Sneer vs Raver , Banzaiiii!!!!

[veji1]

I keep the Kongos with KB usually o ruse them for bombardment, but never send them on "dangerous" surface missions...

Well, one CVL and BB for 5CVS and 7 or 8 BBs is a fair trade.....

[Sneer]

battle is over - proboably there will be little to report in next few days
i sunk CL St louis near palmyra but did not entered its strike range
no more targets reported - time to refuel and rearm
as for dmg report - ships are safe so i can publish it
Akagi 51/36 - stable and i doubt there will be any big problem here
Hiyo 38/8
Taiyo 31/0
Musashi 64/13 - for the amount of punishment received i'm impressed her condition is as good
Kongo 80/82 - it is critical as last turn it was 86 flood
Naka and 2 DD in 40 sys range
sth like 280-300 pilots lost -  mostly from kates (over 100) and vals (almost 100)

enemy losses
5CV+1CVE
3 fast BB +6slow BB
1CA +2CL
600-650 planes estimated
many ships are damaged and i think 1-2 BB and 3-4 cruisers + Hornet will have to work a lot in order to reach West coast

[Mark VII]

I think it is time to stick Raver with a fork as he is done![X(][X(][X(] 
 

ORIGINAL: Sneer

battle is over - proboably there will be little to report in next few days
i sunk CL St louis near palmyra but did not entered its strike range
no more targets reported - time to refuel and rearm
as for dmg report - ships are safe so i can publish it
Akagi 51/36 - stable and i doubt there will be any big problem here
Hiyo 38/8
Taiyo 31/0
Musashi 64/13 - for the amount of punishment received i'm impressed her condition is as good
Kongo 80/82 - it is critical as last turn it was 86 flood
Naka and 2 DD in 40 sys range
sth like 280-300 pilots lost -  mostly from kates (over 100) and vals (almost 100)

enemy losses
5CV+1CVE
3 fast BB +6slow BB
1CA +2CL
600-650 planes estimated
many ships are damaged and i think 1-2 BB and 3-4 cruisers + Hornet will have to work a lot in order to reach West coast

[Nemo121]

Yeah, describing those losses as merely devastating is to fail to do them justice.

As I read it this strike pretty much condemns the Allied player to the defensive for the next 6 to 8 months, correct?

Have you any plans to exloit this with new offensives in 4 to 5 months time?

[Sneer]

early 43 is far too late to be on serious offensive
enemy can spend few hundreds LBA without hesitation
and all targets are well garrisoned and fortified
i need to finish Chungking
there is little problem with lowering forts even if i gathered almost whole china army there
+ secure India with additional troops
+ send few big units to southern dei an salomons as i expect Raver's activity there sooner or later
as far as naval activity - shared AAR prevents from wide disscussion but options are rather limited - with all planes back at KB I can visit almost every base Raver has excpt continental ones and PH

[ADavidB]

ORIGINAL: Sneer

not a problem Jumper and certainly no offence
i wanted only to show that
1. players don't use b17 historically so their search ability is lower - almost always B17 are kept together and in permanent attack mode
2. there is good way of fooling catalinas - they will always spot you when too late - when you are facing whole KB 4 hexes from your base and see your ships hit by torps - range of catalinas is too low to secure frontline bases - emilys are worth their weight in gold
3. players rarely try to play with enemy search abilities - and this part of play is my favourite one - to be in the place nobody wanted me to see

if sb looses one of central pacific atolls his search line is broken so extreme cautious should be taken  as enemy can enter deep ocean without warning
allied won midway because they surprised their enemies- search ability was on their side

 
That's so true. The one time that I've gotten in trouble against Treespider was when I sent a carrier into an area where I had no search planes. Fortunately for me, Treespider did the same thing! [&o]
 
My B-17s find more ships and subs than anything else I have...
 
Dave Baranyi

[BrucePowers]

Well, once again I learn something new.  I will be a little more careful with B-17s now.  They make lousy ship killers anyway (in my opinion).

[ADavidB]

ORIGINAL: BrucePowers

Well, once again I learn something new.  I will be a little more careful with B-17s now.  They make lousy ship killers anyway (in my opinion).

 
I almost never use 4E bombers for ship hunting unless I am totally desparate. I use them exclusively for search until there are some important Japanese bases well within range that need to be bombed. Remember, using 4Es at extreme range causes unacceptable ops losses, fatigue gain and morale drop, all of which translate into weaker attacks the next time. On the other hand, using 4Es at relatively short ranges against airbases, particularly with decent escorts, is "nirvana" for an Allied player. So save the "big boys" for the important stuff and use your 2E bombers for ship hunting.
 
Good luck -
 
Dave Baranyi

[Sneer]

truth is that allied catalinas can spot fast enough invasion transport or bombardment run but are useless as warning against Japan Carrier force

[1275psi]

What a magnificent victory
You give all 1943 japanese players hope -and all allied players who have not dealt KB a blow -a reason to pause.
 
Well done!

[Sneer]

Good side of this battle is that there is good chance for good 44y battles
it is even possible to see shindens and reppus in greater numbers - there are so little AARs from 45 and 42 y is little boring to me to read
Raverdave will certainly give good fight and even next such massacre will not turn the tide of war - what is rather not probable
and now there is possible to see something not conventional as I doubt Allies can wast next 6 months waiting for carriers. - my bet is Darwin area will be exploited by Raver - and this region is 1st on list to reinforce
second bet India land campaign - i think within 6 months we will see fight there
third bet Salomons- however that would be risky
Aleutians/kuriles can be thrown away as I doubt Raver will move with so weakened navy
Certainly from readers point's of view this outcome is better[:D] and I think even Raverdave ( when he cools down) will be glad we have chance to play sth original instead of pure logistical task of taking all my bases. This game starts to be interesting now
 

[veji1]

yup, I am betting on a very tough an parallel campagn in India and Darwin-Timor.

What will Raver do ? Now that he can't destroy you navy airforce until late in the war, he will do his best to destroy the IJAAF, going on a bombing campaign from Darwin is good, but with so few navy, you could pay him a visit with all KB and BBs and blast the hell out of northern OZ... So he will probably try to go for India... There you must play a Verdun kind of Defense : Dig in and hold... and try not to waist your IJAF fighters. To bad allies can know beforehand the whereabouts of jap planes thanks to the airbalance number... And prepare Burma, because in 1944, this is where the fight we'll continue

[Sneer]

everything is ready - there are little bases which are not lvl 9 now and little 2nd line bases that are not at 6-7 - even rear area is usually at lvl3
Inidia would be good but i doubt Raverdave wants to attract attention from my china army - soon there should be no enemy there and then i will feel free to move troops anywhere i want.

[Andy Mac]

The RN is pretty much intact........
 
The R class BB's are actually tougher than their stats indicate the 15" gun is pretty powerfull and F4U's are not far away !!!!
 
I really dont think that an attack on North Aus is worth the price

[veji1]

The idea isn't attacking Northern OZ now, just that Raver might not want to over committ there for the next months with the threat of KB and the battleline paying a visit...

Although as Sneer said regarding India, once and if China is toasted, he'll have lots of LCUs to use there...

So really it is a very complicated situation because I can't see where Raver could go on a big offensive... He will probably just go on an bombing spree from India and Darwin trying to destroy all ressources, Oil and HI that are reachable with escorts... But that's about it...

So you might actually be looking at 6 calms months, execpt on secondary fronts such as the ASW war... Except putting all possible hurt on the IJAAF, I can't really see what he could do that would be strategically significant...

[Sneer]

Raver will think sth out of it
I have strong belief in his abilities

[Capt. Harlock]

My apologies for not replying sooner -- a busy Memorial Day weekend. Okay, I need to modify my post about luck. Sneer's techniques for dealing with search ranges are clever indeed, and prove the saying that luck is most useful to those who are prepared for it. I would like to point out, however, that weather is largely controlled by chance, and any moves depending on weather are almost by definition depending on luck.
 
One observation: if Sneer can sail to within 10 hexes of Palmyra and not be detected, is it possible there is an error in the search code? (It wouldn't be the first time: in the old "Bomb Alley" game, a base which launched surface and submarine search found its range limited to that of the sub searching planes.)

[veji1]

well I don't think so, You cannot expect 9 catalinas to find any TF in a range of 800 miles...

As Sneer and David put it before, allied players don't have many patrol and recon aircrafts, and they forget that this is because IRL the allies used bombers to do lots of Recon... Maybe had Raver B17s doing some nav search as well he would have had 1 turn to get ready to fight, we'll never know but it really seems logical to me that sometimes you can be surprised because your patrol planes didn't see the ennemy approaching... happened before..

[Raverdave]

Hello all,
 
worst luck I am away interstate with work, and what was to be an overnighter has turned into a real dog of a time.  Currently I'm stuck in Sydney (for the second night in a row[:@]) but am departing this "fair" city for the delights of Canberra tomorrow, with hopes of being home Friday night.
 
I have been reading all that has been posted and never fear, Raver will return for this harsh blow to create a number of "new" reefs made from the ships of the IJN. 
 
The USN is in such a sate that offensive ops will not take place for at least 8 to 12 months so if anything sneer has simply extended this game to 1946.............all the better for me.
 
Congress has approved the building of 100 new carriers so things will start to look very grim indeed for our old friend Mr Sneer.
 
The RN carriers have come out of this mess looking rather good and a quick refit in port will have them back in fighting trim within two months...........I REALLY like these RN carriers and once they are fitted with some halfway decent planes they will do very well.  Having seem the extent of damage that I did to at least some of Sneers fleet I am a little more happy.....with the fog of war it seemed as if I have barely scratched him.
 
That all for now.
 
Raverdave

[invernomuto]

ORIGINAL: Sneer

battle is over - proboably there will be little to report in next few days
i sunk CL St louis near palmyra but did not entered its strike range
no more targets reported - time to refuel and rearm
as for dmg report - ships are safe so i can publish it
Akagi 51/36 - stable and i doubt there will be any big problem here
Hiyo 38/8
Taiyo 31/0
Musashi 64/13 - for the amount of punishment received i'm impressed her condition is as good
Kongo 80/82 - it is critical as last turn it was 86 flood
Naka and 2 DD in 40 sys range
sth like 280-300 pilots lost -  mostly from kates (over 100) and vals (almost 100)

enemy losses
5CV+1CVE
3 fast BB +6slow BB
1CA +2CL
600-650 planes estimated
many ships are damaged and i think 1-2 BB and 3-4 cruisers + Hornet will have to work a lot in order to reach West coast

Outstanding results!

Kudos!!!

[&o][&o][&o][&o][&o][&o][&o][&o][&o][&o][&o]