Top Ten fighting ships of all time

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: Symon

ORIGINAL: geofflambert
Simple Symon met a pieman, but never mastered english.

English is my second language. Think I have mastered it sufficiently to express myself cogently.

Iron is not armor. Iron is a structural material with well established moduli, like wood. Iron has certain structural benefits over wood, assuming the technology is available to produce iron in the requisite form and thickness. Iron is useful in resisting wracking stresses, and when combined with Seppings trusses, useful in reducing hogging moments in long vessels. Its usefulness against round shot was a highly desirable, but almost secondary consideration.

The only time I used the term armor was with Warrior's outer iron sheathing, because that was it's function. It was not a structural member. The rest of the time, I used the term iron.

Don't know why I even bother engaging pre-teens. You have your wiki-world, where reality is worse than a bath and some deodorant. Gotta say I try to feel for ya, but just can't reach that far. Ciao. J

A pre-teen? I wish. So where are you from really? Not De Eye-lands, Mon. The Czechs and the northern Italians are known for their metallurgy, would you be one of those?

For the record, just how old are you in gorn years?

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: Encircled

Can I put a vote in for the war cruise of SMS Emden in 1914?

Undergunned, underpowered, but still managed to wreck havoc in the Indian Ocean till she ran out of luck at the Cocos Islands.

Sorry to be a piss-ant, but I think she wreaked havoc, not wrecked it.

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

The Black Death has been traced to the Siege of Caffa (learned this from that book, it really is a great one!). A fleet of a dozen or so ships docked at Messina in Sicily, and that was the first instance of Black Death. Sources: Plagues and Peoples, William H. McNeill; The Black Death, Philip Ziegler.

Much of what I said about the Chinese Fleets is and was conjecture, but we know for sure that they did occur and they were substantial. As to the Black Death, no one knows for sure where it began, but much of the scholarship on that subject points to China or somewhere very close, such as Mongolia or the Altai region.

Anyhow, someone asserting that "China didn't have the Black Death" or that a certain emperor (whom I'm sure this nitwit didn't even know the name of, though he seemed to know what the dude was thinking) destroyed all the sea going ships in China because of the Black Death needs to learn that making stuff up and getting others to believe it isn't exactly cricket. Perhaps he's a protege of Glenn Beck or an acolyte of Michelle Bachmann, but I don't think that stuff is going to work in this forum. Just in case he's tested later on this, the emperor was Jiaqing and he did that in 1525. I wish him good luck in his career.

[geofflambert]

quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert
Correct. The French had the first seagoing iron clad La Gloire launched in 1859.

Also incorrect (in a sense). The British launched the iron hulled Warrior (not iron-clad) in 1860. It may be a matter of debate but I expect iron clad oak was harder to penetrate than a plain iron hull.

Not quite right in either sense. Neither ship was built with a hull of armor plate. One must learn about the shipbuilding techniques of the time before making such wiki-pronouncements.

Not trying to start anything but to end something. I'm quite sure Symon will be a welcome addition to the forum and a formidible opponent. Did I say either ship was made with a hull of armor plate? Nope. So why did you write that?

wiki-pronouncements? I knew about these two ships decades before there was a "wiki". I sincerely accept your apology.

The only time I used the term armor was with Warrior's outer iron sheathing, because that was it's function. It was not a structural member. The rest of the time, I used the term iron.

The function of the materials used to iron-clad the Virginia was to carry iron horses. I accept your apology on this matter as well.


Iron is not armor.

Neither is cotton, but it was used as such. Bales of cotton were remarkably effective at stopping Minie balls.

Anyhow, let's just say someone needs to add more senna to his diet.

[Capt Hornblower]

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

ORIGINAL: Encircled

Can I put a vote in for the war cruise of SMS Emden in 1914?

Undergunned, underpowered, but still managed to wreck havoc in the Indian Ocean till she ran out of luck at the Cocos Islands.

Sorry to be a piss-ant, but I think she wreaked havoc, not wrecked it.

With all the misspellings and grammatical mistakes in postings on this forum, why single this one out?

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: Capt Hornblower

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

ORIGINAL: Encircled

Can I put a vote in for the war cruise of SMS Emden in 1914?

Undergunned, underpowered, but still managed to wreck havoc in the Indian Ocean till she ran out of luck at the Cocos Islands.

Sorry to be a piss-ant, but I think she wreaked havoc, not wrecked it.

With all the misspellings and grammatical mistakes in postings on this forum, why single this one out?

I'm in an indefensible position. I edit my own postings three, four or more times because of all the errors. Mea culpa.

[Encircled]

Ha!

You know you've arrived when you get pulled up on your grammar!

[geofflambert]

I need to apologize to Symon and everyone who watched our repartee yesterday. My medication starts wearing off a bit in the evenings and I get manic and make a fool of myself. That is an explanation, not a justification. It is plain that Symon knows a lot more than me, and I was aware of that pretty quick. My attempts to be comedic don't always work very well either. I've been working on improving my behavior for a long time, but I still have a ways to go. Also I know better than trying to be cute and clever with people who don't understand American idioms and the like. I'm sure a lot of them are left scratching their heads (sometimes along with everyone else) after reading some of my posts. I need to do a better job of keeping myself in my place rather than waiting for one of you to do it. I hope most of you realize (Bullwinkle i.e.) that I'm usually teasing, especially people I respect, which is really, allmost all of you. Only one individual comes to mind immediately that I cannot respect. There have been others, but they all went away, and I've never used that green button on anyone.

I also apologize to Mr. Dolson for probably giving him a bad case of heartburn.

Please forgive

[Bullwinkle58]

We're cool. [:)]

[Symon]

Yep, we're cool. [:)]

[geofflambert]

Symon, I hear you have a lot to do w/DaBabes. I adore DBB-C and don't ever want to play anything else. Thank you.

[Symon]

Symon is JWE, one of the original game developers. I have a rep of not suffering fools at all, and I tend to make it clear and it's gotten me banned once before. Oh well. That's why I login as Symon.

Babes began as a collaboration with Don Bowen, doing things we wanted to do with the release version, but didn't have the time to get done. That's why I say that BabesLite IS stock (or at least what stock should have been given 1 more month). And worked with Andrew Brown on the concept of the extended map and stacking limits.

Since then Don and I have developed the game system in our respective directions, with a lot of cross pollination. DBB has new units, new systems, new paradigms. It is not simply portable into the game system, as BabesLite is. BigBabes-A is for those who want to play with the nominal map. BigBabes-B is for those who want to play with the extended map.

BigBabes-C comes from a request, by Treespider, to make things more realistic in terms of transport capability for the combatants (both sides). It is simply BigBabes-B with a 30% reduction in ship capacity (with adjustments to auxiliaries to let them do what they need to do).

Glad you like it. I like it too.

Ciao. JWE

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

......Only one individual comes to mind immediately that I cannot respect.....

warspite1

No I don't respect him either - that Chickenboy is a right $%^&&&* [;)]

[RevRick]

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

Symon, I hear you have a lot to do w/DaBabes. I adore DBB-C and don't ever want to play anything else. Thank you.

Not to be insulting to a Gorn, but Good Man!

Live long and prosper!

BTW - I've been watching the Top Ten programs on the Military Channel for a long time, since there is not much else on between Training Camp and the Super Bowl... and they have some of the most biased results on those shows I've ever seen. The failure to include a submarine (as much as I hate them, being a former Tin Can sailor)is absolutely ridiculous. The Gato class or the U-Boat, or both should be included.

I had two brothers in one of my first churches who served in the Navy in WWII. One was on an AE, the other on an AVGAS transport. They lived in fear of submarines, and made trips in both oceans.

[wdolson]

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

I need to apologize to Symon and everyone who watched our repartee yesterday. My medication starts wearing off a bit in the evenings and I get manic and make a fool of myself. That is an explanation, not a justification. It is plain that Symon knows a lot more than me, and I was aware of that pretty quick. My attempts to be comedic don't always work very well either. I've been working on improving my behavior for a long time, but I still have a ways to go. Also I know better than trying to be cute and clever with people who don't understand American idioms and the like. I'm sure a lot of them are left scratching their heads (sometimes along with everyone else) after reading some of my posts. I need to do a better job of keeping myself in my place rather than waiting for one of you to do it. I hope most of you realize (Bullwinkle i.e.) that I'm usually teasing, especially people I respect, which is really, allmost all of you. Only one individual comes to mind immediately that I cannot respect. There have been others, but they all went away, and I've never used that green button on anyone.

I also apologize to Mr. Dolson for probably giving him a bad case of heartburn.

Please forgive

I was waiting to see if it blew over on its own. I thought it might be some kind of teasing, but it wasn't completely obvious. It was also coming on the heels of some other mud throwing within this thread, which probably didn't help matters any.

Oh and BTW, my last name isn't Dolson, it's Olson. The D is my middle initial.

Bill

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: wdolson
my last name isn't Dolson, it's Olson. The D is my middle initial.

Thanks for that. Here I was thinking wdolson was your last name. Dutch-Irish, is it?



[;)]

[MineSweeper]

Suprised that Dreadnought has not been mentioned.....pretty much rendered all Battleships obsolete, at the time.

[Mobeer]

HMS Speedy of 1782
Served 5 periods in different navies
Captured a much larger frigate
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Captu ... l_Gamo.jpg

HMS Temeraire of 1798
Trafalgar: "A circumstance occurred during the action which so strongly marks the invincible spirit of British seamen, when engaging the enemies of their country, that I cannot resist the pleasure I have in making it known to their Lordships; the Temeraire was boarded by accident; or design, by a French ship on one side, and a Spaniard on the other; the contest was vigorous, but, in the end the combined ensigns were torn from the poop and the British hoisted in their places."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Turne ... broken.jpg

Nusret of 1911
Minelayer, sank 3 battleships and crippled a battle cruiser
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_minelayer_Nusret

HMS Indefatigable of 1784
Razee frigate, captured 27 prizes and made home for a good TV show

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: Symon

Symon is JWE, one of the original game developers. I have a rep of not suffering fools at all, and I tend to make it clear and it's gotten me banned once before. Oh well. That's why I login as Symon.
Ciao. JWE

Well, clearly I am a fool. Don't let me catch you suffering me!

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

......Only one individual comes to mind immediately that I cannot respect.....

warspite1

No I don't respect him either - that Chickenboy is a right $%^&&&* [;)]

I didn't want to have to name names. Thank you for stepping forward like that. Warspite1 has done so at great personal hazard and we should all salute his bravery and dedication to common human decency.

Of course, common human decency does not in any way compare to gorn sensibilities.