Coastal Defence Units

[mikeyjones]

I've had a good look through all threads and have read (and utilised) most of Wobbly's 101 on amphibious landings but I still consistently get spanked in amphibious landings by the CD unit. This is despite weeks and weeks of pre-invasion bombardment by air and sea. Not once have I been able to spot intel to show that the CD unit has been attacked and some guns damaged / destroyed. I recognise that the "strongest" unit is the one that gets bombed but it is a little disappointing when bombers are picking on ENG units to see most of my APs severly damaged with loss of LCU strength (thus scuppering my long term plans!) with the message "387 coastal gunshots fired in defence".

Despite being in Nov '42 of my first campaign game and still in learning mode, I think I pretty much get it but the consistent spanking from CD units is affecting my sanity and ability to mount rapid amphibious operations, i.e. I quickly run out of undamaged APs.

Looking forward to some wisdom. Another year of playing and, you never know, I could be ready for a PBEM game. I'd probably need to give up work before that though as things get a little time-consuming.


Mikey.

[Ron Saueracker]

It is very difficult to not get spanked by CD units because of the way the game is designed (All guns from the entire 60 mile hex, including mortars, get to fire on your ships as if they were dedicated naval rifles with director control and the guns fire not only on your troops landing but on the landing ships far out off shore . Isolation of the enemy base to starve it is recommended but not always possible. Heavy pre invasion bombardments are a must, but placing armoured ships like cruisers and battleships in your invasion TFs is crucial to absorb alot of the fire and to suppress the CD unit during the CD fire phase. (apparently fire support ships do this but this may not be working as well as intended) Lastly,keep the number of amphibious TFs to a minimum as CD units, like everything else, don't seem to have any limit on the number of actions they can perform in a phase. (ie, a CD unit will fire 10 times if you have ten TFs landing troops or just once if you have one TF).

[DuckofTindalos]

And make sure you turn "Escorts Bombard" OFF. Those thin-skinned destroyers are horribly vulnerable...

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: mikeyjones

I've had a good look through all threads and have read (and utilised) most of Wobbly's 101 on amphibious landings but I still consistently get spanked in amphibious landings by the CD unit. This is despite weeks and weeks of pre-invasion bombardment by air and sea. Not once have I been able to spot intel to show that the CD unit has been attacked and some guns damaged / destroyed. I recognise that the "strongest" unit is the one that gets bombed but it is a little disappointing when bombers are picking on ENG units to see most of my APs severly damaged with loss of LCU strength (thus scuppering my long term plans!) with the message "387 coastal gunshots fired in defence".

Despite being in Nov '42 of my first campaign game and still in learning mode, I think I pretty much get it but the consistent spanking from CD units is affecting my sanity and ability to mount rapid amphibious operations, i.e. I quickly run out of undamaged APs.

Looking forward to some wisdom. Another year of playing and, you never know, I could be ready for a PBEM game. I'd probably need to give up work before that though as things get a little time-consuming.


Mikey.

You have to set your bombers on port attack. It appears you have them set to ground attack and that won't do anything to take out coastal guns. It will however disrupt base forces and artillery units which can play havoc with your troops coming ashore. Best stategy is to bomb (with bombers set to port attack) and bombard the island. Your bombardment fleets will give you some idea of the strength of the coastal guns remaining. A couple or three days before the attack switch to ground attack with your bombers to try and raise disruption and suppress some of the other. If you are playing PBEM you will be telegraphing exactly when your assualt will take place but if you are playing the Allies this probably isn't a problem.

If there are a lot of coastal guns and lots of supply (note the AI will never run out of supply when set to very hard) then coastal guns may be repaired and the best you ever may do is deminish their effects somewhat.

[Nikademus]

Try this:

form a transport TF....load up. After loading up, change mission to Escort TF and transfer BB's and CA's to the formation. These units will close support your landing and fire back on the CD's. They can seriously reduce your casualties and do harm to them in return.

prepping the target beforehand with generous air attacks also helps. disruption greatly reduces LCU battery effectiveness.

[niceguy2005]

Sir Nik, [;)] would not putting BBs in a transport TF be gamey? Is there historical basis for that?

[Nikademus]

historical basis?

sure.....close support missions. Saipan....Normandy, Iwo Jima, Okinawa....etc. "Bombardment missions" are more designed for shoot and scoot (though you can have the TF 'stick around' by setting it to no retire.) Close support missions have the warships standing by to fire support the troops and protect the transports.

[Feinder]

ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker

It is very difficult to not get spanked by CD units because of the way the game is designed (All guns from the entire 60 mile hex, including mortars, get to fire on your ships as if they were dedicated naval rifles with director control and the guns fire not only on your troops landing but on the landing ships far out off shore . Isolation of the enemy base to starve it is recommended but not always possible. Heavy pre invasion bombardments are a must, but placing armoured ships like cruisers and battleships in your invasion TFs is crucial to absorb alot of the fire and to suppress the CD unit during the CD fire phase. (apparently fire support ships do this but this may not be working as well as intended) Lastly,keep the number of amphibious TFs to a minimum as CD units, like everything else, don't seem to have any limit on the number of actions they can perform in a phase. (ie, a CD unit will fire 10 times if you have ten TFs landing troops or just once if you have one TF).

Not entirely true Ron. Only guns of type DP or Naval gun will fire consistantly at Naval ships during bombardment/invasion. Guns of type AA -may- fire, but they must have sufficient range (which they rarely do). Guns of type "Army Gun" will -not- fire at ships at all (which includes mortars, unless it's specifically a CD mortar). They will shoot at enemy troops and cause diablements to the troops, but "Army Gun" type weapons most certainly do NOT fire at ships.

-F-

[Xargun]

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

Try this:

form a transport TF....load up. After loading up, change mission to Escort TF and transfer BB's and CA's to the formation. These units will close support your landing and fire back on the CD's. They can seriously reduce your casualties and do harm to them in return.

prepping the target beforehand with generous air attacks also helps. disruption greatly reduces LCU battery effectiveness.

Ahhh.. thanks Nik... I couldn't think of a way to get those battlewagons into the invasion TFs myself.. I also put 2-4 CAs in there for fire support and return fire absorption... Now my BBs can be useful again..

But like they said, put some heavy guns in the TFs to provide what I call counter-battery fire. They may not 'kill' the CD guns, but they can suppress them while your ships unload.

And make sure you send in bombers to attack the port. Port attacks will target Engineering units and CD Defense units - not combat units.. SO when you see guns damaged they are either AA or CDs.. Both are good to kill before an invasion. And as japan, try to use DBs, as they seem more accurate at this to me then level bombers.

Xargun