CHS 2.x.y LCU OOB TOE Discussion

[jwilkerson]

I am starting this thread as there have been some questions about the LCU OOBs and TOEs on the main forum and going into the details of those types of questions, really belongs over here. So feel free to ask or comment and we will try to give answers or identify needed corrections as appropriate.

Thx.

[jwilkerson]

Reposting Rommel3's question over here ...


Terminus/ That's exactly What i want. Thank you! Recently, I eager to figure out Mortars position in Japaneses OOB. And then I think we should remove 81mm, 91mm mortats from japanes div' OOB and handle this separate mortar Bn.

jwilkerson/ According to the recently released CHS mod, T92 HMG squad's size is 17 man too. Does HMG platoon have the grenade launcher sections too?

HMG "platoon" (actually a sub-section of 1 MG) does not have grenade launcher. HMG sub-section (of 1 MG) represents 1 gun and its crew and additional ammunition bearing "entities" (which could be cart and beast or 2 legged conveyance).

[ny59giants]

I am going through the Allies bases by base and unit by unit since all my WitP experience was on stock maps with only Nik Mod as a variant (a game against the AI while my two opponents and I await some minor adjustments). I like this CHS format and maps a lot and appreciate the effort many have put into it.
I see that in the Solomons, there are only bases at Shortlands, Buin, and Tulagi. Why isn't there one at Gudalcanal that needs to be built up from zero for air capacity?? It shows up only as a dot hex. I see that Thursday Island is on the Oz side vs. NG. Is it attached to mainland Australia for ground movement? Should it actually be an island in that hex?

[jwilkerson]

Well this is more of a "base" question than an LCU question and thus is Andrew's area .. but hopefully he will see and answer ...

[Rommel3]

In the CHS , HMG squads got 17 size(load cost).  Historicaly HMG section crews were 3 men size.
Is HMG squad (in CHS) a rifle squad + a HMG section? If not, i think resize it as 3 load cost.

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: Rommel3

In the CHS , HMG squads got 17 size(load cost).  Historicaly HMG section crews were 3 men size.
Is HMG squad (in CHS) a rifle squad + a HMG section? If not, i think resize it as 3 load cost.

The data we considered indicated that HMG platoons had 46 men and 4 HMGs .. with 2 men as HQ and 11 man for each HMG ... in addition, the 174 man MG Company with 12 HMGs ... would have 14.5 men per gun (the extra men being the "allocation" from the company ammunition platoon) ... further we "added" an extra 2.5 men from the Battalion trains (17 total) ... to support forward ammunition supply to the HMG company.

In truth the size 17 was also kept to preserve the original design which we (we think) just called the HMGs "rifle squads" ... by preserving the size and firepower of the HMG "squads" relative to the rifle squads, we did not disturb the firepower of the division, with regard to small arms, something we were reluctant to do without extensive testing, which for us is impossible and at the same time however, we were able to show the TO&E as having both the correct number of rifle squads and the correct number of HMGs.

Overall division firepower however, was significantly reduced (in many cases) by reduction of the artillery component, something we felt we had to do for historical correctness and in complete triangularization of the divisional OOB at start (the few "extra" regiments are however, all accounted for in the OOB).

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants
I see that in the Solomons, there are only bases at Shortlands, Buin, and Tulagi. Why isn't there one at Gudalcanal that needs to be built up from zero for air capacity?? It shows up only as a dot hex.

A dot base is still a base. Lunga is still there, and can be built up.

I see that Thursday Island is on the Oz side vs. NG. Is it attached to mainland Australia for ground movement? Should it actually be an island in that hex?

Thursday Island is now in its correct location, unlike the stock map. It is still an island - there is no land bridge from the hex to the mainland.

Andrew

[Don Bowen]

[quote]ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown
Thursday Island is now in its correct location...
Andrew

Yeah, but what about Wednesday Island and Friday Island??

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen
Yeah, but what about Wednesday Island and Friday Island??

I prefer Saturday Island and Sunday Island...

[Don Bowen]

ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen
Yeah, but what about Wednesday Island and Friday Island??

I prefer Saturday Island and Sunday Island...

Friday Island is just West of Horn Island and Wednesday Island is somewhere in the reefs (to the NE I think). Some old sailing ship must have spent the middle of the week discovering these little islands and ran out of good names. Which begs the question how Horn Island got its name.

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

Friday Island is just West of Horn Island and Wednesday Island is somewhere in the reefs (to the NE I think). Some old sailing ship must have spent the middle of the week discovering these little islands and ran out of good names. Which begs the question how Horn Island got its name.

Obviously it was also discovered on Wednesday. (Also known as _ _ _ _ day. Rhymes with 'bump'.)

[Monter_Trismegistos]

I posted this already in main forum...

Can anybody tell me which units were part of:
I USA Corps Art.
IX USA Corps Art.
X USA Corps Art.
XI USA Corps Art.
XII USA Corps Art.
XIV USA Corps Art.
XXIV USA Corps Art.
III USMC Corps Art.
V USMC Corps Art.
168th USA Art. Group
191st USA Art. Group
419th USA Art. Group
and
420th USA Art. Group ? They had in real only 4 Bns?

[Montbrun]

Most of the Corps Artillery units were redesignated from Artillery Regiments, Brigades and Groups. The components are kinda hard to track down....

[Monter_Trismegistos]

Niehorster gives some info about Artillery Bdes, but is that true that Corps had only one ex-brigade attached (only 36 guns)?

Also only brigades which beacame IX, X, XI and XIII Corps Artilleries are listed there.

And also it lists 208th Hvy Atty Rgt from 14th FA Bde, which became III Corps Atty - this unit is not present in stock neither in CHS.

[akdreemer]

ORIGINAL: Monter_Trismegistos

Niehorster gives some info about Artillery Bdes, but is that true that Corps had only one ex-brigade attached (only 36 guns)?

Also only brigades which beacame IX, X, XI and XIII Corps Artilleries are listed there.

And also it lists 208th Hvy Atty Rgt from 14th FA Bde, which became III Corps Atty - this unit is not present in stock neither in CHS.

The trouble is these is that they were really just Command HQ's which controlled the various BN's assigned. The fixed Regimental and Brigade assets became independent Battalions early in the war. These Battalions were shuffled around on an as needed basis to the higher HQ's, their assigment to any one artillery HQ is seen most often as temporary. In other words they were not fixed formations, as they have to be in WITP. Also, after an extensive review in Shelby Stanton's work in the US Army OOB (I managed to get the revised editon published this year), the total guns assigned do no match the totals of the units that actually served. For my personal scenario I have reworked these and added several missing ones. As an example, there are no 8" or 240mm BN.s in 1944, way too many 155how, and not enough 105's, corrected in my scenario.

[Monter_Trismegistos]

I am asking because I don't like such big units and I would like to replace them by Art Rgts and Bns...

[DuckofTindalos]

We agree (more flexibility and whatnot), but are there slots enough for them?

[Rommel3]

Osprey (Battle order 009) mentioned Japanese recon regment have 7~8 light tank or armored car. But did not Specify  exact model. Which armor model was used by recon Rgt's early war?

[Monter_Trismegistos]

I've counted 94 free slots in current CHS release - I think it's enough for the task.

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: Monter_Trismegistos

I've counted 94 free slots in current CHS release - I think it's enough for the task.

These might be slotted for use with new Russian OB ... but regardless ... if you want to prioritize US Arty over Russians ... then removing any number of Russian units would certainly make room.