Ship Repair thoughts

[stjeand]

So in watching many ship videos...I was wondering why ship repairs are SO quick in this game?
To add to that...larger ships almost always had to go back to their home country to be repaired...since few other countries had the facilities to repair a CV or BB, even CA / CL for that matter.

How to address this simply is a bit more difficult...

1) Repair times...I always thought of damage to a ship as major where as efficiency was minor damage as well as supplies and crew readiness. So to keep with simplicity...repair times should be quadrupled to be honest.
Even the Yamato the biggest ship should take more than 2 months to fully repair. Likely each repair point should require multiple turns. Almost always I read ship X hit a mine or got hit by one bomb and was in dry dock for 6 months. Others seem fast, the Shokaku was repaired in 10 days after multiple bombs and a torpedo. But that could be due to the lack of armor so repairs were quicker.

2) Repair location. Another sticky point. CV and BB should only be able to be repaired in home ports if their damage is more than 1 point...I have never read a story that says oh CV X took a bomb and they repaired it at Truk or Pearl Harbor. Perhaps ships could be repaired enough to "travel" to the home port. So ships bottomed in Peal Harbor would be repaired and sent back to the mainland for repairs as they were in reality. Ships like the California were bottomed in Pearl and not fully repaired for over 2 years. As it stands it can be repaired and attacking Japan by Feb 42 after being bottomed.


I had more to bring up but work is crazy busy...

[ncc1701e]

I have never read a story that says oh CV X took a bomb and they repaired it at Truk or Pearl Harbor.

The USS Yorktown (CV-5) maybe? But, I agree with you this is the exception.

[ncc1701e]

Well looking at the map, what about CV and BB could be repaired ONLY in port level 9?
This way, they have to travel to it, repair and then travel back. More turns spent.

Works for UK (African bases), Japan (Tokyo, Hong Kong, Manila) and USA. Only problem is that Pearl Harbor is a port level 9. And it seems you don't like it.

But bottom ships need to be repaired fully before moving. So, it does not work. If a CV is bottomed in Rabaul, it is lost for the whole game. Not good.

[stjeand]

In reading most of the bottomed ships got raised and had to sail to the West Coast to be repaired.

Some that had less damage were fixed in Pearl but not many.

Should be able to repair a ship 1 point and then sail to the home country...That would work. Though maybe not something that could implemented until WP2

[ncc1701e]

Should be able to repair a ship 1 point and then sail to the home country...That would work. Though maybe not something that could implemented until WP2

Then we are going back to the earlier complain that bottomed ships were escaping when enemy troops were taking port. Like the bottomed Repulse or Prince of Wales escaping despite the Japanese taking Singapore.

[stjeand]

You still have to repair them 1 point...to sail...

I have not complained about that...others may have.
Honestly I would not care if they "escaped" so long as they were out of action for a while.

As it is they are back in a few weeks...

Not that you can sink them in Singapore anyways. The DEI fighter decimates the Japanese attacks.
It used to be an actual surprise attack so it did not fly now it does.
10 tests I think I sank 1 ship there once and never bottomed one with 5 attacks.

[ncc1701e]

Not that you can sink them in Singapore anyways. The DEI fighter decimates the Japanese attacks.
It used to be an actual surprise attack so it did not fly now it does.
10 tests I think I sank 1 ship there once and never bottomed one with 5 attacks.

Yes Alvaro says he will do something in the next patch.

[ncc1701e]

As it is they are back in a few weeks...

Depends on your priority, in my latest PBEM, the Arizona BB is still bottomed in Pearl Harbor in March 1942. I prefer to use my PP for other stuff. But yes, they are quick to repair also I am not an expert.

I don't see the solution. A lucky air strike blocking a ship bottomed in a port for the rest of the war is not good as well.
Also, I am sure it happened in reality.

If this is not a problem, following rule may work:

• Patrol Grp, DD and CA can be repaired in port level 5 or higher

• BB, CVE, CVL and CV can only be repaired in port level 9 (i.e. not far from home except Hong Kong and Manila)

[stjeand]

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Depends on your priority, in my latest PBEM, the Arizona BB is still bottomed in Pearl Harbor in March 1942. I prefer to use my PP for other stuff. But yes, they are quick to repair also I am not an expert.

I don't see the solution. A lucky air strike blocking a ship bottomed in a port for the rest of the war is not good as well.
Also, I am sure it happened in reality.

If this is not a problem, following rule may work:

• Patrol Grp, DD and CA can be repaired in port level 5 or higher

• BB, CVE, CVL and CV can only be repaired in port level 9 (i.e. not far from home except Hong Kong and Manila)

Yes that is true that the ship could sit there...which as we know is fine. The US did leave some for months as they could only raise so many before sending them back to dry dock on the West Coast...
I am sure they only had so many places to repair / build ships and they were "tied" up...

[ncc1701e]

Something interesting here. Maybe the repair pace is finally not too bad:
https://www.history.com/news/after-pear ... -u-s-fleet

Once Pearl Harbor Navy Yard personnel, assisted by tenders and ships’ crewmen, began recovery work on the damaged ships, it proceeded swiftly. Within just three months, by February 1942, USS Pennsylvania, USS Maryland and USS Tennessee, along with the cruisers Honolulu, Helena and Raleigh; the destroyers Helm and Shaw; the seaplane tender Curtiss; the repair ship Vestal and the floating drydock YFD-2 were back in service or had been refloated and transported by steam to the mainland United States for final repairs. The most heavily damaged of the small ships, the Raleigh and Shaw, were returned to active duty by mid-1942.

As for the rest of the fleet, it was clear that the five other battleships, two destroyers, a target ship and a minelayer suffered more severe damage, and would require extensive work just to get them to the point where repairs could be made. A week after the raid, a salvage organization was formally established to work on these more heavily damaged vessels. Led by Captain Homer N. Wallin, previously a member of the Battle Force Staff, the Salvage Division scored one of its greatest triumphs when it refloated the USS Nevada in February 1942.

With one large and many small holes blown into its hull, USS Nevada had sunk in shallow water, which made salvage work possible but not easy. Navy and civilian divers made some 400 dives and spent around 1,500 hours working on the Nevada alone, and two men lost their lives after inhaling the toxic gases accumulated in the ship’s interior. After being refloated, repaired and steamed to Puget Sound Navy Yard in Washington State for more permanent repairs, the Nevada rejoined the active U.S. fleet in late 1942.

[stjeand]

Though keep in mind that was as fast as they could go.

Those ships probably had 1 damage...others as you can read bottomed.

They started work on them immediately so it took 2 months to repair, in essence, 1 point or so enough so that they could send the ships to the mainland for more major repairs.

Repairing a ship fully from the bottom in 3 turns (6 weeks) seems way off.

[AlvaroSousa]

Not over complicating ship repair. WP2 I was considering players using shipyards to repair units.

[stjeand]

Not over complicating ship repair. WP2 I was considering players using shipyards to repair units.

Shipyards would be better...and they should have a location. OR a port has X repair points.
For example perhaps a 5 size port has 1 point it can repair OR that is max it could repair a ship...so a ship with 2 damage could not be repaired there.

Just a thought to not overly complicate things.

[stjeand]

BUT for me...TIME is the issue.

Damage is too quickly repaired. Especially for the Allies that have enough points to repair everything many times over.

Knowing that they had to travel back to the West Coast to receive major repairs would be helpful.

[AlvaroSousa]

Consider that they have to travel back to PH 1-2 turns
Then repair if they are crippled ~2 turns
Then sail out again 1-2 turns.

If it is the Philippines that is 6 turns = 12 weeks = 3 months.
If it is the Marshals that is 4 turns = 8 weeks = 2 months.

Not unreasonable.

[ncc1701e]

I was reading something about the HMS Exeter an heavy cruiser. It fought the Battle of the River Plate on Dec 13th, 1939. It was heavily damaged by the heavy cruiser Admiral Graf Spee. HMS Exeter went to Port Stanley for emergency repairs which took until January 1940. Then it was repaired and modernised at HM Dockyard, Devonport between Feb 14th, 1940 and Mar 10th, 1941. It was sunk during the Second Battle of the Java Sea on Mar 1st, 1942.

But, in the same time, in the Battle of the Eastern Solomons, on Aug 24th, 1942, the USS Enterprise (CV-6) suffered three direct bomb hits, inflicting serious damage on the carrier. And, it was repaired at Pearl Harbor between Sep 10th, 1942 and Oct 16th, 1942.

So it really depends.

[stjeand]

Carrier decks were mostly wood...so repairs were quick.

But waterline damage required drydock and many months of repairs.


To me...

1 damage is emergency type repairs. Things that can be fixed quickly. NO drydock required.
2 damage is much more extensive...should require a larger port with facilities to repair.
3+ damage or bottomed ship should require drydock in your home country. Sorry but the Philippines did not have facilities to repair say the Yamato or the Enterprise. They would have to go back to their home country for repair. Simple yes...but not a good representation.

Simple would be to change most ports to an 8 or below outside of your home country. Then say 9+ required to fix bottomed ship or 3+ damage to a ship.
7/8 could repair 2+
5/6 could repair 1.


The UK is a different mess since they would normally have to go back to the UK...that one would be tougher to handle. Though a quick loop to get to an "island" that had a 9 port on it would do it. Though how long to get there?

[ncc1701e]

But, again, how do you transport bottomed ships? Also, all ships except BB have 3 steps only including CV and CVL.

[stjeand]

Perhaps for bottomed ships...Unit should be at "0" points...it is sunk just not too deep.
One repair point IF port is in supply, then can move, but only if the port is in supply.

Sorry missed CVs...they would have to go to the homeland after 2 damage.

CAs are "smaller" so allowing them and DDs to be repaired other places is fine.


Honestly this is just a thought...
I was reading a lot recently about ships and seeing that they are out of action often for 6 months at a time while refitting and repairing.

[Platoonist]

The UK is a different mess since they would normally have to go back to the UK...that one would be tougher to handle. Though a quick loop to get to an "island" that had a 9 port on it would do it. Though how long to get there?

The UK did have closer (and substantial) dry dock facilities at Trincomalee, Ceylon and Capetown, South Africa. There was also a huge dry dock at Changi Naval Base in Singapore. The graving dock there was completed in February 1938 and was more than 300 m (980 ft) in length and was the largest dry dock in the world at the time, but it usually isn't British for long. After repairing it in 1942, the Japanese did use it for the repair and maintenance of their carriers, battleships and cruisers stationed in the area although they always had to worry about sabotage from the local Malay and Chinese workers.

Even major Japanese overseas naval bases like Truk or Rabaul were only good for temporary repairs to capital ships. Once patched up they were usually sent back to Japan for the heavy duty mending. For both sides, the large bases and ports back home had the extensive machine shops and trained personnel to perform the necessary work in the shortest amount of time and the greatest amount of safety.

Pearl Harbor was a great forward asset for the USN but they always had to keep in mind not to swamp it's limited yard space with too many repair jobs.