PzB vs Wobbly - Clash of Steel

[DuckofTindalos]

Sounds like something you'd get up to, Tubbsy...

[Nikademus]

which is more than can be said for you dough boy. (you'd need a crane)

I'm particularily fond of my battleship turret top photos. [:D]

[DuckofTindalos]

Interesting that you never posted photos of the dents your pudgy carcass left in the steel...

But we'll take this out of PzB's AAR...

[Nikademus]

They were up for a while on warships1.com but the webmaster had to take down that section of the site a couple years ago due to rising internet costs. I'd have to rescan the photo essays. Alot o photos of the Texas and Massachussetts

[PzB74]

[:D] It's the KT in Bovington....and the poor museums guard had NADA hope of stopping the invading
army of Vikings from climbing all over his exhibition [;)]

The KT photo is actually a 're-pose' of a real picture were a grenadier rides the barrel of a KT in Budapest in 1945!
Couldn't find it on the net when I searched for it, probably buried in one of my books.

[The Duke]

That's a King Tiger?  Looks kinda like a Panther turret for some reason....
 

[roeddog]

I play WWII Online, and they do, do wonders against stus, although a well placed shot by a sherm can take em out but you usually only get one shot.[:-] so don't miss!

ORIGINAL: PzB

Meanwhile in Berlin; yearly Axis Fanboy panzer mess

A division of these would do wonders against Stuarts and Shermans [:D]

[DuckofTindalos]

ORIGINAL: The Duke

That's a King Tiger?  Looks kinda like a Panther turret for some reason....

The King Tiger turret did sort of look like a Panther. Just bigger...

[Marten]

it's KT with porshe turret

[Nikademus]

Yep the Porche turret is unmistakable. Cool looking.....too bad about the natural shot trap however.
[:D]

[PzB74]

I've always considered the King Tiger as more of a Panther II than a Tiger II.
Tiger I didn't even have sloping armour and belonged to the 'box' shaped tanks.

[DuckofTindalos]

Much more modern looking tank, not to mention more effective...

Then with the Jagdtiger and Sturmtiger, they went back to the box-on-treads approach.

[PzB74]

The Panther II would have been the logical successor to both the King Tiger and Panther:

1943 - German Panther II PzKw 5 Ausf F
Armament; 1 - 7.5cm (3") KwK 42 L/70 gun
1 - 7.92mm MG 34
Engine: Maybach, HL 234, V-12, gas, 800 hp
Speed: 29 mph
Range: 110 miles
Crew: 5
Weight: 57 tons

When production of the Panther began in 1943, plans were made for a Panther II with heavier frontal and side armor but capable of the same performance as the Panther I. This was an attempt to create a hybrid vehicle which combined components from early Panther tanks with those of the yet to be built Tiger II. Two prototypes were ordered, and one with a normal Panther I turret was delivered. The Panther II was to be equipped with an improved Schmalturm. Only one specimen remains which was recovered from an artillery range in Lackhill England. See photo by Andrew Longstaff. This compact turret with a built in rangefinder was designed by Daimler Benz for the Panther Ausf F. It was to mount a modified version of the 75mm gun known as the KwK 44/1. This Panther II at Ft. Knox, Kentucky, is the sole survivor. Weight increased to 57 tons and the prototype used the running gear of the King Tiger. Only 7 wheels per side were used and were staggered to enable the use of a single torsion bar. Hydraulic steering with a reinforced gear box was used. The project was abandoned and many of the advanced features such as all steel road wheels and deeply sloped armor were incorporated into the Model G Panther I in late production models.

[Nikademus]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Much more modern looking tank, not to mention more effective...

against which tank are you referring/comparing? [&:]

[PzB74]

The Tiger II was one of the best heavy tanks of the war together with:
KV-85
JSIII
Centurion
Pershing

These are all 'medium' tanks compared to the 70 ton Tiger II, but they were all heavy tanks when
you compare them to other Allied tanks of the time.

It arrived quite early though and was best suited in a defensive role. The Panther was much
more suited for offensive operations and the Panther II would have been a match for any Allied tank
in 1945. Love playing 1945 battles in Steel Panthers World at War were these tanks clash [8D]

[DuckofTindalos]

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Much more modern looking tank, not to mention more effective...

against which tank are you referring/comparing? [&:]

The Tiger I.

[Nikademus]

Yes, but if Termy was comparing the Tiger I to II, i'd probably disagree a bit on the "more effective part" While an awesome and beatiful tank, armed with the best anti-tank gun of the war, I often considered it just way to big and complicated to be considered "more effective". The Tiger 1 may have been boxy, but it made up for it in part with the thickness and quality of the armor and the tank driver could at least present on oblique target to whatever threat was being faced increasing the armor value even more. The 88 was less powerful than the 71cal but at the time was deadly enough to take out hundreds of enemy tanks over the course of it's career.

The King Tiger has even more impressive armor on the front and sloped (if quality is a bit less) but this is negated in part by the huge side profle which is no better protected than the Tiger I's.

Because of this i'll usually pick the JS-III as the best heavy tank. The Soviets well understood the value of low profile and cost effectiveness. The Germans though can be given kudos for producing the best positioned heavy tank in terms of time period in the Tiger I. Beats out all the other heavy tanks because the Germans seem to be the only ones who realized at the time that you need a gun powerful enough to enhance your armor protection by allowing you to stand off from the enemy. That was the KV-1's biggest failing as well as the Churchill's.....no better armed than a medium forcing them to fight at closer range.

LoL...this seems to get borne out in every SP game i play. Whenever i have a KT group, i always lose them to either air or side shot attacks. I have better luck with Tiger I's [:D]

[DuckofTindalos]

Interesting how this WitP AAR has turned into a discussion of German tanks, just because somebody's pilot pool overflowed.[:D]

If you give me a choice between Tiger I and Tiger II, I'll still take the Tiger II. Bigger gun, properly sloped armour (which can be the difference between life and death)... The only problem was that it was too big, as Nik pointed out...

[PzB74]

The Panther II with the 88 would be the perfect combo of Panther and Tiger [8D]
After years of UV and WitP I do miss Eastern Front....and I wish Matrix could get some more resources for it [&o]
Playing around with Stuarts and even more obscure Jap tanks just doesn't do the trick <G>

[DuckofTindalos]

The Type 92 Tankette not good enough for you?[:'(]