Tibbetts has passed on

[spence]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071101/ap_ ... it_tibbets

[joey]

I heard about it this morning also. I notice he wanted no funeral and no grave stone. I guess he considered the ramifications of those.

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: joey

I heard about it this morning also. I notice he wanted no funeral and no grave stone. I guess he considered the ramifications of those.

Sounds as though it could have caused issues...I'm surprised. I doubt 98% of America even knows who he was.

[AU Tiger_MatrixForum]

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

ORIGINAL: joey

I heard about it this morning also. I notice he wanted no funeral and no grave stone. I guess he considered the ramifications of those.

Sounds as though it could have caused issues...I'm surprised. I doubt 98% of America even knows who he was.

The lunatic fringe in the 2% is enough.
[:@]

[sprior]

Another link:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7073441.stm

[BrucePowers]

He said he wanted his ashes spread over the English Channel.

[Ian R]

I think it speaks very ill of the sensationalist press and its muck rakers to attack people like Bomber Harris and Tibbetts - they did their job when their country asked them to. Why have they been selected for criticism now? Why not the Chiefs of Staff who gave them their orders?

[joey]

It sure says something about society. Doesn't it?

[Fishbed]

I think it speaks very ill of the sensationalist press and its muck rakers to attack people like Bomber Harris and Tibbetts - they did their job when their country asked them to. Why have they been selected for criticism now? Why not the Chiefs of Staff who gave them their orders?

Well Tibbetts had a job to do. He wouldn't have done it, someone else would have.
Now Bomber Harris wasn't some flight officer who was supposed to listen to his hierarchy. Im pretty sure some Bomber Command crews are pretty convinced there were different ways to do the job Bomber Harris was "asked" to. But sure he knew so much better than those flying lunatics...

[m10bob]

ORIGINAL: joey

It sure says something about society. Doesn't it?

Not society...It sez a lot about the media.

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: BrucePowers

He said he wanted his ashes spread over the English Channel.

Yes; at one time he was a bomber pilot in Europe and crossed the Channel many times.

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: Ian R

I think it speaks very ill of the sensationalist press and its muck rakers to attack people like Bomber Harris and Tibbetts - they did their job when their country asked them to. Why have they been selected for criticism now? Why not the Chiefs of Staff who gave them their orders?

Tibbits got the OK for his mission from the highest authority in the land: President Truman.

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: joey

I heard about it this morning also. I notice he wanted no funeral and no grave stone. I guess he considered the ramifications of those.

Re Washington Post: "In interviews, Gen. Tibbets said he did not want a funeral or headstone because he did not want to attract protesters to his burial site."

[decaro]

Excerpts from Tibbits obit in today's Washington Post:

"... Gen. Tibbets was depicted by Hollywood leading man Robert Taylor in "Above and Beyond," a 1952 fictional account of the airman's life leading to the atomic bombing of Hiroshima ...

... His decorations included the Distinguished Service Cross, the Legion of Merit and the Distinguished Flying Cross ...

.. Gen. Tibbets was angered by the planned 50th anniversary exhibit of the Enola Gay at the Smithsonian Institution, which included a long explanation of the suffering caused by the atomic attacks. He and veterans groups said there was not enough about Japanese villainy during the war. The Smithsonian exhibit, at the National Air and Space Museum, went ahead without commentary or analysis ...

... Tibbets said that he met with President Harry S. Truman in 1948 in the Oval Office and that the president asked the airman if he had regrets. As he would for the rest of his life, Gen. Tibbets replied that he had none and had done his duty to protect the country ... "

Amen to that; some of us might not be posting here as our fathers were slated to invade Japan after defeating Germany.

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: Ian R

I think it speaks very ill of the sensationalist press and its muck rakers to attack people like Bomber Harris and Tibbetts - they did their job when their country asked them to. Why have they been selected for criticism now? Why not the Chiefs of Staff who gave them their orders?

Who are the sensationalists and muck rakers....I have yet to hear a story of Tibbetts that was not respectful. [&:]

Edit: by the way, heard an interview with Tibbetts later in his life. Turns out part of the reason he didn't want to be buried was that he wanted his ashes scattered over the North Sea. He said, "Some of my most peaceful times flying were over the North Sea"

[Ian R]

I've seen plenty from the champagne socilaist "journalists" who are all too eager to quote the mayor of Dresden or Hiroshioma: "X is a war crim" stuff. They do it to be sensational, get a by-line to self agrandize and generate advertising revenue, not for any reason to do with reporting anything resembling news.

Shame on them.

I'm not sure which country you're in, niceguy2005, perhaps you have escaped seeing it - if so, good.

[Klahn]

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

Amen to that; some of us might not be posting here as our fathers were slated to invade Japan after defeating Germany.

I don't think the a-bomb shortned the war by more than a day or two. There never would have been an invasion of Japan. The event that made Japan surrender was the Soviet declaration of war. The Japanese were not afraid of death by atomic bombing. These were the same people that threw themselves and their infant children over cliffs rather than be captured by American forces. They willfully flew aircraft into ships. The only fate they were afraid of was defeat by the Soviets. Historical documents from Japan show that the decision to surrender was based totally on the Soviet war declaration. The atomic bombings were hardly even mentioned in the discussions.

That being said, the United States certainly didn't know any of this at the time. The atomic bombings were no more morally wrong than the fire bombing of Japan's paper cities, the fire-storms over Germany, the indiscriminate bombing and rocket attacks on London, the maltreatment of POWs, the rape of Nanking, and so on... Gen. Tibbets has every reason to be proud of his service. He performed his duties honorably and deserves the respect reserved for all veterans of that war. I'm quite happy that he was able to live the rest of his life with a clear concience.

[AU Tiger_MatrixForum]

ORIGINAL: Ryvan




I don't think the a-bomb shortned the war by more than a day or two. There never would have been an invasion of Japan. The event that made Japan surrender was the Soviet declaration of war. The Japanese were not afraid of death by atomic bombing. These were the same people that threw themselves and their infant children over cliffs rather than be captured by American forces. They willfully flew aircraft into ships. The only fate they were afraid of was defeat by the Soviets. Historical documents from Japan show that the decision to surrender was based totally on the Soviet war declaration. The atomic bombings were hardly even mentioned in the discussions.

That being said, the United States certainly didn't know any of this at the time. The atomic bombings were no more morally wrong than the fire bombing of Japan's paper cities, the fire-storms over Germany, the indiscriminate bombing and rocket attacks on London, the maltreatment of POWs, the rape of Nanking, and so on... Gen. Tibbets has every reason to be proud of his service. He performed his duties honorably and deserves the respect reserved for all veterans of that war. I'm quite happy that he was able to live the rest of his life with a clear concience.

Here we go again...



Edit: The Mods may want to go ahead and lock this thread now.
[8D]

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

ORIGINAL: Ian R

I think it speaks very ill of the sensationalist press and its muck rakers to attack people like Bomber Harris and Tibbetts ...

Who are the sensationalists and muck rakers .... I have yet to hear a story of Tibbetts that was not respectful ...

Fortunately you won't hear disrespect in an obit, but Tibbits complained about what reporters had either written about him and his mission, or attributed to his critics in today's Washing Post story; in fact the Post had to use an "expletive deleted" to describe what Tibbits said re this kind of "reporting".

I can only imagine what was said re Harris; no one likes the idea of bombing civilian populations. But Tibbits claimed there wasn't a war fought w/o civilain casulaties and that it was their "tough luck for being there" or words to that effect!

I guess that makes him the perfect personality type to drop an A-bomb on someone.

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: Ryvan

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

Amen to that; some of us might not be posting here as our fathers were slated to invade Japan after defeating Germany.

I don't think the a-bomb shortned the war by more than a day or two. There never would have been an invasion of Japan. The event that made Japan surrender was the Soviet declaration of war. The Japanese were not afraid of death by atomic bombing
...

I think that after the 2nd A-bomb the Japanese realized their entire culture and way of life was going up in smoke; rumor was the Allies only had one A-bomb.

... The atomic bombings were no more morally wrong than the fire bombing of Japan's paper cities, the fire-storms over Germany, the indiscriminate bombing and rocket attacks on London, the maltreatment of POWs, the rape of Nanking, and so on ...

Author Kurt Vonegut basically felt the same way re the fire storm that consumed Dresden; there was never the moral outcry as was over Hiroshima.