Road To Minsk

[jjdenver]

post deleted

[ComradeP]

What does "routed out of the pocket" mean? How does that mechanic work? Thanks.

JJ, when a unit is theoretically in a pocket (as in: surrounded by enemy hexes) but has not spend a turn in such a state (as in: it's the same turn as when that pocket was created) and the unit routs, it will have a chance of routing out of the pocket, which is not desirable as you're creating pockets to bag as many units as you can.

I'm sure it's in the rules which I'm working on wading through, but what is that "certain distance" in hexes?

Combat units are considered to be in HQ range if they're less than 5 hexes away, but up to a certain number of MP's (which I can't find in the manual at the moment, so I'll get back to you about that) it takes to get to that hex, so units in mountains and swamps quickly move out of the range.

[karonagames]

which I can't find in the manual at the moment

20Mps - it is important to remember this for units on the far side of Pockets, because although they are within 5 hexes they could be more than 20 MPs.

[ComradeP]

Which section is it in, I was looking in 7.6.4? Is it in a section about supply?

[karonagames]

20.4.1.1. SUPPLY PATH TRACE MP COST
The movement point cost for all supply path traces are calculated as if the path was being
travelled by a motorized unit with a morale of 99 (14.1.2). All motorized movement point costs
are taken into account, to include EZOC, weather, terrain, and river hexsides. When tracing
from a rail hex on the grid to an undamaged rail hex adjacent to an enemy unit, as long as the
supply trace is not leaving an enemy ZOC, the supply trace will only cost one MP to trace into
that hex, representing limited use of rail lines in hexes adjacent to enemy units. Supply can
be traced through an enemy ZOC as long as the hex is friendly controlled or pending friendly,
though tracing supply this way will result in increased MP costs. Supply paths cannot be traced
through enemy controlled hexes or across unfrozen impassable lake or river hexsides. For
purposes of meeting the five hex and twenty MP limits on tracing from a HQ unit to a combat
unit, the five hexes are “as the crow flies”, while the MP path can be traced separately through
more than five hexes as long as it is less than twenty MPs long. Both limits must be met
however or the combat unit must trace directly to the railhead.

[karonagames]

20.4.1. TRACING SUPPLY
In order to receive supply, a combat unit first attempts to trace a path to the headquarters
unit to which it is attached. The combat unit must be within both five hexes and twenty MPs
of the applicable headquarters unit. In order for a headquarters unit to provide supply to its
attached combat and support units, it in turn must be within both 25 hexes and 100 MPs of
a railhead. If a combat unit cannot trace an eligible path to its headquarters unit, it will then
attempt to trace a path to a railhead as if it was a headquarters unit, i.e. within both 25 hexes
and 100 MPs of the railhead. Note that Air base and Rail repair units, though HQ units, are
267
treated as combat units for supply purposes per the above. Also note the distinction between
supply state and tracing supply, in that a unit that is within 100 MPs, but not within 25 hexes,
is considered in supply, but nonetheless, will not be able to receive supply due to exceeding
the 25 hex requirement.

[ComradeP]

Might be an idea to place the maximum MP cost in section 7.6.4 too, with a reference that more details can be found in section 20.4.1

[fsp]

I believe I did better in my second attempt. Would someone more experienced care to analyse this screenshot for big mistakes? Which of this would not hold up to a human player in THAT scenario (I know that some of those advances are reckless but they should work in that scenario even against a human, or am I wrong?).

Also - would it have been possible to occupy BOTH Kaunas and Vilnius?

[Great_Ajax]

fsp, that looks pretty good. I would have wiped out those three Soviet units west of Minsk just to be sure. ZOC 4 hexes or more wide is very difficult for a Soviet player to re-establish supply. Three or less is questionable.

Trey

[ComradeP]

The unit in Kaunas usually looks stronger than it is, I usually use a deliberate attack with 3 units to remove it.

I'm guessing the Soviets can restore supply like this:

[alfonso]

ORIGINAL: Krec

i think a draw is about what you can get.
the other point citys are on the far right side
i killed just about everything in site although i ended T4 early could have killed a few more units , was really fun , love the movies at the end , really cool footage.
This game is very good.[:D]

I won!!! hehehe

[Krec]

Great Job!! ill have to replay now

[hgilmer3]

Can you do an AAR for this scenario and tell us what difficulty? Because on normal I am getting blasted as Germany. Every time I have played on normal I have lost a major defeat.

[alfonso]

ORIGINAL: hgilmer3

Can you do an AAR for this scenario and tell us what difficulty? Because on normal I am getting blasted as Germany. Every time I have played on normal I have lost a major defeat.

I played in difficulty set at normal. I think that in the Minsk scenario the most important factor is to make advance the panzer divisions as far as possible, in order to reach the right end of the map. I use the infantry divisions for the initial breakthroughs, to save Panzer MP. The Soviet side is very weak. When infantry has blasted a hole in the front lines (say 4 hexes wide and 3-4 hexes deep) I release the Panzer Divsions. Especially in the initial turn, I make only hasty attacks with one Division each time, to save the MPs of the remaining divisions in the stack. One Motorized division leads the way sweeping aside enemy obstacles. The following Panzer Divisions will therefore only spend MP advancing, not fighting.

Turn 1. The Panzer Divisions reach the hex west of Minsk, and create a huge envelopment. Brest Litovsk is surrounded

Turn 2. Minsk is encircled and captured and one PanzerDiv reaches Mogilev, while some of them advance towards Vitebsk
The infantry armies far behind in the west entertain themselves by forcing the Red Army to surrender (note that regiments alone can't do the trick, you have to use whole Inf Divs, something related to ZOCs, I guess...).

Turn 3. The Division in Mogilev is Air Supplied (just in case) and all Panzer Forces advance towards Vitebsk, clearing the way for my last Motorized Division, which happened to have just the MP necessary to occupy the city. And Brest Litovsk falls...

I try to move HQs and Air Bases forward, I think it helps (not sure about Airbases, though...)

[Swayin]

To win as the Germans, a couple of things need to happen, IMO: Brest falls on turn one, clearing the path for the southern pincer's panzergruppe to make it just outside Minsk, just across that small river to the SW of the city on that turn.

As the Germans, you will not win if you capture ONLY Minsk, the Baltic towns, and B-L! you need to grab at least one more of the objective towns on the east edge of the map, and IMO, the easiest is generally the one in the NE corner, which can be had by driving your lime green panzer corps (it starts in the NW corner of the board) hard from the get-go in that direction.

Mop up the pocket using foot infantry, not your mechanized troops or armor. Punch into Minsk from the SW.

[hgilmer3]

I never can get them resupplied well enough to make the whole trip.  I do fine on the encirclements and I move the HQs up and it never works.

[htuna]

I was like 3 turn scenario.. what fun could that be.. Tutorial has 10!.. just finished the first turn.. this game Rocks!

[Emx77]

Total Soviet Disaster - Axis VP Advantage 10.7 to 1

I wonder if someone can do better then this on normal diffculty? [:D]

Victory points


Ground Losses


Air Losses


Destroyed Units


Map situation at the end of scenario


Difficulty settings

[kfmiller41]

took me three tries but I finally got a victory, Major one. Takes some learning to understand whats what and I am sure that I couldnt take the kind of risks against a person i can against the AI. Great fun.

[hgilmer3]

I'm getting better!  Slow and steady wins the race! (Well, not yet, but I'm getting closer.)  This is on normal and I have been getting torn to pieces on normal.  I lost the last game, but I finally took Minsk and got within 2 hexes of Mogilev.  I'm thinking if I take Mogilev, I'll win at least a Minor.

So, even thickheaded people can play this game, hehe.