Moved to another Patch 06 - Public Beta - Build 1108p3 updated 10 July

[michaelm75au]

Here is the latest DLL.

It should be able to read pre-beta and current beta saves.

Unzip and copy it to the Tracker directory (where witptracker.jar is located).

[berto]

ORIGINAL: michaelm

Hurry up with the patch 6 release so I can stop !!!![:'(]

But isn't it your call to say "when"?

[McSeem]

Michael,

Thank you!!!

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: berto

ORIGINAL: michaelm

Hurry up with the patch 6 release so I can stop !!!![:'(]

But isn't it your call to say "when"?

Pretty sure Michael is part of a team, and if I understand the politics correctly Matrix has input on the "official" patch releases. Me? I'm quite happy with the public beta. I'm testing with m6 and playing with the last k. working great. Getting the benefit of the improvements into my game with almost no risk.

I'm all about letting Michael do all the fixes/improvements he wants. I know he's working from a LONG list. Hoping that some UI items will float up to the top of his list.

Like: wouldn't it be nce if the "all" commands for units only affected the filtered units instead of all units in the hex? Like in "all" move to a destination or "all" set the new prep location? I know when I have big stacks, it is a lot of clicking to set them to move and then go through to reset the ones I want to stay. Can't think of how many times I want to move all of the units except most of the ENG units after a big battle. Could filter the ENG out, set the move destination for all the others, then set the few ENG units to move individually. Save me a lot of clicks. Ditto on prepping units for destination. I want the ENG unit to retain it's current location, but set all the other units to prep for a new dest. Have to manually do each one or I lose the prep already accumulated for the ENG unit in the stack.

Game breaker? Not hardly. Would it save a few thousand clicks in a game? Yep. Improve my REALLY poor turn cycle time? Oh yeah.

Anyway, as I say, some UI items. I'm sure everyone else has at least one they would like to see that everyone would benefit from.

[asdicus]

ORIGINAL: asdicus

Did you have save from before Pakhoi became your main supply hub??[:D]

[/quote]
michaelm I have save games available going all the way back to the start of my latest pbm game. The game is now is April 1942 and china has more supplies than I know what to do with ! I have even turned on industry repair at Chungking and Changsha. I have never had to ship any supplies by sea from india to rangoon - they all move by land. The supplies in china are moving by land either from burma and/or india (via Pakhoi ??). I think this problem arises because the allies hold burma and this is allowing supplies to flow in large amounts to china.
This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.





[/quote]
michaelm have you had chance to look at these save files regarding the excess flows of supply by land into burma and china ? My pbm game is now up to june 1942 and my jap opponent is pretty cross about the amount of supply the chinese have available ! I can't stop the supply flow into china but we have agreed some houserules to restrict the allies ops in china. I am sure the problem arises because the allies hold burma/rangoon hence many pbm games do not have this problem. If you look at the yellow dots supply from rangoon can easily reach into mid china via the tracks. Are you/the developers sure that supply should flow so easily and in such large quantities for long distances along tracks or through jungle/mountain terrain ?
If you like any more save files please let me know. Currently running 1108m5 beta.

[mikkey]

excellent support michaelm, thanks!

[michaelm75au]

ORIGINAL: asdicus

ORIGINAL: asdicus

Did you have save from before Pakhoi became your main supply hub??[:D]

michaelm I have save games available going all the way back to the start of my latest pbm game. The game is now is April 1942 and china has more supplies than I know what to do with ! I have even turned on industry repair at Chungking and Changsha. I have never had to ship any supplies by sea from india to rangoon - they all move by land. The supplies in china are moving by land either from burma and/or india (via Pakhoi ??). I think this problem arises because the allies hold burma and this is allowing supplies to flow in large amounts to china.
This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.




michaelm have you had chance to look at these save files regarding the excess flows of supply by land into burma and china ? My pbm game is now up to june 1942 and my jap opponent is pretty cross about the amount of supply the chinese have available ! I can't stop the supply flow into china but we have agreed some houserules to restrict the allies ops in china. I am sure the problem arises because the allies hold burma/rangoon hence many pbm games do not have this problem. If you look at the yellow dots supply from rangoon can easily reach into mid china via the tracks. Are you/the developers sure that supply should flow so easily and in such large quantities for long distances along tracks or through jungle/mountain terrain ?
If you like any more save files please let me know. Currently running 1108m5 beta.

[/quote]
Did I miss the saves??
The last few betas revised the way that resoure/supply flowed, so as limit the daily movement.
I think from memory, the supply state in China was already high before you moved to those betas. If there isn't anywhere for the supply in China to go, which could be the case now with revised flow, then it will most likely stay in China.
If you want to add a current save or two, I can produce the base flow stats again to see where it is being pulled/pushed to.

I must have missed this one. Can you repost??

This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.

[asdicus]

ORIGINAL: michaelm

ORIGINAL: asdicus



Did you have save from before Pakhoi became your main supply hub??[:D]

michaelm I have save games available going all the way back to the start of my latest pbm game. The game is now is April 1942 and china has more supplies than I know what to do with ! I have even turned on industry repair at Chungking and Changsha. I have never had to ship any supplies by sea from india to rangoon - they all move by land. The supplies in china are moving by land either from burma and/or india (via Pakhoi ??). I think this problem arises because the allies hold burma and this is allowing supplies to flow in large amounts to china.
This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.




michaelm have you had chance to look at these save files regarding the excess flows of supply by land into burma and china ? My pbm game is now up to june 1942 and my jap opponent is pretty cross about the amount of supply the chinese have available ! I can't stop the supply flow into china but we have agreed some houserules to restrict the allies ops in china. I am sure the problem arises because the allies hold burma/rangoon hence many pbm games do not have this problem. If you look at the yellow dots supply from rangoon can easily reach into mid china via the tracks. Are you/the developers sure that supply should flow so easily and in such large quantities for long distances along tracks or through jungle/mountain terrain ?
If you like any more save files please let me know. Currently running 1108m5 beta.

Did I miss the saves??
The last few betas revised the way that resoure/supply flowed, so as limit the daily movement.
I think from memory, the supply state in China was already high before you moved to those betas. If there isn't anywhere for the supply in China to go, which could be the case now with revised flow, then it will most likely stay in China.
If you want to add a current save or two, I can produce the base flow stats again to see where it is being pulled/pushed to.

I must have missed this one. Can you repost??

This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.

[/quote]
michaelm this save is from 4 march 1942

[asdicus]

michaelm this save is from 13 march 1942. If you want any more recent saves please let me know. The pbm game is now at 26 june 1942.

[Nemo121]

m6:

This appears to have messed with upgrade/downgrade paths for planes.

E.g. With the Ohka Models ( 11, 22 and 23 ) If I upgrade Model 11 to 22 then I can still upgrade it to Model 23 but cannot downgrade it back to Model 11. Previously this worked fine. I can provide a save if this is a new issue.

[michaelm75au]

No changes to aircraft paths in m6. last change was back in 1108m (added ability to see groups of nations ie Commonwealth)

Post the save.
Always chance I changed one thing, and something else gets affected.

[m10bob]

Since nobody else has reported this issue, it is possible it is not a problem, except for me..After applying the latest patch, my political points has stayed at "0" for the last 4 game days..I had near 3000 just prior to the patch.
I had 2 subs past their withdrawal time, costing me 10 points each per day, but it was being watched carefully.
I wonder if their very existance created the problem for me ref those political points being zipped out?

[michaelm75au]

ORIGINAL: asdicus

ORIGINAL: michaelm

michaelm I have save games available going all the way back to the start of my latest pbm game. The game is now is April 1942 and china has more supplies than I know what to do with ! I have even turned on industry repair at Chungking and Changsha. I have never had to ship any supplies by sea from india to rangoon - they all move by land. The supplies in china are moving by land either from burma and/or india (via Pakhoi ??). I think this problem arises because the allies hold burma and this is allowing supplies to flow in large amounts to china.
This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.

michaelm have you had chance to look at these save files regarding the excess flows of supply by land into burma and china ? My pbm game is now up to june 1942 and my jap opponent is pretty cross about the amount of supply the chinese have available ! I can't stop the supply flow into china but we have agreed some houserules to restrict the allies ops in china. I am sure the problem arises because the allies hold burma/rangoon hence many pbm games do not have this problem. If you look at the yellow dots supply from rangoon can easily reach into mid china via the tracks. Are you/the developers sure that supply should flow so easily and in such large quantities for long distances along tracks or through jungle/mountain terrain ?
If you like any more save files please let me know. Currently running 1108m5 beta.

Did I miss the saves??
The last few betas revised the way that resoure/supply flowed, so as limit the daily movement.
I think from memory, the supply state in China was already high before you moved to those betas. If there isn't anywhere for the supply in China to go, which could be the case now with revised flow, then it will most likely stay in China.
If you want to add a current save or two, I can produce the base flow stats again to see where it is being pulled/pushed to.

I must have missed this one. Can you repost??

This save is from 4 march 1942 pakhoi has only 1k supply rangoon 295k all from india.

michaelm this save is from 4 march 1942
[/quote]
Using 1108m6 program...
The final numbers at Pakhoi are
Supply: 2k, Fuel: 31k, Resource: 68k
From what I can see, the movement is from China bases, and basically occurs as part of the push to the best local port in range.

--- movement in the turn from/to Pakhoi was -------
1 "Pakhoi" receives 143 supply from "Chungking" (59), store = 1839 req = 665
1 "Pakhoi" receives 44 supply from "Kunming" (55), store = 1839 req = 665

2 "Changsha" receives 10 fuel from "Pakhoi" (72), store = 103 req = 24
2 "Chengtu" receives 682 fuel from "Pakhoi" (44), store = 2606 req = 640
2 "Chungking" receives 1214 resource from "Pakhoi" (59), store = 167530 req = 17890
2 "Chungking" receives 3851 fuel from "Pakhoi" (59), store = 2600 req = 1300
2 "Kunming" receives 677 resource from "Pakhoi" (55), store = 60000 req = 6400
2 "Kunming" receives 1005 fuel from "Pakhoi" (55), store = 1707 req = 400
2 "Sian" receives 5 fuel from "Pakhoi" (26), store = 520 req = 80

Excess push to local ports...
3 "Pakhoi" receives 46 resource from "Chengchow" (40), store = 9071 req = 900
3 "Pakhoi" receives 99 resource from "Hengyang" (74), store = 12036 req = 1200
3 "Pakhoi" receives 184 resource from "Loyang" (38), store = 6302 req = 600
3 "Pakhoi" receives 105 resource from "Kukong" (70), store = 46 req = 0
3 "Pakhoi" receives 271 resource from "Kweiteh" (32), store = 6577 req = 600
3 "Pakhoi" receives 26 resource from "Lanchow" (13), store = 18181 req = 1800
3 "Pakhoi" receives 94 resource from "Nanyang" (36), store = 169 req = 0
3 "Pakhoi" receives 384 resource from "Shaoyang" (72), store = 6150 req = 600
3 "Pakhoi" receives 12320 resource from "Sian" (26), store = 61068 req = 2600
3 "Pakhoi" receives 1745 resource from "Siangtan" (72), store = 6679 req = 600
3 "Pakhoi" receives 2813 resource from "Tienshui" (22), store = 9974 req = 0
3 "Pakhoi" receives 1898 resource from "Tsiaotso" (38), store = 15098 req = 1200
3 "Pakhoi" receives 4875 resource from "Wuchow" (65), store = 20625 req = 1800
3 "Pakhoi" receives 40200 resource from "Pingsiang" (67), store = 19800 req = 0
3 "Pakhoi" receives 2176 resource from "Ankang" (17), store = 10624 req = 0

[koniu]

here is probably bug in password protection system
Do Alied player password start working after he ends his 1 turn or on the moment he enter it?

I tell you about this, because my opponent accidentally send me his first turn without ending it.
When i load save, game tell me that this is save of not ended turn. I press yes and save start to load. When game ask me for player 2 password (i am player 1) i want to stop this and i press escape button. Password window disappear and save loaded. And i see all allied units and orders

I perform test on another pbem game and it confirmed this
In round 2 password work ok

Japanise player password works ok

[John 3rd]

Hello.

Wanted to echo others in how much I have appreciated your work and diligence with AE!

FatR and I are about to re-launch Reluctant Admiral and I would like your advice on how far we should update the Mod? I am currently using your M3 work in my on-going RA Campaign and it works great.

Can we move to your most recent or is it better to stay at M3 with RA 3.0?

Thanks for the answer.
John

[michaelm75au]

ORIGINAL: koniu

here is probably bug in password protection system
Do Alied player password start working after he ends his 1 turn or on the moment he enter it?

I tell you about this, because my opponent accidentally send me his first turn without ending it.
When i load save, game tell me that this is save of not ended turn. I press yes and save start to load. When game ask me for player 2 password (i am player 1) i want to stop this and i press escape button. Password window disappear and save loaded. And i see all allied units and orders

I perform test on another pbem game and it confirmed this
In round 2 password work ok

Japanise player password works ok

Don't quite see why this is so.
The password is stored in the save when it is selected.
I'll try to trace the sequence.
[edit]
Simple fix. If password is already set, ask for it.

Because of the setting of the save, it didn't expect a password not to be set on turn 1.
This would happen with the first mid-turn Allied save; save looks like the normal end-turn save sent by Japan for turn 1.

[Nemo121]

Following some more testing here's the update on m6 based on my Armaggedon game....

1. Upgrading to m6 appears to have had trouble with the trick whereby you could set up loops of upgrade downgrades. E.g. Ohka 11 to Ohka 22 to Ohka 23. Under m5 when you upgraded to Ohka 22 or 23 it would retain the Ohka 11 downgrade. Under m6 this disappeared. The fix was simple, just make the Ohka 23 "upgradeable" to the Ohka 11. This may also be an issue with other plane types such as the J2M2, M3 and M5 etc although I haven't reproduced it except with kamikaze units. I can't see why the code on upgrades/downgrades would treat them differently but it appears to.


2. Randomised CAP level is definitely fixed. Works very well now. Every so often you get intercepted and slaughtered but most of the time if you send fast planes in low most of them get through unless your opponent has huge numbers of planes at low altitude which spot them visually - in which case you get slaughtered.


A few other issues have arisen though. They aren't errors with m6 just things which have become clear as we've played deeper into the game:

3. B-29s on night-time missions appear to get the same defensive box bonus which B-29s benefit from during the daytime. This results in night-fighters being shredded by fire and driven off long before they ever get into firing positions. In essence the night fighters with radar are being spotted and fired on by multiple B-29 gunners in the middle of the night using the Mk1 eyeball. This results in night bombing missions being more difficult to stop and having even lower loss rates than would otherwise be the case.

I would suggest that somewhere in the code there is a function which deals with giving bombers a defensive bonus if there's a certain number of them - to account for defensive boxes etc. Anyways I suggest that if there's such a function then it should be turned off at night. It simply isn't historically supported that bombers which weren't under night-fighter attack added their fire to bombers being attacked by night-fighters in the pitch black of night.


4. Is there a penalty for Japanese aircraft maintenance above and beyond what applies to the Allies? I ask because we recently had to ugprade and downgrade planes in order for a change to bomber loadout to take effect and while my opponent is having his B-29s repaired at a rate of whereby he has over 75% back in service 1 week later the Ki-264 which has the same service rating has only had 10% of the bombers repaired in the same time. Both sides have these planes at large airbases ( Size 9 or larger ) with >250 Aviation Support.


The box bonus at night is the main issue though. The service rating question is just that, a query based on an apparent discrepancy in repair rates.

[michaelm75au]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

Following some more testing here's the update on m6 based on my Armaggedon game....

1. Upgrading to m6 appears to have had trouble with the trick whereby you could set up loops of upgrade downgrades. E.g. Ohka 11 to Ohka 22 to Ohka 23. Under m5 when you upgraded to Ohka 22 or 23 it would retain the Ohka 11 downgrade. Under m6 this disappeared. The fix was simple, just make the Ohka 23 "upgradeable" to the Ohka 11. This may also be an issue with other plane types such as the J2M2, M3 and M5 etc although I haven't reproduced it except with kamikaze units. I can't see why the code on upgrades/downgrades would treat them differently but it appears to.

The original upgrade is retain as far as I can see.
As mentioned before, this code hasn't been touched since m5.

[Nemo121]

It isn't retained in the groups which can upgrade to 108 planes - Ohka Toukou 1-9 IIRC.

It appears to be specific to those groups in my game. I upgraded the database to let the Type 23 upgrade to the Type 11 and that fixed it. So it may have been a scenario design oddity interacting with the code in some weird way.

[Nemo121]

Suggestion:

For Kamikaze groups - which need a constant huge influx of pilots - can pilots which are pulled from reserve be made to automatically enter service? IOW there would be no local reserve allowed for these pilots.

When you attack with a group of 27 planes once a week it requires going through the group EVERY DAY of the month in order to draw the pilots from the local reserve into the actual squadron. Making that automatic just for kamikaze squadrons would hugely reduce the amount of clicking required.... and it is hardly as though anyone is using kamikaze squadrons to "store" pilots anyways as they sometimes might do with normal squadrons.

That small change would reduce the amount of micro-management required of Japan in 1944/45 significantly.