Ukraine 2014

[mikmykWS]

CIMSEC's take on this.

[RoryAndersonCDT]

Video of troops taking over and seizing the Ukrainian navy HQ in Sevastopol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhS_SATFoRc

[RoryAndersonCDT]

Hetman Sahaydachniy is a Krivak III-class frigate.

[mrfeizhu]

NakedWeasel "Hey, I'm just tired of hearing Russians fan boiz talk smack all the time about how awesome their tech is, and they are going to blow every F-22, F-35, and B-2 out of the sky without taking their eyes off their vodka shot glass. I want to see just how RUSSIA STRONG!!!111!11 this gear really is."[&o]
You play command and the Russian equipment seems like the best thing since slice bread, but in Iraq, the Air wars with Israel, and Serbia Russian equipment didn't do that well.

[guanotwozero]

If part of an international economic response was to blockade Russian shipping through the Dardanelles and the Baltic (Denmark/Sweden), what sort of forces would be required to enact that? Or break it?

[Dimitris]

ORIGINAL: mrfeizhu
You play command and the Russian equipment seems like the best thing since slice bread, but in Iraq, the Air wars with Israel, and Serbia Russian equipment didn't do that well.

Unfair and simplistic.

Educate yourself before making such broad statements: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-SAM-Effectiveness.html

[RoryAndersonCDT]

[mrfeizhu]

Sunburn." Unfair and simplistic.

Educate yourself before making such broad statements"

Sorry I can' t change history.

[thewood1]

Is this sounding a lot like 1938 to anyone?

[RoryAndersonCDT]

[AdmiralSteve]

One thing that you cannot duplicate in Command or any other sim is the capabilities or will power of the operators. A Serb or Iraqi in a MiG isn't exactly the same as a Soviet or Russian pilot with their own intel and training. Theirs also a different CoC, OOB, RoE, doctrine, etc. now and I'm sure that lessons were learned in the failed conflicts of before. Think the US didn't take anything from WWII, Korea or Vietnam and used them in Iraq and Afghanistan?

[RoryAndersonCDT]

You can change the behavior of units via the ROE/Doctrine system, plus there is an ability to change skill on a per side basis.

A group of AAW A/C with Auto evade off and RTB when windchester off, engage unknown contacts on are quite deadly!

[Dobey455]

ORIGINAL: thewood1

Is this sounding a lot like 1938 to anyone?

You mean does "We have to 'secure' the Crimea to protect the Russian speaking population" sound something like "We had to annex the Sudetenland to protect a German speaking population"?

I've always enjoyed that European peculiarity - that one nation can lay claim to part of another nation, not based on the population's citizenship or any threat to ethnic minorities or majorities, but simply because "they speak the same language as us".

Its in interesting precedent, and I wonder just how much of Poland, Belarus and the Baltic states Putin can claim he has a legitimate right to "secure" based on them containing "Russian speakers"

[RoryAndersonCDT]

[Dimitris]

ORIGINAL: mrfeizhu

Sunburn." Unfair and simplistic.

Educate yourself before making such broad statements"

Sorry I can' t change history.

You can learn from it and adjust your outlook, or you can cherry-pick its lessons to suit your pre-determined view.

I am _so sorry_ that Command drills into you what Russian hardware can do when ably handled.

[MorningDew]

ORIGINAL: thewood1

Is this sounding a lot like 1938 to anyone?

Feeling eerily similar

[Sardaukar]

"It is reasonable for Germany (Russia) to be in sympathy with the German (Russian) population of the Sudetenland (Crimea), and for that population to feel that the government of Czechoslovakia (Ukraine) is insufficiently responsive to its legitimate concerns with regard to the use of the German (Russian) language, etc. I believe that Herr...(Mr Putin) is an honourable man, & has no further territorial demands in Europe. I have in my hand a piece of paper . .. ."

Neville Chamberlain's speech could fit right in, just change names and places a bit...

[Sardaukar]

And South Ossetia, Abhazia, Georgia and even Chechenya, when it comes to Russia...not so long ago.

[guanotwozero]

To me, the scariest parallel is the Sudetenland 1938. When you get away with small successes because nobody stands up to you, you're bolstered to make ever bigger moves, and have more power to suppress domestic opposition and moderate voices. I suspect this trend is nowhere near finished.

EDIT ===

@Sardaukar - I didn't notice at first, but you beat me to it!

[thewood1]

It's not the invasion and taking control...the 1938 reference is the reaction of the west and UN to the moves. People have been invading neighbors since history was first recorded.