PAW 1941-45 larryfulkerson (Axis) vs warspite1 (Allies)

[MikeJ19]

Warspite,

As some one has said, you can not lose this game in the first couple of turns. The Japanese (Larry) has all the initial momentum.

I really enjoy your AARs. The combination of your writing, graphics and tables is great and I learn lots from you.

Thanks,

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: MikeJ19

Warspite,

As some one has said, you can not lose this game in the first couple of turns. The Japanese (Larry) has all the initial momentum.

I really enjoy your AARs. The combination of your writing, graphics and tables is great and I learn lots about what not to do.

Thanks,

warspite1

Fixed that for you Mike [;)]

[warspite1]

Turn 3 - Axis Turn (in real time)
21st December 1941

The turn begins with further landings on Borneo and Sumatra

Japanese forces in Northern Luzon head south along the west coast.

Aircraft reinforcements deploy from Japan to various destinations

Forces push north from French Indo-China and reinforcements appear to be heading there from Thailand…. Interesting. That’s a big rail capacity in French Indo-China!

More reinforcements for Northern China arrive by sea from Japan

There’s some naval action off New Caledonia I think – there appears to be troops aboard here too…..

The Japanese are building up their forces in the Solomon Islands….

Ever increasing numbers of naval vessels enter the Coral Sea. Some or all of the 1st Air Fleet is here now. This is not good.

Yet more units land on Luzon. The Japanese attack on Leyte and take out the partisan unit there – this island is completely under Japanese control – units from there then sail for Mindanao

And yet more troops put to sea – destination unknown – ah of course – it’s the Solomons and what looks like a small island someway to the south of the island chain

Heavy reinforcement of New Guinea and then more troops heading into the Coral Sea and land on what I believe is New Caledonia

And more units land on Luzon

Japanese aircraft – a lot of aircraft - head for New Caledonia, China, the NEI and the Philippines

Mindanao is strengthened with more units – including one next to Davo

A Japanese fleet heads for Eastern Australia

A Japanese fleet is parked outside Kuantan – I suspect it’s loaded with troops…

More Chinese units are surrounded…..

There are numerous bombardments but I can’t see what by – Calcutta appears to be a target? As is Australia and what may be New Zealand???? So many bombardments – The PI is hit all over the place as is the Australian/US naval vessels sheltering on the southern Australian coast. HMAS Canberra evaporates…

The action switches to Malaya now and the Indian forces on the Malay/Thai border come under renewed assault and are forced back on the east coast. Also on the south coast the Chinese are in trouble once more and forced into retreat

Australian naval vessels near Brisbane come under attack and are destroyed

Another Pacific island is captured but can’t make out which one.

Bombardments all across the map continue and Port Moresby is captured

[warspite1]

Turn 3 - Axis Turn
21st December 1941

An interesting turn. The Japanese cast their net ever wider and they are obviously targeting Australia by taking the islands to the east first.

But I inflicted more losses on the Japanese in Thailand, there were only two attacks in the PI and in China the losses of infantry dropped massively to just 192 - still high but nothing like the 700+ of last turn.

Amongst the bad news there are two pieces of good cheer. Allies recover from Shock - I don't recall reading what form that shock actually took - but whatever it was its now over.

Secondly the Japanese have lost 1 point of supply thanks to the Australian battalion that occupied Jambi City on Sumatra.

[warspite1]

Turn 3 - Axis Turn
21st December 1941

Australia and the Southwest Pacific

A sea of red dots surrounds Australia....

The naval score: HMAS Canberra is sunk and two subchasers damaged for the loss of 1 Japanese subchaser sunk and another damaged. [strange this scenario has lots of 'subchasers' but I haven't seen a single submarine yet....]

[warspite1]

Turn 3 - Axis Turn
21st December 1941

Thailand/Malaya

Although the two surrounded Indian Brigades will succumb, the good news here is that they are delaying reinforcements of Japanese troops further south and the Japanese are taking heavy casualties in making the gains they have.

[warspite1]

Turn 3 - Axis Turn
21st December 1941

The Philippines

Of the 26 actions last turn, 8 were bombardments that caused nil damage - and one of these was in Manila Bay. I can only hope that the Japanese march into the Solomons is diluting the forces available here.

[warspite1]

Turn 3 - Axis Turn
21st December 1941

China

[warspite1]

Turn 3
21st December 1941

Thought process.

I've taken the decision to keep my very weak Royal Navy and not so weak - but very important - US Navy out of the way. However the build up of units in the Solomons is very worrying from the point of view of the safety of Australia.

I am considering therefore bringing both fleets into play so that it at least gives Larry something to think about. With my fleets hiding away, Larry has full reign over the Pacific and Indian Oceans.

Reinforcements

I have some reinforcements this turn and these are almost entirely reinforcements for Pearl Harbor - which is good! The other unit added is a partisan in China.

I will need to start looking more closely at my troops, aircraft etc but at the moment its just about trying to stave off disaster.

[warspite1]

Turn 3
21st December 1941

The Philippines

But first things first, as I forgot to move my Filipino units last turn I think I should start here!


Edit: Sorry the caption on the left should read 81st Mil Div. Also post picture all units are set to ignore losses.

[warspite1]

Turn 3
21st December 1941

Malaya and NEI

[warspite1]

Turn 3
21st December 1941

China

[warspite1]

Turn 3
21st December 1941

I chicken out of moving my fleets. I will see if I can identify where Larry's carriers are next turn with a view to moving then.

The attacks were rubbish. The Beauforts in Malaya are almost wiped out and the Indian artillery couldn't hit jack.

Back to Larry....

[warspite1]

Turn 4
28th December 1941

I totally misjudged the time taken for watching the replay - I thought I could get it done before having to leave the house last night. Sadly that was optimistic so I've missed quite a bit of the Japanese turn - which is less than ideal. I really think the replay should have a function that allows players to go back and re-watch in different sessions.

Mind you, what I did see was disappointing. we have not left December and the Japanese appear to have inexhaustible amounts of sea lift, oil and troops. So it looks like this is not going to be a particularly realistic Pacific War game and I will just have to accept it is what it is, play on accordingly and see where it goes.

Before we drill down into the detail here is a high level summary of the situation - remember this is 28th December 1941:


Note: It has been agreed that Manchuria is out of bounds until the Soviets are activated

[warspite1]

Turn 4
28th December 1941

So from what I remember from the playback I did see, there was a massive Japanese naval presence (three task forces?) sent to Southern Sumatra.

Then a destroyer squadron (5 destroyers) sailed to the Maldives and found my fleet. My fleet opened fire (Battle 1) to absolutely no effect and the destroyers seemingly departed.

Then another Japanese fleet - not from Sumatra I don't think - sailed to the Maldives and attacked using carrier aircraft. It appears from the Combat chart that my fleet was attacked by aircraft from the light carriers Shoho and Ryujo - who between them managed to employ 146! aircraft (real life actual maximum 67). That said I have noticed that the Hermes air group is 27 aircraft - which is more than double her actual complement so historical capability can be ignored.

The attack (Battle 30) saw the battleship Resolution and 6 destroyers sunk for the loss of 19 fighters (7 destroyed) and 11 bombers (9 destroyed).

There was then a third engagement (Battle 43) between a small fleet of Japanese - 2 light cruisers and 6 destroyers, against a British heavy cruiser, a light cruiser and 3 destroyers. I missed this part of the playback so I do not know where this Japanese fleet came from or where it went. However in this engagement, the Royal Navy lost the old C-class cruiser Colombo and 3 destroyers and sunk 6 Japanese destroyers in return.

The Royal Navy don't have Kilindini or Capetown as an option (I think the furthest port is Karachi?) so I guess there is nothing to stop the Japanese simply finishing off the entire Eastern Fleet....

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: warspite1
"Hawaii? India? Australia? I fear this scenario is not exactly a great representation of the Pacific War (where are the subs?)...."

I agree with you that subs make up more than a significant portion of the total combat force and that having them missing is the next big thing TOAW is going to have to model: Subs. Along with Night Missions for aircraft, and a training mission to increase the proficienchy of units slowly ( as a new method added to an existing one: combat ). I guess right now if you want subs the scenario designer is going to have to come up with a way to model a sub given the existing TOAW rules about spotting and interception and who know what is involved. We tried spotter planes on CA's briefly and it's a known fact that the Japs had float-plane carrying subs. They used them for recon further out than the men could see from the bridge of the conning tower. It was considered expendable. If the sub had to submerge before the plane came back the float plane would have to develop a way to manufacture aviation gas real quick. Usually the sub would come back to the spot where the plane had launched because that way they were guarenteed that the plane iw within about 200 miles from that spot unless it doesn't exist any longer for one reason or another.

But Japs had to ship everything to the home islands from DEI and China etc. to build the tanks and ships and planes and above all, most important of all was the PETROLEM products. Fuel for the tanks, bunker oil for the ships, and the high grade, high octane fuels needed for the high-performance aircraft. [ The octane of the gas run in the average Jap car of that period would have been in the 70's and the octane of the high-grade aviation fuel was 115 or higher depending on the engine. Vehicle gas is tented artifically red and aviation gas is tented green so it won't be accidently put into a plane by accident. ] And Allied subs were instramental in sinking so many of the transports that Japan was effectively starved of the resources they needed for the war effort. That's not modeled in this scenario.

ORIGINAL: warspite1
"...as Japanese capability in all areas seems waaay over the top. But hey, it is what it is and its great to be playing the PTO so I'll just have to suck it up and see what happens."

Does "way over the top" mean there's too many ships or too many planes, or too many divisions, or ???
How about mroe details. The scenario designer is going to need more details to fix anything. Don't leave anything out. The Allied replacements need to spawn on the West Coast instead of at Pearl for one thing.

I wrote this and posted it at the bottom of page one of the AAR. I won't peek ahead of page one no worries.

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: warspite1
Turn 1 - Axis Turn (in real time)
7th December 1941

The playback has its limitations for a game of this scale. I can't afford to skip it - there is too much going on - but without a fast-forward and rewind option, or a pause option then I'm going to have to be selective about when I can watch the previous turn. This may slow the game time up considerably.

I'll go through the first turn's losses tomorrow or Saturday.

ORIGINAL: MikeJ19
Warspite,

I think those options make sense during the play back. As most people know, I have not tried multi player yet, but there are lots of times that I wish I could rewind the playing of the AI's turn to ensure that I catch important things.

Now, I'm off to see if Larry posted anything about this battle...

All the best,

Hey you guys, look at the VCR controls during the playback. There's a rewind, pause, one-step, play, stop and one other one I can't remember now. Maybe not. Anyway, next time you do the playback the thing you click on to get it to play is the VCR controls and the status bar at the bottom will tell you what each control is for if you mouse hover over them.

I'm posting this from the bottom of page one.

[larryfulkerson]

Hey Rob:
You posted this picture and on it you've annotated that you think it's just short of a fantasy for the Japs to be landing so far southwest this early in the war and I agree with you. The problem is there's nothing in the game in the way of units that the Allies can stop me at this stage. Too few troops to garrison everything and too few planes to give a positive effect to your war effort [ except for short periods of time ]. Your big guns were at Pearl and I'm guessing the biggest thing you have this far wset is the Commonwealth TF('s) and I think I sank a CA in Manila's harbor. There's nothing to be done about it by the Allies now that Force Z is gone. We could use some kind of house rule. Come up with a good house rule for this situation and we'll discuss it, comprimise on it, adopt it. What do you think?

I'm posting this from the bottom of page one.

[warspite1]

As Larry can't see this page yet I've posted by PM. Essentially I've said that we should not have any house rules as we should play the scenario out and see where it takes us.

At this early stage (and from the Allied side only) it looks like an Axis fanboy's wet dream - on current progress it will take the Japanese less than 2 months to achieve not only what it took them 6 months to do, but will have done far more - much deeper in roads into China already, the entire Solomons chain, New Caledonia, Fiji, Midway - next up Australia and/or India and/or Hawaii.

But this is early days and we need to test it as is to see what happens.

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: warspite1
Turn 1
7th December 1941

Okay so this is a big game! As I haven't got a clue what to do I'll just try and play safe and try and avoid losses where possible - unless I can delay the Japanese by hanging on.

China
The first theatre I will look at is China.

As can be seen above, the Chinese have lost over 500 infantry squads and a cursory glance at the map shows there are many more about to be swallowed up. I will have to retreat into the hinterland me thinks.

I really should read up on this theatre - I'm going to struggle with immersion here. The units mean nothing to me, I have little to no idea what I'm supposed to be doing (other than not getting mullered).

I make immediate mistakes by moving forward and getting surprised by enemy units I never realised were there. I'm largely therefore resorting to digging-in where I am and seeing what the Japanese have....

I hear a question in between your lines. The Chinese should back up into India if possible because India is a good target and China is just about to be plunged into an Allied desert for supplies. In past games the Japs have placed roadblocks on the Ledo Road and the Burma Road and the entire rest of China is out of supply. It's not really THAT bad but it does stop all operations ongoing.

The Indians are probably best used near Rangoon to halt the Japs from coming across the Quawi River and sacking Rangoon. And then marching northward to get at Calcutta.

The Allies should be sailing troops out to the smaller islands north and west of Tahiti because that's where the Japs are headed. If you get there first at least there will be a fight over it. Without BB's your carriers won't have a plane magnet to draw all the planes away from the carriers because without any other big guns present the carriers will be the priority target in a strike. I would advise you to keep your carriers together for mutual support until you get enough of them that they can form seperate groups of carriers. You're going to get a lot more ships than the Japs will ever have so you can afford to lose one or more, it's not a crisis. Don't go out of your way to lose your ships but take advantage of asymetric battles when it's to your advantage, and take advantage of opportunities to hurt the Japs without much of a risk.

So to sum up....move the Chinese to India to help the defense there. You'll get China back later and it'll be in better shape than you're leaving it. The Japs will repair the rail and all the broken bridges.

When I play the Allies side for this scenario I park the ships somewhere safe and don't move 'em until I get a bunch more ships: sometime in mid to late-'42 I think. Two more carriers and some odd ships of various types I think. If you're adventuresome you could try to make some carrier raids on some of the smaller islands as long as you retreat to safety after the shelling has stopped. The idea is to cause more damage than you receive. Play like Robin Hood, strike where he's not and retreat to fight another day when you must. It's a cat and mouse dance we are in. I want to ambush you with all my CV's present and you want to ambush me a carrier at a time ( asymetric battles ).

I'm postiung this from the bottom of page one.