If you refuse a surrender request will a nation offer to surrender again?

[ulver]

Or does a refused surrender request means it is now a fight to the death?

[Bossy573]

I have (accidentally) declared war on a country after accepting a surrender and they surrendered again a few turns later. I would assume they will offer again after you beat them up some more - but I don't know for sure.

[Myrddraal]

Yes, it is possible for them to offer surrender a second time.

Nations offer surrender when their national morale reaches zero. If you reject their offer, they get a morale boost, but that morale boost can be worn down again. Don't count on it though... you may find yourself fighting a protracted war, wishing you had accepted their first offer.

[ulver]

Damn – in a multiplayer game The Italians offered to surrender but just that turn they had landed and cut the rail line to a huge force in Southern Italy. I couldn’t accept without having my forces stranded. Guess I have to live with the Italians in the fight.

Think it takes a lot for them to offer peace terms btw.....

[Bossy573]

Does that Italian unit in France (above Nice) remain or is it removed from the board? Also, what happens if the Entente make a landing in Italy (after surrender), do they have to DOW Italy?

[Myrddraal]

do they have to DOW Italy?

If they're landing in (now neutral) Italian territory, then yes.

About that rail line cut... hexes which are out of supply are gifted to the surrounding nation on surrender... so you could have accepted!

[warspite1]

How come I didn't see this - as the Italian player (I assume that's our game ulver?). I saw nothing to say my units were looking to surrender. much less any response...

[ulver]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

How come I didn't see this - as the Italian player (I assume that's our game ulver?). I saw nothing to say my units were looking to surrender. much less any response...

Yes our game. I refused so I expect that is why no message. No doubt you noticed Italian morale whent up? BTW, nice job smashing the Germans on the Western front. (I suppose it helps that more then my german armies are in Italy [:D])

[ulver]

ORIGINAL: Myrddraal

do they have to DOW Italy?

If they're landing in (now neutral) Italian territory, then yes.

About that rail line cut... hexes which are out of supply are gifted to the surrounding nation on surrender... so you could have accepted!

Damn!!! Now they tell me. Well, I assume Italian morale goes down if they can’t pay their bills? – Time to unleash the zeppelin strategic bomber and force them into bankruptcy.

Actually I wish you had a more moderate sue for peace mechanism. This isn’t WWII where a conquered nation expects to essentially cease as an independent nation. Everyone expected the loser in a war to pay reparations and cede a few provinces. There really should be a – nation sue for a conditional peace – mechanism. If you ever release an expansion with better diplomacy Italy might hand over Venice and retune to neutrality for instance. Russia might well break into several nations, Baltic States, The Ukraine, Belorussia.

[Myrddraal]

Sorry [:'(].

That's a nice idea for a feature (some kind of conditional surrender). Definitely one we'll consider if we go that far down the diplomacy route.

How would you see it work, would there be some kind of in-game horse trading or would be an automatic thing (i.e. on surrender you get a list of terms which you either accept or reject).

[ulver]

ORIGINAL: Myrddraal

Sorry [:'(].

That's a nice idea for a feature (some kind of conditional surrender). Definitely one we'll consider if we go that far down the diplomacy route.

How would you see it work, would there be some kind of in-game horse trading or would be an automatic thing (i.e. on surrender you get a list of terms which you either accept or reject).

If you want to make it reasonable simple a conditional surrender always has the same result of giving up territory that would have been in play historically, perhaps combined with a lump sum of reparation depending on the size of the victory. A beaten Italy for instance would cede Venice to Austria-Hungary. A defeated Russia would sign the Brest-Litovsk peace and possible disintegrate into civil war, a defeated Ottoman empire would cede the Middle East to Britain/France in accordance with the Sykes–Picot Agreement and hand over a section of the Caucasus to Russia as well as opening up the Bosporus for allied navel transport.

I expect just coding one conditional victory pr nation would be much easier then making an actual negotiated surrender engine.

If you ever implement an actual diplomacy engineer then the harsher terms the victor impose the more hostile the defeated nation is and the easier it would be to lure it then back into the war later.