The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

[pws1225]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Mindanao and some of the islands in the Philippine Archipelago area. Dan is saying he needs to keep the fleet on station for two months. Lots of potential size 9 AFs here.

+1

This makes a lot of sense.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: pws1225

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Mindanao and some of the islands in the Philippine Archipelago area. Dan is saying he needs to keep the fleet on station for two months. Lots of potential size 9 AFs here.

+1

This makes a lot of sense.

I still say he needs a corridor to get there. Truk/Yap/Ulithi/Pelelieu/Babeldaob fills the bill, possibly with landings on the NG coast like Hollandia and Manus.
No matter which vector he goes for, itsa-gonna-be-fun!

[jwolf]

John is reasserting himself offensively and it paid off handsomely today. I'll detail the lumps, but the underlying theme is whether he's focusing forward (he may not be - he may be fighting forward while attending expeditiously to his second line of defenses).

Flying Trapeze: BB Haruna leads a combat TF to Wake, sinking two DD and damaging another. I'm withdrawing the remaining TF (minesweepers) and will leave Wake to stand on its own for a few weeks. Events to come should relieve any pressure John chooses to apply here. IJN subs east of Wake sank the AO damaged yesterday and then sank another. That hurts with fuel supply and is the most significant loss of the day.

From one of Dan's very recent reports. Even at Wake, the situation appears to be "while the cat's away the mice will play." How much more so in, say, the PI region much closer to heavy Japanese assets and farther away from Allied help? I could believe Dan could move in with a big force and take some things, but could he hold, maintain, and build them up without keeping the Death Star there for the long term?

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: jwolf

John is reasserting himself offensively and it paid off handsomely today. I'll detail the lumps, but the underlying theme is whether he's focusing forward (he may not be - he may be fighting forward while attending expeditiously to his second line of defenses).

Flying Trapeze: BB Haruna leads a combat TF to Wake, sinking two DD and damaging another. I'm withdrawing the remaining TF (minesweepers) and will leave Wake to stand on its own for a few weeks. Events to come should relieve any pressure John chooses to apply here. IJN subs east of Wake sank the AO damaged yesterday and then sank another. That hurts with fuel supply and is the most significant loss of the day.

From one of Dan's very recent reports. Even at Wake, the situation appears to be "while the cat's away the mice will play." How much more so in, say, the PI region much closer to heavy Japanese assets and farther away from Allied help? I could believe Dan could move in with a big force and take some things, but could he hold, maintain, and build them up without keeping the Death Star there for the long term?

True, but Wake is an isolated island that cannot be built large. If CR gets interlocking airfields that can be built large he can leave enough LBA there to fight back. Hopefully some of them can be inland, away from naval bombardment.

[Cap Mandrake]

I seem to recall CR tricking everyone once into thinking he was going to land in the PI and then it was the Bonins instead. [:D]

If you are talking that many targets it can't be the Bonins by themselves but it could be the Bonins, the Ryukyus, Daito Shoto +/-Miyako Jima/Formosa

He reports he fears it may be too "bold"...that certainly wouldnt be the Solomons. [:)]

[Canoerebel]

10/19/43

A massively complex and interesting turn, but in details only interesting to me. IE, logistics.

Flying Trapeze: No hostile encounters today as this op winds down. KB has been sighted the past two turns close to Marcus. John has plans of his own. He is bleeding me some. But he may be missing the point. It kinda reminds me of him targeting Kodiak in his game with Herbie while the critical action is taking place in Oz.

Big Tent: The carriers arrived at Pearl today, which unleashed a massive amount of logistics and planning. First, the carriers replenished, both fuel, sorties and aircraft numbers. This isn't complete. Next, the carriers disbanded so that I could attend to repairs. None will take more than four days. I expect the Big Tent armada to sail in four or five days, much sooner than I had originally expected.

Next, loading commenced of the "major target" amphibious troops. I have enough good ships (APA, AKA, AK and LSD) to handle the assault troops for three of the five major targets. These are the most important. Loading commences today.

Troops for the other two major targets convert to Strat mode. They will load aboard xAP and xAK. They'll unload at one of the major targets, after it falls, and the combat load. These two targets are more remote, not quite as important, and don't have to be taken. But I hope the way will be clear.

The preloaded supply TFs and the just-loaded "minor target" TFs (six of those) will leave Pearl tonight. I still have to load for about six more minor targets. One of these is actually pretty important and is awaiting some additional APA and AKA returning from Wake Island op. They'll be at Pearl in a couple of days.

Bearded Lady: Turned ugly again today, as John orchestrated a nice CAP trap over Roi-Namur. I lost 59 aicraft of all kinds. But no single squadron took many losses, and so many kinds were involved that replacement will be easy.

Lion Tamer: Landing at Efate is unopposed. The base should fall tomorrow.

[Canoerebel]

I have F4U-1s available now in limited quantity. Should I swap out Hellcats for these where I can do so?

Also, confirmed today that CB Kawachi sank during the Naval Battle of Wake Island. That's icing on the cake - I wasn't expecting it. I think John gets two CB in this mod, so that further whittles his available carrier escorts.

[Canoerebel]

I haven't posted a map in awhile, so here's one showing KB and the wind-down to Operation Flying Trapeze (the invasion of Wake Island).

[ny59giants]

I have F4U-1s available now in limited quantity. Should I swap out Hellcats for these where I can do so?

My best USN fighter groups get them. I use them exclusively for CAP over my CVs as they pretty much outclass anything Japan has. I'll let my numerous Hellcats be used as Escorts and some CAP, but you will need to figure out your balance here.

[Lokasenna]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

I have F4U-1s available now in limited quantity. Should I swap out Hellcats for these where I can do so?

My best USN fighter groups get them. I use them exclusively for CAP over my CVs as they pretty much outclass anything Japan has. I'll let my numerous Hellcats be used as Escorts and some CAP, but you will need to figure out your balance here.

IMO this is how to use them.

[JohnDillworth]

His subs seem to really be beating you up. you should have plenty of dedicated ASW assets. What was escorted the AO's? Have you considered creating some ASW task forces and patrolling likely areas?

[Canoerebel]

Thanks, gents.

[BillBrown]

F4U-1 is not carrier capable. The F4U-1A is. Do not put any F4U-1s on CVs.

[Canoerebel]

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth
His subs seem to really be beating you up. you should have plenty of dedicated ASW assets. What was escorted the AO's? Have you considered creating some ASW task forces and patrolling likely areas?

There were two AOs in that TF with two ASW ships.

John's carriers have been tough lately - taking out CV Wasp, CVE Corregidor, two AOs, and some other ships. I had a fair amount of ASW assets in place, but the main problem was that the invasion of Wake Island dragged out from D-Day 1.0 to D-Day 2.0. This allowed John to vector in his subs effectively. This led to the strikes against the American carriers. Then, as all TFs were retiring to Pearl, I detached the replenishment TF to refuel a transport TF carrying the Sherman tanks home. That led to that particular debacle.

I'll have a lot more ASW available for Big Tent, as many DE and PF have recently arrived at Pearl. Too, many of those patrolling at Pearl will accompany the invasion force.

[Canoerebel]

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

F4U-1 is not carrier capable. The F4U-1A is. Do not put any F4U-1s on CVs.

Roger that, Bill. I meant the F4U-1A.

[Flicker]

Kutabare! Er, maybe Operation Ringmaster. IMO south Luzon is a fine target (major three), with Leyte and Panay the other two. Lots of potential level 9 airfields. The 12 minor targets could be Mindanao and north Luzon. Whatever the targets are, IMO Death Star needs to be able to cover most of the targets with little movement.

I also considered Rabaul and the Solomons, but that doesn't seem bold enough and with the targets CR has eliminated there don't seem to be enough major targets. There's a chance CR may go for Hokkaido and the Kuriles, but the operation would also face General Fuyu.

[Canoerebel]

A Recapitulation of Operations Thin Man and Flying Trapeze, August 13, 1943 to October 19, 1943: These two operations were actually one operation that resulted in a decisive Allied victory.

The Allied carriers departed Pearl Harbor on August 13, 1943. They wouldn't return home for nearly 70 days. The first mission was Operation Thin Man, meant to secure the Marshalls (by delivering supply), retrieve overstacked units, invade Kwajalein and Roi-Namur, and seek favorable conditions to give battle to enemy combat ships or carriers. It took awhile, but eventually the first two objectives were accomplished. Then the Allies invaded Kwaj, getting embroiled in a tough battle that is ongoing.

Several IJN BBs were damaged near the Marshalls and a CV took a torp, thus weakening Steroid KB a bit. Then John flexed his muscles and sent Mini KB on a circuitous ride around Death Star and the Allied islands. While this was happening, the Allied combat ships and carriers replenished fuel, ammo and sorties at Jaluit Island, taking about a week to complete the process.

In mid September, John sent Steroid KB and Mini KB from Wake Island to the vicinity of Johnston Island on a raid that failed to draw meaningful blood. Steroid KB then retired in full view, while replenished Death Star, undetected, moved north to engage. The resulting Naval Battle of Wake Island resulted in heavy losses for the enemy. The Allies lost a few DD. CVs Hornet and Enterprise took minor damage. Several Allied BBs also suffered damage during this battle (and earlier in the campaign).

With KB neutralized, I expedited the invasion of Wake Island (Operation Flying Trapeze). D-Day 1.0 resulted in a stalemate requiring an eventual 2.0. In the meantime, bombardment TFs shuttled back and forth between Midway and Wake to replenish; during this interval, a sub sank BB Nevada; then Death Star moved SE briefly to escort in a TF carrying reinforcements. D-Day 2.0 resulted in the capture of Wake Island. But the delay allowed John to effectively vector in his subs, which sank CV Wasp and CVE Corregidor.

The Allies then withdrew the overstacked units and began retiring to Pearl Harbor. John's subs picked off several more ships (including two AO) during this phase.

Death Star finally returned home on October 19. The ships are in such good shape (excepting the losses of the carriers) that Death Star will return to sea in four or five days to take part in Operation Big Tent.

What the Allies achieved: securing the Marshalls and taking Wake Island, which opens a large part of CenPac to future Allied operations.

Japanese ship losses (not including very small fry):

CV - 3
CVL - 3
CVE - 8
CB - 1
CL - 3
DD - 14
PB - 1
E- 2
SS - 7
AV - 1
xAK - 13
xAKL - 1
CM - 1
SC - 5

Allied ship losses (not including PT and YMS):

CV - 1
CVE - 1
BB - 1
DD - 6
DE - 1
SS - 1
AO - 3
AMC - 1
APD - 7
AK - 1
xAP - 2
xAK - 5

Air losses were heavy on both sides.

You can see why, overall, I'm pleased with the outcome of these two operations. While John's subs have been active and effective, Allied losses have been modest. In comparison, John blunted his spearhead badly, the balance of power shifted markedly, and the Allies are now in a position to prosecute the war.

[Mike McCreery]

Not to be a debbie downer but I believe that the majority of the losses were due to what john did wrong and your capitalizing on it rather than what you did right.

[Canoerebel]

Part of doing things right is knowing what your opponent is likely to do wrong.

But the recapitulation wasn't intended to say who played better, but rather describe what happened.

[Mike McCreery]

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Part of doing things right is knowing what your opponent is likely to do wrong.

But the recapitulation wasn't intended to say who played better, but rather describe what happened.

What is your opponent likely to do wrong in this next series of battles and what do you plan to do to take advantage of it?