Possible work around for the hard coded unit withdrawls

[shane56]

would this work as a possible work around to cancel out the hard coded unit withdrawls ?

1] copy all units that are listed to be removed to a free area of the unit's CSV file
2] set the x & y of all the original units to 0,0 in the CSV file so they do not appear on the map
3] when the hard coding wants to remove these listed units for withdrawal from the map it only removes the ones that had their x & y set to 0,0 leaving the copies still there, I hope [;)]

just so happen to have a blue scenario at the right time for the removal of 11th army so will test this process out on this, if it works I will let you know.

This hard coding of unit withdrawls or freezing is crap (should all be done through the scenario data files) as I want to setup a blue scenario where 11th army is not scattered to the winds as was done with it. OKH did not want to do this, but instead to have it around for the advance into the caucasus. Another great what if. The game engine should not dictate to us how a scenario is to develop, as we will be very much limited in what type of what if scenarios we can setup, and are forced into doing work arounds, not good.

Thankyou

[bcgames]

Have you tried messing with columns AF (Withdraw) and AV (Hidden) of the Operation Blue_Unit.csv?

[alaric318]

ORIGINAL: shane_056

would this work as a possible work around to cancel out the hard coded unit withdrawls ?

1] copy all units that are listed to be removed to a free area of the unit's CSV file
2] set the x & y of all the original units to 0,0 in the CSV file so they do not appear on the map
3] when the hard coding wants to remove these listed units for withdrawal from the map it only removes the ones that had their x & y set to 0,0 leaving the copies still there, I hope [;)]

just so happen to have a blue scenario at the right time for the removal of 11th army so will test this process out on this, if it works I will let you know.

This hard coding of unit withdrawls or freezing is crap (should all be done through the scenario data files) as I want to setup a blue scenario where 11th army is not scattered to the winds as was done with it. OKH did not want to do this, but instead to have it around for the advance into the caucasus. Another great what if. The game engine should not dictate to us how a scenario is to develop, as we will be very much limited in what type of what if scenarios we can setup, and are forced into doing work arounds, not good.

Thankyou

best greetings, well, i may give some advice or info that may be of help, in virtue the workaround you are trying may be much work, i have been away from forum all the day, so, i apologize on the delay, well,

for setting off withdraws, just make the withdraw date at 1947, month 12, day 10 or so, and you will have the units for almost all the war or up to 1946, most scenarios dont go onwards through 1945, when you click on the withdraw tab, on the unit info/management screen, just input year 1947 and month 12 and day 10, same date for both settings, and you will get a withdraw for the unit on 1946 (end game, almost allways), i just hope it works for you, all, as well work for me, and if you want the 11st german army ("early active") you have one trick on hand, you have to deploy one soviet unit on inner romania, most romanians units along with the 11st army become unfrozen, well, at least as early as start of second round, well,

, that said, as it works for me, i encourage to make these changes on a "backup" copy of your/s mod/s, some changes can make some axis units to surrender, so i advice before hand, otherwise it works perfect, i again, only hope it works for you too,

with best regards and best of luck with modding,

Murat30.

[shane56]

Thanks for the replies..
It worked [:)] I was able to retain the copied units (11th army, 11 air base, LIV & XXX corps, 170, 72, 24th infantry divs and 28 jg div) on the map, with the game engine removing only the originals, but for me it is still an enforced work around.

NOTE: Even with the withdrawal date set way into to the future for all of the original units listed above, the game engine still withdrawals them due to the hard coding, nothing can stop this, except changing the game code.

Also as you have to use the editor to do this and then save the changes, it resets the game turn number back to 1, but the game engine adjusts for this and still carries out all the other replacement and withdrawals as per the original intent of the scenario so no problem.

Will now go back to the beginning of the blue scenario insert all the changes, to setup this what if scenario with the 11th army staying the distance and re-run it without the game engine interferring.
shane

[Great_Ajax]

Withdrawals aren't hard coded. They are set in the editor. If you want to delete their withdrawals, go to the 'SHOW WITHDRAWALS' and delete their withdrawal entry by clicking on their withdrawal sequence number. It will ask you if you want to delete that withdrawal. As far as I know, just the freezing of certain units on 22 June 1941 are hard coded. If you are working on an Operation Blue scenario, there shouldn't be anything hard coded there.

Trey

ORIGINAL: shane_056

Thanks for the replies..
It worked [:)] I was able to retain the copied units (11th army, 11 air base, LIV & XXX corps, 170, 72, 24th infantry divs and 28 jg div) on the map, with the game engine removing only the originals, but for me it is still an enforced work around.

NOTE: Even with the withdrawal date set way into to the future for all of the original units listed above, the game engine still withdrawals them due to the hard coding, nothing can stop this, except changing the game code.

Also as you have to use the editor to do this and then save the changes, it resets the game turn number back to 1, but the game engine adjusts for this and still carries out all the other replacement and withdrawals as per the original intent of the scenario so no problem.

Will now go back to the beginning of the blue scenario insert all the changes, to setup this what if scenario with the 11th army staying the distance and re-run it without the game engine interferring.
shane

[shane56]

thanks for the reply, will give it a go later goto go to the rack it's 02:06 hours down here..
If this works I'II give feedback, just wish all these editor secrets were available in a proper manual, instead of falling into pot hole after pot hole and having to drag my sorry carcass out everytime, very time consuming
though I have learned a few things with this editor, so not all wasted
can only pray for mars and venus to line up (quickly) so a proper detailed manual for the editor will appear out of the ether
thanks again ..shane

[Great_Ajax]

I wouldn't wait too long for a manual. I learned by bombarding Helpless with questions which he kept answering. Just keep posting questions here and we'll try to help out.

Trey

ORIGINAL: shane_056

thanks for the reply, will give it a go later goto go to the rack it's 02:06 hours down here..
If this works I'II give feedback, just wish all these editor secrets were available in a proper manual, instead of falling into pot hole after pot hole and having to drag my sorry carcass out everytime, very time consuming
though I have learned a few things with this editor, so not all wasted
can only pray for mars and venus to line up (quickly) so a proper detailed manual for the editor will appear out of the ether
thanks again ..shane

[alaric318]

ORIGINAL: shane_056

thanks for the reply, will give it a go later goto go to the rack it's 02:06 hours down here..
If this works I'II give feedback, just wish all these editor secrets were available in a proper manual, instead of falling into pot hole after pot hole and having to drag my sorry carcass out everytime, very time consuming
though I have learned a few things with this editor, so not all wasted
can only pray for mars and venus to line up (quickly) so a proper detailed manual for the editor will appear out of the ether
thanks again ..shane

best greetings, and i agreed with said about the editor, but such work will have send the release of 1.0 maybe one full month "backwards" for january or february, and we was wanting the game as soon as possible, i guess, all players, so, i understand, on the other hand, the manual is not perfect for 1.0 release, anyways i gues it does his work perfectly and also guess most of we dont may have wish the game delayed one or two months,

best regards,

Murat30.

[shane56]

Evening, again thanks for this tip, but alas it did not work as the original units were still withdrawn and taken off the map, after I applied this process twice, with the same result each time. These original units were not only deleted off the show withdrawals list as you listed below, but they also had all their withdrawal dates set way out to 1946, but all this was to no avail, as it has to be hard coding being responsible for withdrawing these units. My work-around worked perfect both times as I had both original and copied units on the map, with the copied units still there doing the business. Any chance of finding out from G.Grigsby if hard coding is definitely involved here ? ..thanks ..shane

"Withdrawals aren't hard coded. They are set in the editor. If you want to delete their withdrawals, go to the 'SHOW WITHDRAWALS' and delete their withdrawal entry by clicking on their withdrawal sequence number. It will ask you if you want to delete that withdrawal. As far as I know, just the freezing of certain units on 22 June 1941 are hard coded. If you are working on an Operation Blue scenario, there shouldn't be anything hard coded there.
Trey"

[Great_Ajax]

I should have mentioned that you have to use the SEED WITHDRAWALS button after you make changes. This is what initializes all arrivals and withdrawals.

Trey

ORIGINAL: shane_056

Evening, again thanks for this tip, but alas it did not work as the original units were still withdrawn and taken off the map, after I applied this process twice, with the same result each time. These original units were not only deleted off the show withdrawals list as you listed below, but they also had all their withdrawal dates set way out to 1946, but all this was to no avail, as it has to be hard coding being responsible for withdrawing these units. My work-around worked perfect both times as I had both original and copied units on the map, with the copied units still there doing the business. Any chance of finding out from G.Grigsby if hard coding is definitely involved here ? ..thanks ..shane

"Withdrawals aren't hard coded. They are set in the editor. If you want to delete their withdrawals, go to the 'SHOW WITHDRAWALS' and delete their withdrawal entry by clicking on their withdrawal sequence number. It will ask you if you want to delete that withdrawal. As far as I know, just the freezing of certain units on 22 June 1941 are hard coded. If you are working on an Operation Blue scenario, there shouldn't be anything hard coded there.
Trey"

[shane56]

tried the seed button and ran the scenario again, but still the original units were withdrawn by the game engine
if you convinced that no hard coding is present then this could now be a bug requiring fixing
thanks shane

[Great_Ajax]

Send me a copy of your scenario and a list of exactly what units you are trying to withdraw and I will take a look at it tonight when I get home. You can email me at treymarshall@gmail.com. I personally built the Operation Blue scenario and built the arrival/withdrawal schedule for that scenario. They are not hard coded so it could be a bug.

Trey

ORIGINAL: shane_056

tried the seed button and ran the scenario again, but still the original units were withdrawn by the game engine
if you convinced that no hard coding is present then this could now be a bug requiring fixing
thanks shane

[Great_Ajax]

Just to be sure here, the process of changing the withdrawal schedule is:

Go to SHOW WITHDRAWALS
Delete individual withdrawal entries - game will ask you if you want to delete
SEED WITHDRAWALS
Save Scenario

Trey

[shane56]

Thanks Trey, scenario files on their way to you ..shane

[alaric318]

best greetings,

i dont playtest it but i guess it is working as Trey said, just it is can be much less work, i uploaded the screen where you click on Entry # and may delete them, but was hardcoded as Shane said, i set the 11st army on to 1946 and still after save the scenario the former date for withdraw (november 1942) was there, i hope the picture can be of any help on future scenarios and future players on wish to mod the scenarios, just i want to clarify i guess it is not a bug...

with my best regards, Murat30.