Supply system fix (First Pass)

[el cid again]

I have made and run a first test of a supply system.
Anomolies in the test caused me to look at the database in more detail.
I found that many locations - not just those at the map edges - have secret sources (wells?) of supplies, fuel, oil and/or resources. These go a long way toward explaining why you see supplies moving from tryly minor and obscure places you never sent them to. It appears that problems caused modders (or sometimes Matrix) to put them in - preventing the supply systems from working - if work they will.

I created about a hundred supply sinks - and I did so without needing a single slot - to my utter amazement. These sinks are simply added devices to existing units. In addition to coast defense units - which are already pretty immobile in most cases - and which I made even more immobile by adding "static facilities" at about 1 per 2 heavy guns - 1 per one very heavy gun - I also put static devices into major HQ - which I pretend represent large communication stations - and these then became available when at locations where there were no CD units. These seem to cover about 95% of locations of interest - enough for a test.

The first test indicates that the fear the system cannot handle the calculations - that it would break or slow down - is not an issue.
The problem is, not much really changed - and I have discovered I have to redo the system with all the "secret" supply sources removed - except of course where they feed the map edge you go to when getting things from outside.

I also found the system does not permit sufficient stores in locations like Hawaii or San Francisco - it simply cannot have numbers that big. So I have devised a way to simulate these - using the "free" supply "wells" - it isn't that you are really teleporting fuel to Oahu - it is that for decades it has been sent - and so it appears every day - from tanks higher up the hill I guess.

[pad152]

Movement of Major HQ's

The allies start with Northern & Southern command HQ's at Oahu. In my view these should be able to be moved.

Isn't there a supply releationship between the HQ's (Higher level and HQ's with better leaders get more supply). So shouldn't moving the HQ's also help move the supply lines?

Isn't the major Japanese supply issue due to AI? If you put anything under AI control, it liked to send 10K of supplies to every single remote location.

[m10bob]

ORIGINAL: pad152

Movement of Major HQ's

The allies start with Northern & Southern command HQ's at Oahu. In my view these should be able to be moved.

Isn't there a supply releationship between the HQ's (Higher level and HQ's with better leaders get more supply). So shouldn't moving the HQ's also help move the supply lines?

Isn't the major Japanese supply issue due to AI? If you put anything under AI control, it liked to send 10K of supplies to every single remote location.

It seems to indicate Sid has identified the root cause of past MAJOR supply problems, and a proposal to fix them. If it works, I'm ready for a trade-off (if a trade-off is needed.)
In past, modders have gotten zilch assistance (for legal or other reasons) and if Sids' info is correct, this is a MAJOR breakthru.........................

[RevRick]

Granted I haven't had a lot of experience with CHS or any of its itterations, but I have a questionfrom the one time I had it up before my game computer decided to get sick. That is why all of the sudden some of the bases on the West Coast need 38K supply points per month when about the only active thing I have seen at the base was a group of sea scouts guarding the local purveyor of horizontal refreshment. That's one thing I noticed right away. Is this a result of a change in the number of static units in those ports?

[akdreemer]

ORIGINAL: RevRick

Granted I haven't had a lot of experience with CHS or any of its itterations, but I have a questionfrom the one time I had it up before my game computer decided to get sick. That is why all of the sudden some of the bases on the West Coast need 38K supply points per month when about the only active thing I have seen at the base was a group of sea scouts guarding the local purveyor of horizontal refreshment. That's one thing I noticed right away. Is this a result of a change in the number of static units in those ports?

This is hard coded into the game. All Canadian and West Coast ports for some reason have this feature.

[el cid again]

Movement of Major HQ's

The allies start with Northern & Southern command HQ's at Oahu. In my view these should be able to be moved.

Following suggestions by AK Warrior - and discussion on the board - I have modified this. We have renamed Central Pacific as Pacific Fleet - and it is too major to move - nor can its infrastructure be moved very fast or easily. We have renamed North Pacific as Alaska Command - which solves the problem of being able to move between islands which a command like Canada or Western could not handle. And we allow South Pacific to appear when it really did - and appear in Oahu - but be mobile so you can move it. SOME other major commands can move - some that did and some that probably should have - but many really are "stuck" by political and or physical considerations. The Dutch HQ (ABDA and ABDA Flot) won't move - nor will the British theater (SE Asia) or Eastern Fleet.
But the President can order Mac to evacuate USAFFE - and it will go with him if he does - and can avoid getting sunk in the process. Asiatic Fleet more or less "pre moved" - before hostilities began - and it also can move - giving you some nice HQ where you like. Others can as well. But some won't - Chiang cannot move ROC HQ - it is in the traditional "last" Chinese capital (there are three capitals of unified China) - and it won't move again. [Joes says Chunking cannot be taken anyway, so this may not be a problem]. But the ROC should be forced to stand and defend Chunking at all costs. By this stage of the war the Chinese population was very upset - and basically it was not an option to abandon the last remaining significant urban center. [China has a traditional way to deal with rulers - always absolute dictators - who lose the mandate of heaven - a way that has the current not so absolute dictators terrified. We don't understand this very well - but while the mandate of heaven limited fighting - it also involved the death of everyone near the top - often at the hands of their most trusted people (who don't want to also die).]

[el cid again]

Isn't there a supply releationship between the HQ's (Higher level and HQ's with better leaders get more supply). So shouldn't moving the HQ's also help move the supply lines?

There is more than that. There is an effect on combat operations, and in some cases, effects on repair of ships. Precisely because it matters, the scenario designer (or modder) needs to think about every case. Pacific Fleet needs to be in Hawaii, Eastern Fleet needs to be in Columbo, and the list is fairly long. On the other hand, some HQ did move, and these represent assets which (IMHO) properly can be regarded as mobile. So they should be allowed to move. Both political and technical factors are involved: If you need very long range very low frequency radio transmitters, you don't just say "pack up the radio, let move" in the usual sense, for example. And there are things used for HF intercept - we call them "Wollenwebber arrays" after the German inventer - and these are best sited at certain places - and expensive - and not easy to move. So the Alaskan Command - which has one at Elmendorf Field (to this day - it is also a naval activity on an air force base) - is not free to move to (say) Adak to get better command over an invasion of Hokkaido. Its ability to contribute to intercept triangulations is dependent on its location. Considerations of this sort - and politics too - won't let some commands move. [But I did move Canada Command back from the coast - so it can function even if Vancouver falls].

[el cid again]

Isn't the major Japanese supply issue due to AI? If you put anything under AI control, it liked to send 10K of supplies to every single remote location.

Well - it turns out these issues are somewhat related to things like port size. This I hope to bring under control by various means. And a private discussion has caused mapmakers more or less to agree on a mechanism to keep Japan isolated from Asia - it is possible for players never to need ANY ships to move UNLIMITED resources and supplies - if they figure out a gamey trick - and we are breaking that option in advance. If we don't do that, Japan needs no ships to import or export anything, at least if players stumble on how to make it happen.

[el cid again]

Granted I haven't had a lot of experience with CHS or any of its itterations, but I have a questionfrom the one time I had it up before my game computer decided to get sick. That is why all of the sudden some of the bases on the West Coast need 38K supply points per month when about the only active thing I have seen at the base was a group of sea scouts guarding the local purveyor of horizontal refreshment. That's one thing I noticed right away. Is this a result of a change in the number of static units in those ports?

Andrew - who may be a genius - has figured a lot of this out - and he posted that it is a code thing. I now believe that to be the case. IF it was easy to fix - it would be fixed by modders. I have just figured out how to fix it too - another test is brewing! Thanks for asking.

[Mifune]

Kudos to cid and all that are working on the mod. With all the potential fixes, this might be the new standard to be played.