIGINAL: Kayoz
I would hope that humanity comes together in a unified confederation, free of borders, hate and prejudice. I think I'm more likely to see what I want than you.

Uh..? actually my hope of a game company making a better game is pretty more likely.. have you seen the news? Israel, France, etc. ha..

No, you wrote - "adding resources to make a good game multiplayer wouldn't really affect the developers from making a great singleplayer game". Budgets are limited. Everything you add somewhere has to be paid out of the development budget from somewhere else. What you are suggesting would require more money. In a perfect world with limitless development resources, then yes - it could happen. But that's not the world we live in.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
Again I "discussed" the funding aspect.. there are many ways to market and make money in 2015 to gain "resources"

From a business perspective, the "ideas" you offered are as good as spending your budget on lottery tickets.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
Don't pretend like you don't know how companies are run and what they are after.. You know as well as I that is how the world works. Money. It's pretty simple. I'm pretty sure Matrix isn't run by some rich wealth gamer trying to give out to the public for free and the better good of humanity.. But they do make great games yes.

Is this an attempt to sound intelligent? Pointing out the obvious capitalistic interests of Matrix is hardly an earth-shattering epiphany.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
Perhaps he means the quality, as a F-16 built in Taiwan may have more problems with their fuel injectors or become jammed more easily compared to whatever they make in Turkey's F-16's.. I doubt planes is a good example to use. but I'm sure that's where he was going..

Neither Taiwan nor Turkey build F-16s, as far as I am aware of.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
The whole point of this, by the way, is I love playing Distant Worlds and anything more on top of the "singleplayer" game would just be more icing on the cake..

A low priority in my book. I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI - and leave multiplayer for if/when the DW franchise gains a wider market. I don't live in a world of limitless money for game development. They have to do the best they can with quite limited resources.

[Chris21wen]

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

Everybody has a choice, mine is I don't play multiplayer and/or real time games. Your choice seems to be you do. If I'm correct then go play them and leave us single game players to enjoy the games we enjoy.

This is a real time (Though you can pause) game. This isn't just YOUR game, it's MY game too, and I thought it would be neat to have the OPTION to play against other people. No one is forcing multiplayer on anyone. I own a lot of games that are single player, and that's how I play them, but guess what... the games have multiplayer too. It's nice to have another OPTION to play, don't you think? This game running multiplayer will not hurt your way of playing at all, so why the big uproar?

Not if you can pause it it's not to the extent you can pause this game thank goodness or I would not be playing it.

I don't have a problem with an option, I have a problem with being told the game will be improved, to me it will not be and is much more likely to be ruined as less development will go into creating a viable AI. I never said your or my and I never used capitals so please do not do so in response to a perfectly valid argument.

Oh! and a Merry Christmas.

[Ranbir]

I think there are enough mp focused 4x games: and look how far their depth factor is barred by needing to be competitive.

To have a heavy sp only simulation niche that DW fills is great and I hope it is filled again in 2 with focus on refining and evolving all the features that DW:Universe has. MP will require a lot of manpower hours and I don't think it will be worth it for a small % to have that option. Other big 4x games are demonstrative of this.

[Blabsawaw22]

Kayoz. It's not worth responding to most of your answers.. However I'll just leave you with the "real world".


https://www.indiegogo.com/explore/gamin ... ost_funded

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_v ... g_projects

$3,000,000 for MegaMan Kayoz.. 3 million... and Mega-Man..
https://www.kickstarter.com/discover/ca ... ost_funded

and there is about 10 more websites of CrowdFunding..

Good Day,

Merry Christmas

[Retreat1970]

I don't have a problem with an option, I have a problem with being told the game will be improved, to me it will not be and is much more likely to be ruined as less development will go into creating a viable AI.

100% of current and past development went into the AI, diplomacy, etc... and while much improved, it still falls short. Therefore, to argue DW2 will have a great AI, Diplomacy, etc... with 100% development attention isn't valid.

Oh, and merry x-mas too. Can't wait to see the grandkids.

[Osito]

Kayoz? Kayoz? Is that really you, man?

/em Pokes Kayoz really hard in face with finger.

Is it really you?

Have I ever seen you arguing in such a restrained manner before (not complaining though - and your points are as good as they always were)?

Whatever, merry Xmas to you, and everyone else.

Osito

[Retreat1970]

I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI

Read my last post.

Pirate play. I don't play it (well a few times). I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI.
But they didn't, and i'm glad I have the option to play a pirate someday.

Ancient galaxy. Played a few times. I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI.
But they didn't, and i'm glad I have the option to play the ancient galaxy someday.

Return/ Shakturi. played a lot but I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI.
But they didn't, and i'm glad I have the option to play vs Shakturi.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22

Kayoz. It's not worth responding to most of your answers.. However I'll just leave you with the "real world".

Without figures on the failed funding attempts, the numbers are meaningless.

You might as point to all the lottery winners as a sign of the success of buying a lottery ticket as a means of economic advancement.

You are trying to present a dust mote of the story as the entirety. If you had more imagination, I would call it lying.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Osito

Kayoz? Kayoz? Is that really you, man?

/em Pokes Kayoz really hard in face with finger.

Stop that!

ORIGINAL: Osito
Is it really you?

Have I ever seen you arguing in such a restrained manner before (not complaining though - and your points are as good as they always were)?

For a given quantity of "me".

You make it sound like I'm usually obstreperous and/or caustic in my comments of bad ideas. Am I not always positive and maintain a friendly, engaging manner? I thought so....

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI

Read my last post.

Pirate play. I don't play it (well a few times). I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI.
But they didn't, and i'm glad I have the option to play a pirate someday.

Ancient galaxy. Played a few times. I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI.
But they didn't, and i'm glad I have the option to play the ancient galaxy someday.

Return/ Shakturi. played a lot but I'd rather they spent their dev resources on the game's stability, optimization and AI.
But they didn't, and i'm glad I have the option to play vs Shakturi.

You might note that all these developments came AFTER they had worked out the major defects in DW's stability, optimization and AI.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22

Kayoz. It's not worth responding to most of your answers.. However I'll just leave you with the "real world".

Real world:
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1957 ... udgets.php

[Retreat1970]

This thread gives me a headache. I'm out.

I hope everyone has a good holiday season.

I want to take my Grandson to see Star Wars, but he's only 6. Is that too young? I remember my Mother taking me to Star Wars when I was 7, and it was awesome.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

This thread gives me a headache. I'm out.

I hope everyone has a good holiday season.

I want to take my Grandson to see Star Wars, but he's only 6. Is that too young? I remember my Mother taking me to Star Wars when I was 7, and it was awesome.

Take him.

[Retreat1970]

Thanks. I don't know anyone that has seen it, and I just wanted to be sure it's kid safe. I can't wait myself.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

Thanks. I don't know anyone that has seen it, and I just wanted to be sure it's kid safe. I can't wait myself.

I'd say it's about on the same level as the original Star Wars, where non-kiddie material is concerned.

[Blabsawaw22]

ORIGINAL: Kayoz

Real world:
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1957 ... udgets.php
[/quote]

----------------------------------------------------------------------



Kayoz,

Thank you for the Christmas present of giving me an article written in 2013.

That article was about how companies don't know what to do when such big budgets hit their plate. Oh my terrible.. (I'm sure Matrix would ruin the singleplayer game due to stress of crowdfunding right?) The only other aspect of that article was about how fans that donate have expectations and companies are worried that they won't deliver..

Distant Worlds 1 already delivered.. adding multiplayer is the debate here buddy. DW2 is a new game and should deliver new concepts and features, yes, while building on their original structure and purpose of a 4x space game with a private sector..



Nowhere does this article support you in the debate we are having about how Matrix can get the "resources" and support to add to it's single player developed game..

More proof in the Article you decided to show:

Independent games creator Deirdra Kiai has twice successfully crowdfunded and delivered games:
"Since I work alone, I manage a team of one...

Is Matrix a team of "one"? Does the Developer work alone? I actually don't know, but I assume he doesn't.

If you actually paid attention to my posts, they did give Real World examples in 2015, Not an article written in 2013 about how crowdfunding actually works and just is in it's building stages..

Retreat1970 hit the nail on the head with his earlier posts as well.

The only thing that could "ruin" the "singleplayer" game of DW2 is if the Developer "chooses" to go different routes than our "expectations"

for some reason people think adding multiplayer causes this?

Time to eat! (looking at my new Strauss expensive watch I just got for Christmas!)

[Retreat1970]

Time to eat! (looking at my new Strauss expensive watch I just got for Christmas!)

Congrats! Stuff yourself good. I know I will.

[ASHBERY76]

Back to topic.

1.Rework the diplomacy.Look at EU4 and copy it.War goals,reasons for war,war wariness effect should be copied from EU.
2.Make factions more unique.All the factions play the same.Different races should have different mechanics.Hive Bugs using tourism seems wrong.
3.Resources more varied and important.I find these do not really matter that much after the start.More varied effects than just happiness is needed too.
4.More living universe.Internal politics,more space monsters,more events.It feels like these were not improved after the vanilla release.Massive waste.
5.Non linear tech trees.DW vanilla had a very interesting design which was just changed into a boring linear tree.
6.No multiplayer.Do not compromise the design for less 1% of the playerbase.Nobody plays MP strategy games unless they are called StarCraft2.

[Guardian54]

I am vaguely amazed no one thought to quote/reply/discuss with me my proposal for how 3D orientation mechanics would work and isntead this whole thread is a free-for-all about multiplayer...

[Retreat1970]

6.No multiplayer.Do not compromise the design for less 1% of the playerbase.Nobody plays MP strategy games unless they are called StarCraft2.

Lol. Facts? Speculation? You're right, multiplayer is dumb.

I am vaguely amazed no one thought to quote/reply/discuss with me my proposal for how 3D orientation mechanics would work and isntead this whole thread is a free-for-all about multiplayer...

3D would be interesting, but I don't know how it would work. Seems like it would be clumsy. 3D but on a fixed plane could possibly work.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
Thank you for the Christmas present of giving me an article written in 2013.

Yes, there have been so many changes in the computer game industry and Kickstarter that it's entirely irrelevant. Of course, how obvious. I assume you're a fan of "new math", "new science" and "new economics"?

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
That article was about how companies don't know what to do when such big budgets hit their plate. Oh my terrible.. (I'm sure Matrix would ruin the singleplayer game due to stress of crowdfunding right?) The only other aspect of that article was about how fans that donate have expectations and companies are worried that they won't deliver..

I had hoped that you'd see that throwing more money at a project doesn't result in a linear progression of gains. As a project grows, it gains more inertia - and as such, adding a multiplayer element to DW2 wouldn't be nearly as trivial in terms of budget and overall project complexity, as you seem to think.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
Distant Worlds 1 already delivered.. adding multiplayer is the debate here buddy. DW2 is a new game and should deliver new concepts and features, yes, while building on their original structure and purpose of a 4x space game with a private sector..

Unless Elliot has already designed that as a feature of DW2, this is a pointless discussion. DW2 is being developed. Adding it to the existing design would be like adding wings to a Lada.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
Nowhere does this article support you in the debate we are having about how Matrix can get the "resources" and support to add to it's single player developed game..

It's clear that you've never dealt with project budgets or discussed such a concept with venture capitalists. Only when you actually go out and do it for yourself, will you gain an iota of understanding.

With that said, since it's such a simple matter to get oodles of wonga, why don't you do it? After all, it's a trivial matter to collect millions from crowd-funding sites. So why don't you do it yourself and not wait for Matrix to sort it out?

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
More proof in the Article you decided to show:

Independent games creator Deirdra Kiai has twice successfully crowdfunded and delivered games:
"Since I work alone, I manage a team of one...

Is Matrix a team of "one"? Does the Developer work alone? I actually don't know, but I assume he doesn't.

No idea. Erik has always been somewhat obtuse whenever that subject comes up. It would depend on how you calculate it. Do you include the support staff - the accountants at Matrix, the sales and marketing bods, the contractors working on music and graphics, the hired guns brought in for optimization and specific tasks? Matrix doesn't seem to run the development of their titles in the typical office environment, so the number is very dependent on how one counts.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22
If you actually paid attention to my posts, they did give Real World examples

As I noted - without any metrics on the crowd-funded failures, your examples are meaningless. Kickstarter's history is littered with game dev failures. Failures to meet funding goals, failure to deliver on promises, or simple cases of people buggering off with the money.

ORIGINAL: Blabsawaw22

Retreat1970 hit the nail on the head with his earlier posts as well.

The only thing that could "ruin" the "singleplayer" game of DW2 is if the Developer "chooses" to go different routes than our "expectations"

for some reason people think adding multiplayer causes this?

Re: Adding multiplayer:
One word: BUDGET

As for routes, DW has found a market niche. If DW2 does not address the desires of that niche, then they are, in essence, starting an entirely new project. That would be idiotic. I'll give Erik more credit for his marketing IQ than that.