How to lose the war - PDH vs Cpt Flam

[PeeDeeAitch]

Looks like there will be a slowdown for a bit while Capt Flam takes care of some stuff.  Guess I will wait patiently, maybe start another game while I play this one more slowly - I like how it goes.

-edit - I do have turn 8 from the Germans in, wish some screenshots, but I will wait to get them posted.

[Senno]

To bad. The comedy made the AAR quite entertaining.

Look forward to the next.

[randallw]

Comedy? Comedy and Germans do not go together! [:D]

[PeeDeeAitch]

Turn 8 saw The Axis in full overconfidence mode. I plan to ride the victories of early August all the way to the Pacific. The defense be nothing, no rivers will help the defense, and all losses will be replaced. I put in my order with the winter outfitter for coats, mittens, and mukluks for the infantry. They are being sent on the first free supply train.

In the North the optimism is in full swing. The Volkhov has been crossed and the wide open panzer country of dense forests and swamps awaits the 4th Panzer Group. A loose encirclement of Novgorod should force the denfenders back - they might be caught next turn or I might move north to take the lake ports for Leningrad. Whatever I choose, I will succeed since I command near supermen.

The eastern approaches to Leningrad seem weak as well, perhaps I can sneak across there.

[PeeDeeAitch]

The center was quiet, are the Germans just waiting and resting, or are they out of ideas? Whatever is happening, the 2nd Panzer Group makes a dash south while the rest of the Center holds and slowly advances.

[PeeDeeAitch]

The South, oh the South! The Dnepr was crossed as I hoped, but farther to the east than I wanted and not in the force I expected. The First Panzer Group should be able to exploit this, but I expect hubris to bring me down as in all good tragedies. The pocket has been cleaned up, and the 17th Army pushes toward the Dnepr Bend. Soon all the Ukraine will be mine, and I can start contemplating getting to Grozny by winter!

[PeeDeeAitch]

Turns will be coming in slower it seems, but they still will be coming in.  I plan to encircle Moscow on turn 9 and then drive to Gorky on turn 10, capturing it on turn 11.

[Senno]

Sounds reasonable.

I can now add a cheeseburger to my previous offer to trade saves. But it still has to be next Thursday, that I actually deliver the hammy and cheeseburger.

I await your reasonable counteroffer.[:)]

[PeeDeeAitch]

End of Turn 8 Losses

Soviets - 1.86 million men, 1.25 of those captured.

Here is a picture of 2nd Panzer's dash to the south - the armor is blown due to long distance traveled.

Guderian was clear in his appeals that he could take Moscow, but the state of the panzers shows he will be lucky to advance over open terrain. I suspect Typhoon will be hurt, I might not take Gorky... The chance of making a firm Kiev Pocket is about nil, but I have to try.

[PeeDeeAitch]

No turn tonight. I am left to wallow in my own misery and problems.  I expect to find that the Soviets have 100 new rifle divisions next turn, a carpet 3 thick between me and everything, and no hope.
 
I have sold all the winter gear for extra cash, I plan to use this to make my getaway fortune by betting it all on "BLACK" at the roulette wheel.

[PeeDeeAitch]

A preview of turn 9, since turns are slowing down due to other committments of my opponent. I don't worry about any sort of advantage gained by showing these, it seems rather obvious what I tried (and basically failed) at

In a fit of undeserved optimism and rare planning skills, I worked the last 3 or 4 turns to trying to do the "Kiev Pocket" routine. One of the reasons I rode the Panzers down the Dnepr was to get below where the 2nd Panzer Group was waiting to strike south. Sadly, Hurrying Heinz had problems, the battles around Smolensk robbed his units of vitality and ability - worse, one Panzer Corps was so far out of position they would have been better suited dashing to Leningrad...Heinz could not ketchup.

Still, as seen in the pictures last turn the initial breakthrough to the south was made by 2nd Panzer while the 1st crossed the Dnepr with units waiting behind. Turn 8 showed promise, but I feared that I had struck too slowly and too late.

Turn 9 came and 1st Panzer group drove north as hard as they could. Even Goering's unlimited supplies of fuel did not help too much, and the drive came up far short of half way. It was up to Heinz, and he did his best. The direct route was blocked, so a strike to the east then south was made. However, both north and south bled units all the way protecting protenital counter-strike routes at the neck of the breakthroughs. The final "meeting" was one lone motorized (29th) crossing the gap and sort of making a pocket.

It won't hold, but it will do some damage. Hexes inside will be converted, the marshes will turn to glorious german control, and maybe in a turn or two I can actually pocket some units. If anything, it keeps momentum in my corner...

The Southern drive north:

[PeeDeeAitch]

The Northern drive south:

[Klydon]

Now that is a pocket! Hehe. I think it was worth your time to pull that. If nothing else, it should lever him off the river line. The hard part is you probably don't have enough infantry to start the clean up behind fast enough. He will break the encirclement, but has to know you should be able to reestablish it so it will be interesting to see what he does as a reaction.

Very much likely a "oh sh**" moment when he opens up his turn. [;)]

[Aussiematto]

I agree - I think too much is made of whether or not pockets hold. Sure, at times, you really want to capture those units, so you must be certain the pocket is unbreakable. However, in the more advanced of my current games (first PBEM) I have found the threat of a pocket is often sufficient to achieve the real aim - moving those defenders back a way. Similarly, a very wide corridor of Axis hexes, even if not held, can create the conditions for much alarm and make the Soviet player expend all their resources in breaking the pocket.

It's a bit like a fork in chess - you have two aims - surround the units, or force the defender to react. Either way, his defence is reacting to your attack which, I think, is currently understood as getting 'inside' the defender's decision making loop. Not sure what the op doctrine in WWII / GPW was.

[PeeDeeAitch]

I think that a "perfect pocket" (well, other than 2nd ACR's...) doesn't exist. To try for that is means headaches - see my sig from the Big N - and it is better to set up a pocket on the first few turns.

I think this one is too easily broken, and many will flee, but the Dnepr is mine and all his lovely entrenchments will be gone. I did have the plan to have 2nd Army clean up from the north, 6th from the south, but it is rather big if it held - perhaps it is better that it causes a mass relocation.

[PeeDeeAitch]

ORIGINAL: majeloz
It's a bit like a fork in chess - you have two aims - surround the units, or force the defender to react. Either way, his defence is reacting to your attack which, I think, is currently understood as getting 'inside' the defender's decision making loop. Not sure what the op doctrine in WWII / GPW was.

I prefer Forrest's terminology: "Put the skeer in them."

[timmyab]

If you want to lose this war and be on that plane to Argentina, you need to try harder.[:)]

[PeeDeeAitch]

Sadly it looks like no turn again today. I want to play. Maybe I will have to sacrifice 2nd ACR.

[TulliusDetritus]

Amazing pocket [X(] There could be minimum 40 units or even more there! [&o] If I well understood you recreated the German pocket near Kiev! [8D] This front should collapse.

[PeeDeeAitch]

Well, it is only 3 hexes wide, so it should fall apart unless a lot of new hexes are added due to the isolation rules.  Still, I think there is a fair chance to re-close it the next turn.

In my screenies from the last turn, I make out 55-60 combat units and another 10-15 HQs and airbases in there. If I get half of them and start driving again, I am happy.

In all seriousness, and I know that ruins the thread, I blew it slightly here. I planned this for 3 turns (the Smolensk dash was to set this up and make my opponent think I was heading to Moscow early, but I couldn't close that and my panzers took damage and wear. In the south I had to drive (and fight) a lot further than I expected, so again the panzers and motorized were blown/low on fuel. Had I closed this, it might have turned the game - 500k troops captured, most of them trained and having been sitting there for a few weeks to flesh out would have done wonders. As it is, I can expect half of that. It may ultimately turn out to be a gigantic waste of resources.