ALLIED ONLY: aztez (A) vs erstad (J) ...2nd ROUND

[crsutton]

ORIGINAL: Smeulders

ORIGINAL: Rob Brennan UK

I would love to flank him here but I doubt I have enough forces. As said in previous post those 3 units are propably worth of 700-1000av infantry. With the terrain bonus I would need 2500-3000av worth of infantry to succesfully do this move. I don't see an point doing this unless I'am sure I can actually do the job.

Actually you need a heck of a lot less than that ..why ?

Consider how supply works , can trace in or out of a contested hex but not through one.

So all you really need to do is occupy the hexes feeding his big troop blocks and voila , no supply gets through. he has to kick you out of there not the other way round. Many WitP japanese agressors fail to understand this (or forget) and china can really hurt japan by doing this.

The next huge bonus to this is the downfall of anyone who has all thier eggs in one big agressive stack (aka land death star) . Land movement system works similarly to supply i.e cant move from one contested to another. Therefore he cant just pull out a few divs from sian to open his supply lines again. So unless he has more uncomitted combat units closeby he can't supply sian , you bombard it for as long as poss and when hes really suffereing attack back. end of problem in china !

I;m sure it wont be as simple as that in practise as i've crucified at least 2 japanese players in china in WitP by doing this (they upped sticks and never contacted me again sadly ) .

So unless AE has changed ground rules fundamentally this should still be possible. I was going to wait and do this vs LoBaron [:D] but i feel you could do with a potential winning plan in china [;)]... Bang goes my secret china strategy .. whoops.

Actually now that hex ownership isn't 'remembered' by the computer , split up a corps or 2 and surround sian so he has no way out(war torn batered ones will do just fine ) , all else can be thown into a wooded roadblock so he has the x3 penaly to face, not you.

Who knows , you may be on the verge of a stunning victory here , OR i just lost you the war in china .. either way its fun to watch [;)]

I'm afraid you're incorrect, at the very least concerning the movement off troops, as long as he controls the hex-side leading from Siam to the South, he will be able to bring back divisions to break up any blocking troops, I also suspect he'll be able to trace his supply through the hex as long as he controls both hexsides leading along the road.

Aztez, how good is the recon you have on those three units guarding the road ? He has an awful lot of good troops in Siam, so maybe those left are of lesser quality (Have the two units that got beaten out of Siam retreated further that you know off) ? On the other hand, you said you opponent is pretty careful, if so he won't be using Chinese units to guard important hexes. You could go and have a look with one weak corps though, if he sees the arrow going to his rear, he might just pull back some troops for extra security, if not, well Chinese troops are expendable.

Yes, you must now click on the "w" key and look at the color of the hexsides. This is important if it your color-green for Allies, troops and supply can move.

[LoBaron]

Aztez maybe this could be the time to really start thinking about a counter in CentPac!

If you are able to coordinate your attack with his invasion of NZ this could make the situation very interesting
at least.
For NZ he needs a large number of troops, the KB because he needs to screen the landings and maybe provide initial ground
support and probably every AK and AP thats servicable in the area.
If you are able to time your attack with maybe day 3 or 4 of his landings where he is fully committed he would have very difficult
choices to make and probably could not handle both tasks.

This could have high chances of success. How far is your counterattack plan? It might even be worth it to at least do it on a smaller
scale as you first planned if you still lack the time and the assets to go as planned.

[aztez]

crsutton: That is an good trick and I have been hitting that "key" few times lately.

LoBaron: I know it would be optium time to land in the north or in cenpac.

Unfortunately I do not have the troops to pull this off. Well, I could land somewhere but that would rip off my defensive perimeter and he could let me "have it" and in meantime take NZ and after that hit somewhere else.

I have troops incoming to the frontlines daily but a lot of them enter the map at Eastern US base from where they need to get into west coast cities.

We do think much alike since counter invasion would to some good but I doubt it would do any good in the longrun. I already lost some +500av worth of solid infantry at Pago Pago.

I checked and I could bring together maybe 1000av worth of units but to me that is not enough. Not nearly enough if that leaves some bases exposed.

That is my honest evaluation of my strenghts at the moment.

[LoBaron]

Too bad but naturally you have a much better asessment of your current capabilities.
i guess youre right. Well...if it isnt NZ then maybe on the next opportunity after it. [;)]

[aztez]

LoBaron: Maybe. I could send you the save with password if you want to take a look what happening. PM if intrested.

Allthough I think 1000av is what I could muster without compromising too much elsewhere. The allied positions are still somewhat vulnerable allthough things are looking up.

The basic concept you mentioned is what I'am looking for though.

[jrlans]

What are you going to do about NZ? Do you have the PP and ships to try a quick evacuation of key units, or are you going to try to fight it out and hopefully get some benifit from the resitance. Personaly without fighters or bombers i think NZ will prety much be uncontestable. Im sure dave will land with overwhelming force as he has everywhere else. If you do try to pull out units whats your priority combat or eng?

[Rob Brennan UK]

Regarding NZ ,, there are quite a lot of troops there and all in restricted HQ's .. if you have the PP's and dont want to risk front line american or australian troops. How about switching the combat formations on south island to non restricted NZ command and shipping them to North Island. He's v v v unlikely to invade south island 1st and this gives you some more AV at no additional risk as if N island falls , south cannot possibly stand alone so might as well make north island as much as a bastion as you can.

PS you can safely base figheters here for defence , just make sure to disband/withdraw before you lose the last plane or get overrun , you'll get the groups back this way.

[Sardaukar]

Remember also, that you get these troops, if he sets a foot on NZ:

NZ
1x INF DIV (this is the veteran NZ division from Europe, should be at least as good as  6th and 7th AUS Div), arrives in Aden
3x inf bde
2x tank bde
1x cav regt
1x inf bn

Those units in bold arrive in NZ...that is basically 2 div worth right there.


I wonder if your opponent has read that you get extra troops if he invades NZ. I think In WitP one did not.

[LoBaron]

Aztez: pm sent.
 
I slept over the CentPac/NZ situation btw. and on second thought don´t do it now.
 
Theres a couple of reasons against using the counter strategy right now:
 
- if you do not have the forces to go in and stay (at least for a while) or even to accomplish half of your initial plan you
  may produce a situation the Japanese can easily ignore at least for some time and then hit back at their own discretion.
  If i was playing Japan and involved in a Big Hit like attacking NZ id ignore everything thats not remotely close to life threatening
  until things at NZ are under control.
 
- it draws ressources from a similar later counter that could have more effect because your forces are ready then.
 
- the strategical gains would be less or minimal if in case of victory you cant at least endanger the supply routes to the south or hold a staging
  point for future invasions and it looks like one or two islands is simply not enough for this.
 
- you give away information to your opponent that you a planning for situations like this. (i guess he knows this can happen but theres no need to point his
  nose to it and looking on his skills and careful planning i guess repeating that adventure would be much harder than the initial plan.
 
i wonder what the others think about this but this time maybe its better if "NZ can take it" [;)]
 
I like Robs idea of concentrating on the northern island, not sure if you got the shipping in the area to do it in time though...

[cfulbright]

BTW, here is another ground combat tip for you that you may already know. If you get a stack of units locked into combat in a hex and the odds were in your favor or about even but as a result of the combat you have some units with high disruption, then you can put some (no more than about 20%) of your units into reserve (no pursuit) and they will recover from the disruption much faster. Your enemy can't see when you do this so as long as you leave enough units in combat mode this is a fairly safe gambit. Often one or two units will take the brunt of the disruption in a combat. If you set that one unit to reserve it will pull down the disruption very fast. Often I will do this one unit at a time, often leaving the artillery units to bombard, and cycle which units are in reserve over a few turns to get them all down to low disruption quickly. If you are doing this and your opponent is not doing it, you can often recover from disruption much quicker than he and launch an attack with better chances of success while he still has many units disrupted.

Aha! I've putting troops into "Reserve [Pursuit]" and they haven't seemed to recover much faster than those in Combat. Now I know.

[aztez]

Just got off from work and thankfully it is friday. I did the turn already and send it back to Dave.

No situation updates tonight. I will post an 4 day update once the next turn arrives.

Also I will try to do some offensive maps that I promised. It has been so busy in past few days that really haven't had time to do it.

Thankfully it is weekend!

jrlans: That is the million dollar question. The way I see thing I do have three separate options:

a) I could bring in some extra infantry from Fiji area via evacuation. That would bolster the defenses in NZ. I did actually send in an transport TF this turn just in case I deciede to go through with this option.

b) I'am already sending in troops from southern island into main island (Wellington + Auckland) so I'am short of PP at the moment.

c) Let him have the island and concentrate my efforts elsewhere.

One thing I'am not doing is to evacuate NZ. Too risky and far too expensive in terms of PP. IF I would go through with this than the focus would be on armoured and infantry units. You do get decent amount of engineers from west coast area. That is not the problem but infantry units can be.

Rob: I'am doing just that. At the moment NZ Brigade is moving towards Wellington. That extra 80av there.

The south islands are secondary targets and I doubt he is coming after them as you stated.

I would put the fighter sceme in operation here you described unfortunately I seriously have shortage of them at the moment.

Sardaukar: I didn't know those would amount to 600av worth of infantry. Thanks for information. I thought they would add up to maybe 300av.

I wish he is unaware of this but knowing him that is not an option. He most definately knows about these troops and it is somewhat scary to think that this does not affect his offensive operations at all.

LoBaron: Exactly. If I go into any crazy offensives now it will only serve as temporary help and in end accomplish nothing significant. Basically these troops become next juicy target for him and by massing up his forces he can overwhelm them due to the early nature of this game.

Also as you said I don't want to tip out my hand just yet. It might relieve pressure in the southern areas but that might not be desirable in the longterm. There are other routes one can take towards japan if wanted.

NZ will have to suck it up and fight. I can take this back later on IF I choose to do so. I looked and as said above the map doesn't necessarily need any southern allied offensives at all.

cfulbright: That is an neat trick. I have used the reserve orders very cautiously in the AE. Due to the fact that it is not described very clearly on the manual.

[Sardaukar]

I don't know if those NZ reinforcements are at full strength, but they are substantial anyway.

[Swenslim]

Aztez, try to send more subs into Truk area, after his KB jorneys he is low on fuel and need to ressuply it very much - 200 000 tons of fuel definitly.

[jrlans]

Actualy I think I would mass my subs around tulagi, and Noumea as that seems to be the jumping off point of the NZ invasion. If you can sink a couple transports enroute via subs you will disrupt his landing prety significantly. Every soilder killed at sea is one you dont have to kill on land.

[cfulbright]

Just because he's set a unit's target to NZ doesn't mean he's really going there. Seydlitz or someone else earlier in this thread was talking about doing this as the Allied player of setting Marcus Is. as the target, but never actually invading.

[jrlans]

Well i think most everyone is going under the assumption, because its the next logical step. Even if there is no NZ invasion, there would still probably be a fair amount of shipping in the area both consilidating and preping for the eventual invasion of Fiji. So I still think it is tacticaly sound to concentrate some subs (maybe the S boats if you could get them there) in the area.

[aztez]

We managed to do few "quick turns" last night. The month of may is almost over.

Sardaukar: Yeah, these troops most definately are useful if/when situation arises.

Swenslim: I think it is too late to swamp Truk area since the next invasion is already in motion. (see pic below) Btw, that is intresting total. You saying it will take 200 000 fuel points to conduct large scale carrier operations? That is intresting.

jrlans: I think New Caledonia / Fiji are is main area for the submarines. We spotted the enemy invasion forces and it seems Fiji will be next target. This means NZ will be assaulted once this threat is dealt with.

Only problem with the above is that my main submarine fleet is elsewhere.

At least we shall see some action again.

cfullbright: No, it doesn't. You are absolutely. By setting up prepare for base ie. San Francisco.. well that intel could be related into allied signit.

That function is one way to give out false intel also but with AE it seems that you really need those prep points or you will suffer badly on the initial landings.

[aztez]

China (may 22nd - 27th 1942)


There has been several ground assaults agains Sian. Chinese forces has been able to repulse every single assault allthough we have lost few fort levels.

Ground combat at Sian (83,41) / may 24th 1942

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 160980 troops, 1311 guns, 485 vehicles, Assault Value = 4286

Defending force 106074 troops, 713 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2652

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 3

Japanese adjusted assault: 1273

Allied adjusted defense: 3127

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 3)

Combat modifiers
Defender: forts(+), leaders(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
15552 casualties reported
Squads: 45 destroyed, 459 disabled
Non Combat: 44 destroyed, 757 disabled
Engineers: 34 destroyed, 67 disabled
Vehicles lost 74 (3 destroyed, 71 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
12761 casualties reported
Squads: 75 destroyed, 360 disabled
Non Combat: 238 destroyed, 261 disabled
Engineers: 26 destroyed, 25 disabled
Guns lost 49 (34 destroyed, 15 disabled)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Sian (83,41) / may 26th 1942

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 153653 troops, 1319 guns, 653 vehicles, Assault Value = 3794

Defending force 98997 troops, 624 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2346

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 2

Japanese adjusted assault: 2166

Allied adjusted defense: 2003

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 2)

Japanese Assault reduces fortifications to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: experience(-)
Attacker: disruption(-)

Japanese ground losses:
13763 casualties reported
Squads: 97 destroyed, 400 disabled
Non Combat: 80 destroyed, 796 disabled
Engineers: 17 destroyed, 34 disabled
Guns lost 2 (0 destroyed, 2 disabled)
Vehicles lost 80 (6 destroyed, 74 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
8763 casualties reported
Squads: 35 destroyed, 637 disabled
Non Combat: 30 destroyed, 414 disabled
Engineers: 8 destroyed, 15 disabled
Guns lost 20 (12 destroyed, 8 disabled)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Sian (83,41) / may 27th 1942

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 142413 troops, 1319 guns, 647 vehicles, Assault Value = 3169

Defending force 96193 troops, 626 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2049

Japanese adjusted assault: 901

Allied adjusted defense: 1390

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 2)

Combat modifiers
Defender: disruption(-), experience(-)
Attacker: disruption(-)

Japanese ground losses:
11402 casualties reported
Squads: 57 destroyed, 566 disabled
Non Combat: 81 destroyed, 360 disabled
Engineers: 22 destroyed, 46 disabled
Guns lost 1 (0 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Vehicles lost 68 (21 destroyed, 47 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
9370 casualties reported
Squads: 148 destroyed, 256 disabled
Non Combat: 129 destroyed, 391 disabled
Engineers: 5 destroyed, 17 disabled
Guns lost 9 (2 destroyed, 7 disabled)


These battles add up to already horrific losses suffered before. I wonder how long can he keep these up.

I'am moving some fresh units into area in order to scope with these battles. These troops are still few days off.

AVG was withdrawn since it really was utterly depleted and served no purpose at that battle condition.

Chinese P43A Lancers made their debut. It didn't go all as planned since the loss ratio was 3:1 in japanese favour.

[aztez]

Fiji (may 22nd . 27th 1942)


The pic speaks volumes and the next invasion is about to begin.

These enemy ships were spotted by our bombers flying naval search missions on may 26th.

It really is obvious that this invasion is carrier covered since I lost 4 Hudsons on these search missions.

The intel is still a bit vague but it seems he has maybe 6-10 separate TF's moving towards Fiji.

I have upped P40E's into 70% CAP while P39D's are set on 20% and the main mission as navalstrikes at 9000 feet.

More news from here once the turn arrives.

[Sardaukar]

I'd drop P39s in Naval Attack to 6k, this is in my experience most useful height for bombers other than dive bombers. 

Not to mention, this will be interesting! [8D]